Pop can't coach backup point guards

[Trimble87]

Timvp, I generally share your opinions and takes, but I disagree on this one. At the least, it's too early to say that.

IMO Pop is still in an experimenting mode and unlike in previous seasons I don't think he's already got a set in stone view for the playoff rotation. This could be a good or a bad thing, I can't really say,but we're seeing a lot of unorthodox decision making from Pop right now.

Pop has stated several times in interviews that he is still feeling out the rotation and experimenting with different looks. Its very late in the season for us to be trying out new lineups, but Pop hasnt found what hes looking for yet. I wouldnt get too worried unless this trend continues.

Hills play has been down recently, and that combined with Pop tinkering with the rotations has caused his minutes to drop. However when Hill has been in the games he's looked sharp and ready to play.

Heres to Hill being the backup pg for the foreseeable future

[MarHill]

And AJ knew his role and executed it.

Pop expects all players to do so. It hasn't just been veteran point guards who've found their way out of SA quickly because they couldn't learn their role. Mercer and Mohammed come to mind right off the top, in addition to the veteran points mentioned above.

This is why Pop sticks with players like Finley. He knows his role and Pop can count on him executing it. To Pop that is paramount.

The Spurs let AD go even though he was best buds or whatever with Duncan.

I would agree with that, Marcus!

I had to think about Timvp's post for a few minutes before I decide to respond.

However, he may have a point and like all people we have blind spots. And the back-up PG may be a blind spot for Pop.

Moreover, I think it's too early to tell about Hill. He probably has hit the rookie wall and it's very difficult on the NBA level to play PG when you have been a SG in college.

The Timberwolves tried that with Foye and it didn't work and McHale had the good sense to move Foye back to SG and he has played much better.

Plus, Hill did play well early in the season when TP was out. Still, I think Hill will be on the floor during the playoffs because of his defense.

I do think he needs to continue to work is his agressiveness and finishing at the rim. Those things along with his defense will keep him in the Spurs' rotation for awhile.

A good topic.....there are several answers that could be posted from it.

[rogcl1]

First of all let me say that I do not believe that Pop does no wrong, but he is at this point playing to win a championship. That eliminates many players right off the bat. There is a certain amount of mental toughness required to play anything close to winning or championsip ball. Yes ,this I believe can be deveolped and built on to a degree but basically if one is not able to withstand the heat and do what is expected of them and unable to compete and earn minutes in a championship environment then I believe you have what would be Beno being unable to get the ball past halfcourt against the Piston's trap. Pop was not guarding Beno the Pistons were. Pop I believe prepares his players to be successful in compe ive situations. Yes, some can't hack it. Point guard is a tough position, backup point guard harder yet.

Kerr? I did not follow Kerr all that much before the Bulls but I believe he flourished there as an off the ball shooter with the ball in Jordan's or Pippen's hands. It was painful to watch him bring the ball up the court here but again I thought his success here was as an off the ball shooter.No defense either.

Ward? Washed up upon arrival.

Speedy Claxton probably was the best when healthy but he also got hot at good moments. But remember after his limited succes here he chose to cash in for $ which you can't fault him. How did all that work out for im other than the $?

Stoudamire and Van Excel washed up before arrival.Also no defense. I think both brought the hope of giving a different look to spread the floor and give defenses a different look than the collapse on Parker scheme that will be seen from the Lakers.I do agree Stoudamire appeared to be distributing and fitting in but I think he was wanted for more outside shooting to spread the floor. JV can distribute but he also plays better D than both.. Both Van Excel and Stoudamire showed they no longer had the scoring threat that was desired.

As for Hill I believe Pop actually likes him. I think Hill's lack of aggressiveness probably has cost him some time . I believe Pop wants to have seen all his options before the playoffs start. Hill certainly earned some trust in certain situations with his play Sunday.I actually think Pop is being careful with Hill and trying to find situations where he will be successful. Hey, he is a rookie on a team playing for a championship.

I am not sure how the Mason at point experiment will work out but now is the time to find out. He offers the potential floor spreader at the point that Stoudamire and Van Excel failed to provide.This could be huge if Gooden and Duncan mesh well together. If he is able to handle the job it can help keep pressure off a promising rookie and allow Hill to do what he did Sunday in given situations .It also could put pressure on the defenses to change their focus from the collapse on Tony and a penetrating Hill scheme.(If he is even being aggressive). A slashing Hill basically keeps the defense in the same mode and he has not yet in my view shown the willingness to keep the defense honest with his shooting.I trust Pop on this .
PS- I think Finley has a role but I also want to throw my worn out canvas converse at him on the TV sometimes.

Anyway, good topic, tough position to play and to manage.I always enjoy reading your posts TIMVP but I think if you will exhale ,this situation will take care of itself. I think Hill is here to stay .

[kace]

Pop is doing what he has often done with rookies, nothing against backup PG or against Hill. how many decent rookie were put on the bench on their first year with the spurs ? nothing new here from Pop.

