Official Thanks for the Memories Kurt Thomas Thread

[Knoxxx]

Helpful link as usual and appreciate the comments Mel. Yeah, I am not overly concerned with what someone on a BBS thinks of me.

With regard to last summer, I did not like the contract then either. We'll see what happens this summer and next season, because I don't like it in the context of those either.

And has anyone ever assembled quite such a combination of 30+ and unathletic dudes in recent memory as the current Spurs?

As far as taking a shot at KT, it's done in good humor, I like the guy. Just not on the floor for us for more than brief of stretches.

[Mel_13]

Helpful link as usual and appreciate the comments Mel. Yeah, I am not overly concerned with what someone on a BBS thinks of me.

With regard to last summer, I did not like the contract then either. We'll see what happens this summer and next season, because I don't like it in the context of those either.

And has anyone ever assembled quite such a combination of 30+ and unathletic dudes in recent memory as the current Spurs?

As far as taking a shot at KT, it's done in good humor, I like the guy. Just not on the floor for us for more than brief of stretches.

The 2007 NBA champions were not much younger or more athletic, but did have a healthy Manu Ginobili. The Spurs have been squeezing the last drops out of this formula for several years and have now clearly reached the point where it can no longer work.

Last summer they replaced Barry, Horry, and Stoudamire with Mason, Tolliver, and Hill. This summer I expect that Vaughn, Oberto, and Udoka will be replaced with much younger players as well. With good luck Finley retires and can also be replaced. These are moves that can be made totally within existing resources with no trade partner or cap clearing needed. It is the minimum I expect this summer.

[sananspursfan21]

This is like arguing who is the tallest midget....



or who is the smartest kid with Downs Syndrome



For the Record my vote goes to Corky from Life Goes on




dudes a publish novelist

wow, what a waste of space

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Rockweed for the MLE perhaps. Bird man at the LLE.

Sorry I missed your question at first, I got worked up over the fellow that actually thought I wanted a roster with TD and 12 smurfs.

I just saw on NBA.com, article dated may 6, Wallace wants $8 million. That is not too far off from the MLE, so maybe it can work.

Update: Wallace, who becomes an unrestricted free agent this offseason, plans to retire if he doesn't receive a contract worth $8 million per season, according to Slam Online. Analysis: It's hard to imagine a team paying a 34-year-old power forward with diminishing skills a contract worth $8 million per. If Sheed lowers his demands, he could catch on with a contender, but there's a good chance we have seen the last of the outspoken big man.

So who's gonna cover the 10 or so million $ the Spurs lose if your plan is applied?

[rascal]

KT is the best big besides duncan on the roster. He played well when given the opportunity hitting the 15ft jumpshot, and getting offensive rebounds, which nobody else could do.

Thats the big problem with the spurs. If Thomas is the 2nd best big on the team there are serious upgrades needed in the frontcourt.

[rascal]

http://www.nba.com/statistics/plusmi...t=9&team=Spurs

Kurt Thomas was the worst +/- player on our roster against Dallas. I know, I know, the matchup was not right. BS. Who are we trying to match up with, an old folks home rec league team? Who can Thomas match up with in the Western Conference playoffs? Convince me on that one, I'd love to see it.

Nothing wrong with someone appreciating KT as a player or a person. Just don't live an illusion that he is still effective in the league to the tune of $4 million at age 37.

Agree. Thomas is just about finished. He is nothing more than a low end bench player now at his age and with the tight ship spurs his salary is not a bargain.

The spurs need players who can play against any opponent not old timers who can't match up with quicker, younger more athletic teams.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

KT could/should be for the Spurs what Kevin Willis was....for the Spurs. An enforcer, a strong veteran bench presence who can come in in key situations and man the middle. He'd be a perfect 3rd option for the Spurs at the 5.

Unfortunately the Spurs had no one at the center spot with any cajones who could play in front of him.

[Spursfan092120]

http://www.shamsports.com/content/pa...lay.jsp?id=323

My favorite thing about this site was the quote on top..
"They don't let many black people in the Governor's Mansion in Alabama...unless they're cleaning." Charles Barkley

[Capt Bringdown]

As for what KT "brings" and what he "does" for us, what is that exactly? Cue the usual excuses about "contributions not showing up on a stat sheet" and "bad matchups."

Kurt's an example of the Spurs decline, I agree with the OP. Sure, Kurt's a solid player and knows the system, but he doesn't make basketball plays that help us win playoff games. In a Spurs uniform, what has he done for us in the playoffs? He wasn't even able to stay on the court.

Are we so frightened of change and impotent that we can't do better than Kurt Thomas? If that's the best we can do, we're finished.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

As for what KT "brings" and what he "does" for us, what is that exactly? Cue the usual excuses about "contributions not showing up on a stat sheet" and "bad matchups."

Kurt's an example of the Spurs decline, I agree with the OP. Sure, Kurt's a solid player and knows the system, but he doesn't make basketball plays that help us win playoff games. In a Spurs uniform, what has he done for us in the playoffs? He wasn't even able to stay on the court.

Are we so frightened of change and impotent that we can't do better than Kurt Thomas? If that's the best we can do, we're finished.

