it is the truth
Gooden looks good simply because Bonner is just so bad. When Matt is not nailing treys, he's like a lamp post out there. He gets scored on, he can't rebound and he can't buy a bucket. Just wait until teams get real physical in the playoffs (like Utah/NOH/Lakers). Unless he hits anything from the perimeter it's not going to be pretty seeing him out there.The Gooden move that is most un-Spur-like is when he gets the ball about 18 feet out on the perimeter and instead of making the simple pass to run the offense, he literally dribbles down into the post to post himself up
It should be a clue that if Tim Duncan never dominates the action like that, it's not what Drew Gooden should be doing. His low basketball IQ combined with his questionable motives and ball hoggish ways can make him downright disruptive to the team, even if he's scoring well. And that's not even talking about his defensive shortcomings.
All that said, this is exactly what any person who has watched Gooden in his career should have expected. Drew Gooden is playing like Drew Gooden. But if he's used properly, he could still be an asset. Kinda like how Pop used Nazr in 2005, except a better offensive player and a worse defensive player.
Give him five minute bursts here and there where he can dominate the action. Don't expect any cohesion from him and don't expect him to do much defensively other than hopefully rebound. It's tricky but it's possible for Pop to get the good out of Gooden while living with the bad.
Like I've said the whole time, I like the idea of Gooden starting. Put him in the starting lineup and go to him early and often in both halves. That allows the Big Three to ease into the game and not have to dominate for 48 minutes. Obviously you don't want Gooden anywhere near a basketball court when the fourth quarter begins but at the beginning of both halves, he can help lessen the pressure.
Gooden off the bench just overwhelms the rest of the bench unit. It turns into Gooden vs. 5 on the offensive end. By putting him into the starting lineup, he's not going to overwhelm the better players on the team.
And finally, Gooden in the starting lineup would allow Pop to go with either Thomas or Bonner depending on what is needed. That way, it'd actually be possible to trim the bigman rotation down to three without completely taking one out of the mix.
I agree. It seems like the best way to let him do his thing, get some points on that board, and then keep him from ing us over when the going gets tough. I saw this coming, but I had faith that he'd change his black hole ways and try to be a team guy. What is funny is that he played team ball for like the first 15 seconds of his first game in a Spurs uniform. I was like wha-whaat Gooden passed the ball? Then he started chunking away.The Gooden move that is most un-Spur-like is when he gets the ball about 18 feet out on the perimeter and instead of making the simple pass to run the offense, he literally dribbles down into the post to post himself up
It should be a clue that if Tim Duncan never dominates the action like that, it's not what Drew Gooden should be doing. His low basketball IQ combined with his questionable motives and ball hoggish ways can make him downright disruptive to the team, even if he's scoring well. And that's not even talking about his defensive shortcomings.
All that said, this is exactly what any person who has watched Gooden in his career should have expected. Drew Gooden is playing like Drew Gooden. But if he's used properly, he could still be an asset. Kinda like how Pop used Nazr in 2005, except a better offensive player and a worse defensive player.
Give him five minute bursts here and there where he can dominate the action. Don't expect any cohesion from him and don't expect him to do much defensively other than hopefully rebound. It's tricky but it's possible for Pop to get the good out of Gooden while living with the bad.
Like I've said the whole time, I like the idea of Gooden starting. Put him in the starting lineup and go to him early and often in both halves. That allows the Big Three to ease into the game and not have to dominate for 48 minutes. Obviously you don't want Gooden anywhere near a basketball court when the fourth quarter begins but at the beginning of both halves, he can help lessen the pressure.
Gooden off the bench just overwhelms the rest of the bench unit. It turns into Gooden vs. 5 on the offensive end. By putting him into the starting lineup, he's not going to overwhelm the better players on the team.
And finally, Gooden in the starting lineup would allow Pop to go with either Thomas or Bonner depending on what is needed. That way, it'd actually be possible to trim the bigman rotation down to three without completely taking one out of the mix.
That would mean Gooden goes up against a starting caliber PF on the defensive end. Say what you want about Bonner at least he tries. I'd rather see Mase switch places with Manu, put him back his comfort zone. And Manu's off the bench again, his high bball iq ballacing out a certain someone's low bball iqThe Gooden move that is most un-Spur-like is when he gets the ball about 18 feet out on the perimeter and instead of making the simple pass to run the offense, he literally dribbles down into the post to post himself up
It should be a clue that if Tim Duncan never dominates the action like that, it's not what Drew Gooden should be doing. His low basketball IQ combined with his questionable motives and ball hoggish ways can make him downright disruptive to the team, even if he's scoring well. And that's not even talking about his defensive shortcomings.
All that said, this is exactly what any person who has watched Gooden in his career should have expected. Drew Gooden is playing like Drew Gooden. But if he's used properly, he could still be an asset. Kinda like how Pop used Nazr in 2005, except a better offensive player and a worse defensive player.
Give him five minute bursts here and there where he can dominate the action. Don't expect any cohesion from him and don't expect him to do much defensively other than hopefully rebound. It's tricky but it's possible for Pop to get the good out of Gooden while living with the bad.
Like I've said the whole time, I like the idea of Gooden starting. Put him in the starting lineup and go to him early and often in both halves. That allows the Big Three to ease into the game and not have to dominate for 48 minutes. Obviously you don't want Gooden anywhere near a basketball court when the fourth quarter begins but at the beginning of both halves, he can help lessen the pressure.
