Kendrick Perkins: "Rose will never have another game like that against us."

[Spur-Addict]

Good players can win 41 games and make it to the Playoffs.

T-Mac has won multiple games in the Playoffs, but he's not a winner either.

After a while you must progress in your winning. He has not. They are not comparable because of the disparity in comparison in time spent in this league. Try again.

[Allanon]

First off, anyone can critique any premise in your argument. It is not cherry picking, it is basic ways of arguing.

Yes, it is cherry-picking. Simply picking out statements without context is cherry-picking.

Second, he led his team to the playoffs in his first year despite the rookie adversities. By making the playoffs, he is already a winner. There are several teams at home watching these playoffs. Those teams are losers.

He led his team to the Playoffs in his rookie year. Good for him. Doesn't make him as good as CP3/Tony Parker/DWill.

Third, he is already making a good showing in this here first round. So premise three and premise four is garbage. If we are going to put expectations such as championship hopes, and le contention on him in year one, someone is being quite unreasonable.

No, no need for championship hopes or le contention. We're comparing him to DWill/CP3/Tony Parker. They've all won a Playoff series.

Derrick Rose has not won anything. T-Mac also never got out of the first round, nobody considers him a winner.

People are trying to call him the best point guard in the NBA and he hasn't even won a Playoff series yet.

We know what will come next. "Well he hasn't won a playoff series. When he does that i'll call him a winner". You can change what a winner is by upping the level of winner all you want to. But a low winner is still a winner. He is better than all of those players as a rookie.

If Chicago wins this playoff series, you will look even more of a fool. It's ok, it'll be alright.

Let's wait for DRose to win SOMETHING before comparing him to CP3/DWill/Tony Parker, please.

If Derrick Rose does win this series, I'm a total fool. If not, I am right, yet again.

As far as your predictions go, they are not even worth talking about as anyone can say anything about the future. It's a bunch of crystal ball educated guessing.

Yes, it is. I'm cool with people thinking Derrick Rose may become great, I don't think so, but it's cool.

But comparing him to CP3/DWill/Tony Parker right now is damned crazy, and you're better than that Spurs-Addict.

[Tacker]

Does that make Lebron James a loser? He has gotten past the first round, but never won a championship? Why is passing the first round the criteria you chose in determining who is and is not a winner? Why not the second round or the conference finals or even an NBA Championship?

[Allanon]

So Wilt was a loser?

Wilt got out of the first round.

[Allanon]

Does that make Lebron James a loser? He has gotten past the first round, but never won a championship? Why is passing the first round the criteria you chose in determining who is and is not a winner? Why not the second round or the conference finals or even an NBA Championship?

Because Derrick Rose has not even gotten out of the first round yet but you are already declaring him a winner.

Win something, then we'll talk about it.

[Tacker]

Because Derrick Rose has not even gotten out of the first round yet but you are already declaring him a winner.

Win something, then we'll talk about it.

Chris Paul has never got past the second round so I guess he is a loser?

[Allanon]

Lebron James has never got past the NBA Finals so I guess he is a loser?

LeBron's gotten past the first round, Derrick Rose has not. Let's not insult LeBron by comparing him to Rose.

[Tacker]

LeBron's gotten past the first round, Derrick Rose has not. Let's not insult LeBron by comparing him to Rose.

Why you say the first round, how about the second round? Has Chris Paul passed the second round? Why is passing the first round a must to be considered a winner? Why not passing the second round?

[Spur-Addict]

Yes, it is cherry-picking. Simply picking out statements without context is cherry-picking.



He led his team to the Playoffs in his rookie year. Good for him. Doesn't make him as good as CP3/Tony Parker/DWill.



No, no need for championship hopes or le contention. We're comparing him to DWill/CP3/Tony Parker. They've all won a Playoff series.

Derrick Rose has not won anything. T-Mac also never got out of the first round, nobody considers him a winner.

People are trying to call him the best point guard in the NBA and he hasn't even won a Playoff series yet.



Let's wait for DRose to win SOMETHING before comparing him to CP3/DWill/Tony Parker, please.

If Derrick Rose does win this series, I'm a total fool. If not, I am right, yet again.



Yes, it is. I'm cool with people thinking Derrick Rose may become great, I don't think so, but it's cool.

But comparing him to CP3/DWill/Tony Parker right now is damned crazy, and you're better than that Spurs-Addict.

Attacking premises is not cherry picking, but w/e.

Leading his team to the playoffs is not in regards to his level as a player, it is in regard to him being a winner. Lets try to pay attention here.

If we are going to disregard roster quality in rookie years to better suit ones argument, you can go right ahead. You can go right ahead because anyone with any sort of reasoning will point that out.

Derrick Rose is in year one. He has made step one in his maturation in being a winner. (Playoffs, winning a series, making noise, contending, winning) You cannot compare him to Tracy McGrady yet.

I never called him the best point guard in the league, I am simply making points.

If comparing point guard rookie years is crazy, I guess I am crazy.

[Allanon]

Why you say the first round, how about the second round? Has Chris Paul passed the second round? Why is passing the first round a must to be considered a winner? Why not passing the second round?

Derrick Rose hasn't even won 1 round and he's playing an injured Celtics team.

One series win, that's all I ask, those aren't lofty expectations.