Hill is great and i think and hope he will be usefull for us. but :

1. Pop usually doesn't trust easily rookies
2. Hill's offense is still raw and poor (especially his drive to the rim)
3. his great defensive skills doesn't always prevent him for being destroyed on defense. he has to learn even in this area where he seems so promising.


There is probably a reasonable position between Pop's lack of trust in him because he's a rookie and Timvp seeing him as a difference maker against LA in this PO.

[MoSpur]

Should the Spurs hire Avery Johnson as a special assistant to work with Hill? Timvp is stating that maybe Pop isn't the best at coaching backup PGs or letting them develop. So why not bring someone in to help with this who use to play the position? I know AJ can be hard and it might be risky, but its just a thought.

[xtremesteven33]

If I had to guess, Bowen might not be moved to the starting lineup at all, but his minutes will increase should they meet LA in the WCF.

Like it or not, Bowen isn't capable of guarding Kobe effectively for 40 MPG like he could in 2003, you're probably getting effective defense on Kobe from him for 25-30 minutes on a good day.

Although not the same situation, this is similar to the finals last year when Pierce was clearly the best Kobe defender on Boston, but could only guard Kobe for so long before losing too much energy. Because of this, they put Ray Allen on Kobe for most of the 1st quarter knowing Kobe would go off but knowing his offense would peak early on and Pierce could shut him down in the 2nd half.

In he WCF last year, SA blew a big lead in game 1 because Kobe got better as the game went on. LA blew game 2 open because Kobe got hot in the 2nd half. My guess is Pop noticed this and that's why Bowen won't be defending Kobe early on.

Bowen may have lost a step defensively but he is still a pest and uses his "tricks" to get opponents off their game. Kobe even says that Bowen is the best defensive player he has to go up against.

With that said, Bowen is still a very vital part of this team. His defensive IQ is off the charts and not only creates havoc for the one player hes guarding but his ball deflections and rotations are what sets the tone for this team.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Bowen may have lost a step defensively but he is still a pest and uses his "tricks" to get opponents off their game. Kobe even says that Bowen is the best defensive player he has to go up against.

With that said, Bowen is still a very vital part of this team. His defensive IQ is off the charts and not only creates havoc for the one player hes guarding but his ball deflections and rotations are what sets the tone for this team.

I agree, which is why the Spurs will probably use him on Kobe more in the 2nd half because Kobe is most dangerous in the 4th quarter.

[Kill_Bill_Pana]

I like Hill he is a good player already and should improve and he has very good length and athletic ability. But he is not a real point guard either. And he is just a rookie.

[rogcl1]

Should the Spurs hire Avery Johnson as a special assistant to work with Hill? Timvp is stating that maybe Pop isn't the best at coaching backup PGs or letting them develop. So why not bring someone in to help with this who use to play the position? I know AJ can be hard and it might be risky, but its just a thought.

At least two reasons why this will not happen.
1. Avery currently is happy collecting Cuban's money for not coaching.
2.I believe Pop actually is better at dealing with his players than AJ.

[urunobili]

I'd rather see TP and Manu on the court separately as much as possible since their skills overlap so much.

EPIC Fail

They won 3 rings playing together like 30 minutes and now they overlap?

Just let your Manu hate/TP homerism go and maybe you'll understand the Spurs system better...

[Spurminator]

Should the Spurs hire Avery Johnson as a special assistant to work with Hill? Timvp is stating that maybe Pop isn't the best at coaching backup PGs or letting them develop. So why not bring someone in to help with this who use to play the position? I know AJ can be hard and it might be risky, but its just a thought.

While it's a small sample, Avery doesn't exactly have the best track record of getting the best out of PG's either...

[MoSpur]

At least two reasons why this will not happen.
1. Avery currently is happy collecting Cuban's money for not coaching.
2.I believe Pop actually is better at dealing with his players than AJ.

I seriously doubt it will happen. I am almost sure this wouldn't happen, but it was just a thought. I doubt AJ would want to come in as a special assistant.

[cherylsteele]

From what I have seen this year from Hill, he reminds me alot of Alvin Robertson when he was a rookie.
Not a great shooter, but got better as his rookie year went on.
Not a great ball handler but also go better.
Showed he had the prowess to be a great defender and this came to fruition in his 2nd year and beyond.
Hill and Alvin have very similar physical builds.
Hill is a much better ball handler than Mason. hill finishes at the rim much better, and doesn't get is shots blocked as much as Mason. Did you see the Suns back up center block Mason twice in a row, and when Mason had that break away layup, I was sure Grant hill would catch up and block that one too.

The reports I have read and such have said Hill has solid work ethic and has taken Pop criticism constructively, which indicates mental toughness, something Beno and others didn't seem to have.

[Spursfan092120]

I like Hill he is a good player already and should improve and he has very good length and athletic ability. But he is not a real point guard either. And he is just a rookie.

Umm...what? Please explain how he's not a real point guard.

[ALAMO-DEFENSE]

George Hill has a cheetah body. Please, can anyone put a cheetah pic vs. a George Hill pic ?

[alchemist]

He's a Really Really undersized 2 who Pop is trying to make him transition to the 1 where he will be an oversized 1.

exactly.

