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You call yourself a Spurs fan? What a troll...
Hard to win a le with mediocre talent so no loss with the Beno trade, except that we could have used his overratedness to get a good player in return (but he wasn't overrated until he went to Sacramento).
Hedo wanted too much money. We could afford a Roger Mason, Oberto and a Udoka for that price tag. With a team as poor as the Spurs, you have to go for the best deals sometimes.
Scola- a nightmare. To think they actually felt Oberto=Scola.
Jackson- too much money, but boy he would have come in handy over the last few years.
Come back and complain about the moves when one of those guys wins a championship for another team.
You call yourself a Spurs fan? What a troll...
Karl Malone - 0 les
Kevin Garnett - 1 le
Charles Barkley- 0 les
Patrick Ewing- 0 les
You fail.
Considering 3 of those guys played in the era Jordan played in. I understand why they would fail. Duncan would have too.
As for Garnett. He's overrated and shouldn't be put in that group.
I've been saying this for years. The Spurs' FO can't draft at all. They haven't made a decent draft-day decision since they picked Tony Parker. George Hill? Are you effing kidding me? If they wanted a backup PG they should have taken Mario Chalmers.
Assuming Jordan didn't exist:
Malone - 2 les
Ewing - 1 le
Barkley - 1 le
4 les = exceptional
He's saying that winning 4 les with a player of Tim Duncan's magnitude (argueably the top PF of all time) makes it less of an accomplishment on the front office's part, and is more of a testament to his greatness.
Had the front office been better or more astute at drafting, Timmy might have 6 rings.
Other than TP and Manu who have the Spurs found during TD's career...
When you do luck out and have a player for the ages, you want to do right by him, surround him with the best talent available..
Instead of abusing him by trying to get by on his talent alone, thus shortening his career because he's had to shoulder such a heavy load.
The Front office has done well without paying exhorbitive amounts of money. But they are not without fault.
Maybe they could have bit the bullet on Sjackson and we wouldn't be still pining for an athletic, defensively capable 3.. five years later.
-personally i am so happy and grateful that we've had a chance every year since TD started playing for us, and even with a few FO hiccups, barring a couple injuries and a meltdown against the Lakers and we very well could have 7 championship banners! Spurs fans are spoiled.
Last edited by Yuixafun; 03-30-2009 at 05:26 PM.
Jax is the only player that ranks on my list as one that I truly wish would've worked out. The fact that he got away is no fault of theirs. Yet, the fact that the Spurs have not been adequately been able to replace him with any player or combination of players with his requisite size, skills, talent and moxie is unfortunate. Spurs win 2 more les with him in the fold. No doubt.
Jax's absence is made even more glaring because the FO has not developed a true SF during the 5 years since he left the building. This is significant because now Bowen and Finley, while still productive, yet both are 36+ and have declined considerably. Meanwhile, Udoka has heart, but is limited in his skill set. In my mind, the FO ignored this position and waited too long to address it. At a position that houses some of the most talented and most feared athletes in the league, you simply cannot continue to trot out old guys or guys that have limited, athletic skill sets. For that, the FO should be criticized.
Overall, I commend the FO for going about the impossible task of keeping the team fiscally sound, yet still winning les along the way. A good example of the benefits of that fiscal responsibility is the acquisition of Drew Gooden. Had the Spurs been frivolous and had blown all of their MLE this summer (like Dallas did), they would never have been in a position to obtain him, without having to dump salary or exceed the cap to do it.
The FO has a proven track record of success and their body of work is such that they should be roundly commended. However, sometimes that success can be attributed to just dumb luck, as Pop likes to say. Like their ill-fated pursuit of Jason Kidd and him electing not to come to the Spurs. Or the NBA Lottery ping pong balls coming up in your favor (twice in 10 years) and thus enabling the team to draft, not one, but two franchise centers. Those are not good front office decisions, just dumb luck. Nothing more. Nothing less.
Last edited by SenorSpur; 03-30-2009 at 05:49 PM.