[Tacker]

Derrick Rose hasn't even won 1 round and he's playing an injured Celtics team.

One series win, that's all I ask, those aren't lofty expectations.

Well I say Chris Paul is a loser because he hasnt passed the second round.

[Allanon]

Attacking premises is not cherry picking, but w/e.

That wasn't my premise that was cherry-picked. My premise is that Derrick Rose is not as good as CP3/DWill/Tony Parker. Just cherry picking out one statement without addressing the overall argument is cherry picking.

Leading his team to the playoffs is not in regards to his level as a player, it is in regard to him being a winner. Lets try to pay attention here.

If we are going to disregard roster quality in rookie years to better suit ones argument, you can go right ahead. You can go right ahead because anyone with any sort of reasoning will point that out.

I've said it before, this is a good Bulls roster. CP3/DWill/Tony Parker could get a series win out of these Bulls.

Derrick Rose is in year one. He has made step one in his maturation in being a winner. (Playoffs, winning a series, making noise, contending, winning) You cannot compare him to Tracy McGrady yet.

I never called him the best point guard in the league, I am simply making points.

If comparing point guard rookie years is crazy, I guess I am crazy.

You're not crazy, you missed the original argument back in November "Derrick Rose is just as good as CP3/DWill/Tony Parker...RIGHT NOW"

I didn't agree with it and became a "Derrick Rose hater"

[Tacker]

That wasn't my premise that was cherry-picked. My premise is that Derrick Rose is not as good as CP3/DWill/Tony Parker. Just cherry picking out one statement without addressing the overall argument is cherry picking.



I've said it before, this is a good Bulls roster. CP3/DWill/Tony Parker could get a series win out of these Bulls.



You're not crazy, you missed the original argument back in Novembers "Derrick Rose is just as good as CP3/DWill/Tony Parker...RIGHT NOW"

I didn't agree with it and became a "Derrick Rose hater"

I nor do I think Spurs-addict believes that Rose is as good as CP3/DWILL/Tony Parker, so why are you making us argue with that statement. You should be presenting that argument to those who Believe Rose is better than those 3 stooges.

[Allanon]

I nor do I think Spurs-addict believes that Rose is as good as CP3/DWILL/Tony Parker, so why are you making us argue with that statement. You should be presenting that argument to those who Believe Rose is better than those 3 stooges.

Well, that there is my argument. I said Rose wasn't as good as those 3 and this is how it all started.

What is your argument then?

[Joey Whelan]

I nor do I think Spurs-addict believes that Rose is as good as CP3/DWILL/Tony Parker, so why are you making us argue with that statement. You should be presenting that argument to those who Believe Rose is better than those 3 stooges.

Wait....this looks pretty familiar.

[Tacker]

Well, that there is my argument. I said Rose wasn't as good as those 3 and this is how it all started.

What is your argument then?

You can't simply classify someone as a winner or loser based on the outcome of the first round of the playoffs.

[IronMexican]

Allanon reminds me of whottt, in the sense that he switches sides. He sticks with his story.

[Findog]

Well, that there is my argument. I said Rose wasn't as good as those 3 and this is how it all started.

He's also a rookie,and he's put up better #s and led his team to a playoff spot and a win over the defending champs in the playoffs, something CP3 and Deron can't say.

What is your argument then?

If somebody seriously said Rose was as good right now as CP3, Deron and Parker, then fine, you win the argument for arguing the opposite. It's not a stretch to look at what he's doing now, compare it to the other guys rookie campaigns, and posit that he will be an elite PG in this league. He pretty much already is. But your argument has twisted into some amorphous "He's not a winner' crap. Win a series and he's a "winner?" Dirk Nowitzki has won 8 series, led his team within 5 minutes of a le, and you won't find many NBA fans willing to call him a winner, even though he is.

Ladies and Gentleman, sometimes you just need to admit you were wrong instead of doubling down on a dumb opinion. See Allanon, case in point.

[Allanon]

You can't simply classify someone as a winner or loser based on the outcome of the first round of the playoffs.

I've felt the same way about Rose all year long, not just for these Playoffs.

[Joey Whelan]

You can't simply classify someone as a winner or loser based on the outcome of the first round of the playoffs.

Wait....where did you find that?

[Findog]

I've felt the same way about Rose all year long, not just for these Playoffs.

Is Dirk Nowitzki a winner? He's made it out of the first round 5 times.

[Allanon]

If somebody seriously said Rose was as good right now as CP3, Deron and Parker, then fine, you win the argument for arguing the opposite.

Yup, you should read the original post.

And as of yet, Rose has proven that he is a very good player, which I said back then as well.

But he still has not won anything and should not be considered among CP3/Tony Parker/DWill right now.

[Findog]

Yup, you should read the original post.

And as of yet, Rose has proven that he is a very good player, which I said back then as well.

But he has not won anything.

41 regular season games and 1 playoff game. And I hate to break it to you, but his rep won't suffer if the Bulls fail to pull off the upset.

[Allanon]

Is Dirk Nowitzki a winner? He's made it out of the first round 5 times.

Absolutely, he's a bad mofo.

[Allanon]

41 regular season games and 1 playoff game. And I hate to break it to you, but his rep won't suffer if the Bulls fail to pull off the upset.

I don't have high expectations for him beyond being a good player. I expect a loss in this series.

Nothing different from what I've said all along.