Another thing is that while Hill was the primary PG role he basically stood around the 3pt line dribbling not doing a damn thing. If Pop wants to convert a SG into a PG he needs Parker to take him under his wing to work with him. Last I heard it was Mason who took Hill under his wing.

[024]

to be fair, hill has been playing like crap lately. he's gotten plenty of chances at the first half of the season. popovich even gave him the starting point guard position when parker was out instead of giving it to vaughn. the only DNPs hill recieved were the first two games of the season. for a rookie drafted in the late round, that is pretty extraordinary.

popovich is thinking ahead. he already recognizes that hill is a rookie after all and probably should not be trusted too much during the playoffs, especially handling the ball at point. so pop is experimenting with different combinations to see if hill can be utilized effectively or if he needs to be benched for the entire playoffs. hill is still a rookie and has been given plenty of opportunities to demonstrate his effectiveness. i think the turning point was the nuggets game where he performed pretty poorly with the big 3 + finley out. hill will be better next year.

[ploto]

Steve Kerr was not past his prime when he joined the Spurs in 1999. He was 33 years old. His first time with the Spurs was painful to watch and he only regained his career through his time in Portland. His heroics in Dallas during his second stint were a direct result of his time in Portland not in San Antonio. And Remember, he only even played in that game bacause Tony got so sick.

Anthony Carter was declared useless and bought out by the Spurs 2003 and he is still playing in 2009 in the NBA logging 24 MPG.

Where is the thread saying Pop can't coach big men not named Duncan and Robinson? There has been just as much of a turnstile for those guys as for back-up PG's. Rasho-Nazr-Butler-Elson-Oberto-Bonner-Thomas. Maybe Pop simply can't coach average players.

[Kill_Bill_Pana]

Umm...what? Please explain how he's not a real point guard.

What? Is this not obvious by see him play?

[rogcl1]

Steve Kerr was not past his prime when he joined the Spurs in 1999. He was 33 years old. His first time with the Spurs was painful to watch and he only regained his career through his time in Portland. His heroics in Dallas during his second stint were a direct result of his time in Portland not in San Antonio. And Remember, he only even played in that game bacause Tony got so sick.

Anthony Carter was declared useless and bought out by the Spurs 2003 and he is still playing in 2009 in the NBA logging 24 MPG.

Where is the thread saying Pop can't coach big men not named Duncan and Robinson? There has been just as much of a turnstile for those guys as for back-up PG's. Rasho-Nazr-Butler-Elson-Oberto-Bonner-Thomas. Maybe Pop simply can't coach average players.

Honestly, I have not kept up with Rasho since he left but I do not think the highlight reels are filled with clips of Rasho since he left. And just how much have Nazr, Elson , and Butler starred since they left here?

[Marcus Bryant]

Steve Kerr was not past his prime when he joined the Spurs in 1999. He was 33 years old. His first time with the Spurs was painful to watch and he only regained his career through his time in Portland. His heroics in Dallas during his second stint were a direct result of his time in Portland not in San Antonio. And Remember, he only even played in that game bacause Tony got so sick.

Anthony Carter was declared useless and bought out by the Spurs 2003 and he is still playing in 2009 in the NBA logging 24 MPG.

Where is the thread saying Pop can't coach big men not named Duncan and Robinson? There has been just as much of a turnstile for those guys as for back-up PG's. Rasho-Nazr-Butler-Elson-Oberto-Bonner-Thomas. Maybe Pop simply can't coach average players.

Carter did something else to piss off the Spurs.

[urunobili]

Carter did something else to piss off the Spurs.

sorry that i don;t know already MB... but can you share what that was?

[Fabbs]

Steve Kerr was not past his prime when he joined the Spurs in 1999. He was 33 years old. His first time with the Spurs was painful to watch and he only regained his career through his time in Portland. His heroics in Dallas during his second stint were a direct result of his time in Portland not in San Antonio. And Remember, he only even played in that game bacause Tony got so sick.

Remember it well Ploto. Gm 6 with Dallas set to tie it up at 3-3. Poppy was beyond clueless, he had NO intention of playing Kerr. Not only did Tony go out, Speedy got injured too or was just sucking. Kerr absolutely positively saved that game not only with his 4-4 treys but great feeds into Duncan and a very timely steal.

[urunobili]

Remember it well Ploto. Gm 6 with Dallas set to tie it up at 3-3. Poppy was beyond clueless, he had NO intention of playing Kerr. Not only did Tony go out, Speedy got injured too or was just sucking. Kerr absolutely positively saved that game not only with his 4-4 treys but great feeds into Duncan and a very timely steal.

The trey were Key.. but Jax and Manu were key for the 20-2 run.. and i would say AS KEY AS Kerr...
Manu had a trey some FT's and a basket and Jax had 2 trey himself...

[Fabbs]

Watch the game on DVD. Several of the treys by Jax-Manu were on great assists by Kerr.

Yeah Jax and Manu were keys too. This thread is about the pg tho.
63-48 ass kicking with only 2:55 left in the 3rd qtr before Kerr went in.

90-78 win. Kerr played 13 minutes. Anyone got the + - on that day?