Grats on 7777 ^^
Go buy a lotto ticket.
And a good post to boot.
Jax swagger is what I miss most.
The reality is most franchises with "talent" are people that overspend on the mid-level (talent has name, but skills don't match the paycheck), pay a high luxury tax, and don't win championships.
What team front office is good at drafting/making basketball decisions? And where are their championships to prove it?
And what team other than the Spurs is a le contender each year and not paying the luxury tax?
We have to play by the economic rules. We win and we do it under the luxury tax.
Other teams, like the Mavs and Lakers pay the luxury tax and have no championships to show for it. (By Lakers, I mean last year they were over the cap and didn't win a championship. We'll see what they do this year.).
my popint is that we were in position to have a much better team than we have now...we let go players thinking they were trash when they weren't.
and if you judge hedo's 2004 chokage against the lakers as the reason he shoudl have been booted, then we would have no one from that team on the roster in 05...
i knew watching hedo that year thet he was a very valuable piece...but everyone bagged on him...same with beno...heck...he even plays better defense than parker...so that's no excuse for keeping him out of the lineup...
no one is asking pops to score 20/10...but he brings a spark that we dont get from out bigmen...dont play that sour grapes game with me...
I think if Duncan could have magically been added to the Spurs roster back in 91 or 92, I believe the Spurs would have taken a few of the rings that Jordan won. Robinson and Duncan together in both of their primes would have been strong. The Rockets would never have won either.
The wild card though is coaching staff was weak post-Larry Brown and pre-Popovich. So maybe not.
91/92 Brown was replaced mid-season by Bob Bass
92/93 The Tark era begins and is quickly supplanted by John Lucas
93/94 More Lucas
95/95 Bob Hill shows up and stays until the 96/97 season
Unless Larry Brown changed his mind and stayed, maybe there would be no rings in the Jordan era for the Spurs even if Duncan had joined the team back then.
People forget that organizational stability is as important as making sound personnel decisions. Look no further than the Phoenix Suns and their idiotic, chicken-fried owner as a model of how NOT to run your organization.
People are saying they want SJax on our team?
The same guy that's leading the league in turnovers this year?
Yeah, that's what we want. :eyeroll
Golden states a mess.
If he was on this Spurs team, with 4 more years of tutelage under Pop, Duncan as his captain, and Manu, Tony, Bowen as his role models so to speak, surrounded by men of character and not characters...
There's no telling what type of monster he would be, with his tools developed differently and recieving better grooming as a player and a man.
You're going to point as his TO's for this season as the reason to dismiss him and make your point.
any poster asking why we let beno or hedo go must be eurotrash.
OK, name another NBA franchise/front office, who have found more than 2 all-stars of the caliber of Parker and Manu drafting in the late first and second round.
Moreso, name the players the Spurs could have drafted but decided not to, who would have made us better.
When you think of these two questions you'll understand why your point is kinda moot.
Player success and team success are two different things. Don't confuse the two. The above all are great players in their time.
The Celtics Garnett Allen and Pierce. There are more ways to build a franchise than just through the draft.
The Celtics used multiple years' worth of stockpiling lottery picked players in order to pull these trades. The Spurs, on the other hand, have never had a lottery pick since drafting Duncan.
Yeah, I guess a FO that picks up Manu Ginobili that late in the draft sucks..
see if you can follow along...
Tim Duncan Is the Greatest PF of all time
good enough that all he needs to win les is an average Front Office to put competent talent around him; but also good enough that with an ambitious and talented Front Office putting better than average talent around him, he could have 6 or 7 les by now.
But you, for some reason believe the latter to be untrue, an impossibility even, you seem believe Duncan isn't that good because he has been surrounded with the best possible talent. Or maybe you believe that there is no such thing as great Front Office management, that it's mostly a crapshoot, and as long as the FO isn't sabotaging the team, it's doing the best job possible
I'll play along, using the same logic.
Karl Malone was the greatest PF of all time before Duncan. What did he win being the one best PF the NBA had ever seen? There are a lot of other examples of course.
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