Gooden off the bench just overwhelms the rest of the bench unit. It turns into Gooden vs. 5 on the offensive end. By putting him into the starting lineup, he's not going to overwhelm the better players on the team.
And finally, Gooden in the starting lineup would allow Pop to go with either Thomas or Bonner depending on what is needed. That way, it'd actually be possible to trim the bigman rotation down to three without completely taking one out of the mix.
I don't know if I agree about Gooden looking good. His stats look good, though.
The Cavs were the best defensive team in the league in one of those years Gooden started. It's possible to scheme around his weaknesses. But Pop would have to actively put him in positions that his basketball IQ can handle ... like Mike Brown used to do.
You know what I mean. A big grabbing boards not named Tim Duncan or Kurt Thomas. I mean, that's why you play a big in the first place, right? Because I think we both agree that defensively between Gooden and Bonner it's a wash.
honestly, Gooden IS a ballhog..but I think it's something we actually need on this team right now..
we have a bunch of role players that have no balls and can't create shots on their own..I'd actually be surprised if Pop isn't telling Gooden to put up shots every time he touches it, just like he tells Bonner and Mason..
it's not like the rest of the team is playing any better as a team..
Gooden is what he is..
it would be different if we actually had other options..but Mason has lost his confidence, Hill isn't playing, Jacque has no talent at all, Ime has even less talent, Bonner is too inconsistent with his shooting and aggressiveness..
it possible to scheme but probably difficult this late in the season
yeah i realized the idiocy of that statement so i changed it
I dont mind him being a ballhog....its good to see a spurs player whos not afraid to shoot the ball. I get damn tired of seeing Spurs players pass the ball so damn much
Haven't read much of this thread other than the OP, but I'll throw in some thoughts of my own from this game.
1. Manu Ginobili simply wasn't Manu Ginobili in this game. He drove to the hoop once or twice, but for the most part he just fell in love with the 3-pointer, which is hard to explain because it wasn't going in.
2. Speaking of 3-pointers, the Spurs have to rediscover how to get more open 3-pointers in rhythm. I think part of the reason the Spurs have gone on a major 3-point drought is because they're settling for 3's as an almost-conscious team decision, instead of getting the very best ones in the flow of the offense. The only player who was in rhythm with 3's today was Matt Bonner, and he took himself out of the game with foul trouble.
3. Finley can't guard LeBron. But we knew this already.
4. Related to #3, how obvious is Bowen on LeBron and Hill on Mo Williams? Am I over simplifying things?
5. I know most of you have been saying this for weeks, but now that Pop has tried every rotation under the sun, it's time to go back to what works. We saw a period of times when things were just clicking, and they looked like this:
-Roger Mason at the starting 2 guard, and only the starting 2 guard.
-George Hill at the backup point guard, and in key defensive situations.
-Manu Ginobili coming off the bench.
-Gooden in when you need low-post offense when Timmy's on the bench. Kurt Thomas in when you need defense. Bonner in when you need to spread the floor. It's not that complicated.
The spurs did a good job in the game against the Cavs which are the league's leader in season records. Lebron is just a beast that no one can stop, it's not a big shame for our defense to let him drop 38pts, i mean even Bruce Bowen still wouldn't be able to make any difference. Pop still has plenty of time to spend making stategies aimed at Lebron and his cavs as the spurs won't face the cavs until the finals, provided the spurs will get there.
Mostly agree, and I would add that more Bowen and less Finley when you need to defend a star player, and enough of the Vaughn/Udoka experiments out there, specially JV.
Oh, and even some of Pop's minor coaching decisions today were odd. For example, the first quarter when Finley was on LeBron, the Spurs were hedging all screens. Then, when Bowen came in to guard LeBron, they decided to switch on all screens. Is it just me, or is that completely backwards?
The Spurs would first have to figure out Kobe Bryant.
Good point. And you are going to send double-teams at LeBron when Bowen is guarding him but play LeBron one-on-one when Finley is guarding him. Really, Pop?
I mean, really?
Seriously?
little things like what timvp and lurker posted are why I'm STILL confused about this season..I can't wait until the playoffs come, and we can see what Pop will do..he MUST have SOME kind of plan..
Did LBJ post up much in this game? I saw a nice fadeaway he hit in the first quarter after posting up Finley in the highlights. Were there anymore?
Last edited by KidCongo; 04-06-2009 at 01:19 AM.
Naw, that was it. You know LeBron was feeling good going up against Finley when he started going to his non-existent post up game
ITS OVER NBA!Naw, that was it. You know LeBron was feeling good going up against Finley when he started going to his non-existent post up game
Gooden is a jumbo sized AJ Abrams. As a Texas fan, I can't bear to watch this any longer.
Occam's Razor: Pop thinks Finley is Bowen and Bowen is Finley.Good point. And you are going to send double-teams at LeBron when Bowen is guarding him but play LeBron one-on-one when Finley is guarding him. Really, Pop?
I mean, really?
Seriously?
Good point. And you are going to send double-teams at LeBron when Bowen is guarding him but play LeBron one-on-one when Finley is guarding him. Really, Pop?
I mean, really?
Seriously?
The producer of sports at News4 told me that Bruce Bowen and Michael Finley are exactly the same Defensively. That there is no difference in either of them, on defense. That Bruce is old and doesn't have it anymore at all.
You gotta be ing kidding me.
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