How about :

1. The second best rebounder on the team ( even the best if we go strictly by stats ), so yes his contributions are reflected on the stat sheet

2. The best low post 1 on 1 defender on the team

3. The 2nd best shot blocker on the team

4. The best at setting screens on offense

5. One of the 2, or 3 at most, with a reliable midrange J

Which one of these would you argue against? Is that not enough for a back-up big man?

[Capt Bringdown]

Second best only because the other Spurs bigs are the likes of Oberto and Bonner. Oberto couldn't even get on the court, so you're really saying he's better than Bonner. Congratulations.

I'd expect that a back up big man wouldn't flunk the playoffs and actually be able stay on the court and contribute. Is that not a reasonable expectation? Or did we get him so that he could be a regular season wonder (who ain't really so wonderful)?

Haven't we given up on other players because they sucked in the playoffs? Why does KT get a free pass, and why are we so afraid of moving on?

"We can't find anyone better" is not only a lame excuse but a self-fufilling prophecy.

[NFGIII]

As stated in several ways below KT brings more than some think to the table. WHO are going to get to replace him and what PRICE?

Dallas was the worst matchup the Spurs could have gotten in the POs this year. ABSOLUTELY the worst.

So for those that want to bash him come up with viable options that can work realistically.

I want to keep KT but the Spurs need a better starting 5 and more athletic players.

He's quite good. If you let him go, you'll be hard pressed to find anyone as good. The problem is the Spurs just need other players on the roster who are more athletic. I see Bonner and Oberto as more expendable than Thomas.

Oh you can shop him, just make sure you get someone else that can do most of the things he does.

God DAMN, we got some stupid ers posting here. Nobody is going to put up big numbers opposite Tim, because Pop is ALWAYS going to rotate guys for different skills like 3 point shooting and rebounding and defense. In ten games that he started, Thomas grabbed 8.5 rebounds in 26 minutes played. That's a better rebounding rate than Tim, Amare, or Shaq. Idiot.

He's one of the best pick and pop players in the NBA. He knows the EXACT point where he needs to go to in order to set the pick for the guard or wing player that has the ball, and he knows EXACTLY the spot to go to for his shot, and he's smart enough to "roll" to the hoop for an easy layup if his defender tries to overplay him and beat him to his jumper spot. He's also a sneaky shotblocker at head height or lower, averging 0.7 in 17+ minutes.

Kurt is the best or second best rebounder of the bigs, the second best shooter behind Bonner, the best or second best pick setter, and the second best shotblocker behind Tim. Four million is not too much for a full NBA toolbox like that.

So you want to get rid of all three bigs and replace them with whom?

For how much?

[Capt Bringdown]

Actually, it's enough to express an opinion that he sucks, for me at least. Sitting around pounding the pud over "viable" options sounds like the ultimate exercise in sportsfan mental masturbation.

Fellow geeks may be impressed by the effort, but at the end of the day it's a waste of time and no more valid than simply stating your opinion about a given players value to the team.

It rather sounds like childish defensiveness really. "I didn't like the latest Starwars movie."
No, you can't say that unless you come up with a viable and finacially feasible alternative."

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Second best only because the other Spurs bigs are the likes of Oberto and Bonner. Oberto couldn't even get on the court, so you're really saying he's better than Bonner. Congratulations.

"We can't find anyone better" is not only a lame excuse but a self-fufilling prophecy.

And therein lies the problem - we need a good big man to put next to Duncan. Kurt is wonderful as 3rd or 4th big, off the bench. Nobody is saying there are no better players, but truth is we'd be hard pressed to afford to get someone better with the resources we have.

If we get rid of him, Oberto and Booner, like you suggest, presumably in a trade I suppose,then what's your idea of who we should replace them with and how? I'd be very interested to get a constructive answer, insead of the usual just-get-rid-of-<insert name here>.

[Extra Stout]

Thomas at this point would be good as a guy getting spot minutes off the bench.

The Spurs wouldn't need both Kurt Thomas and Matt Bonner on a team with an NBA-caliber frontcourt. Each would be OK as a fifth big -- it would be up to the personnel director to decide whether the fifth big needs to rebound or shoot 3's.

I have no idea how the Spurs go out and acquire the three quality big men they need in one offseason. It probably isn't going to happen. They'll be fortunate to find one decent player, and then maybe the next offseason they can bring in Tiago Splitter and somebody else. That's really the best-case scenario.

Tim will be on his own again next year.

[rascal]

And therein lies the problem - we need a good big man to put next to Duncan. Kurt is wonderful as 3rd or 4th big, off the bench. Nobody is saying there are no better players, but truth is we'd be hard pressed to afford to get someone better with the resources we have.

If we get rid of him, Oberto and Booner, like you suggest, presumably in a trade I suppose,then what's your idea of who we should replace them with and how? I'd be very interested to get a constructive answer, insead of the usual just-get-rid-of-<insert name here>.

Its the front offices job to figure out how to get the players not the posters in here and like last offseason if the front office doesn't get the front court players they failed in putting together a team good enough to win.

To say there isn't any other alternatives to acquire a big is giving the front office a free pass for failure.

[rascal]

And therein lies the problem - we need a good big man to put next to Duncan. Kurt is wonderful as 3rd or 4th big, off the bench. Nobody is saying there are no better players, but truth is we'd be hard pressed to afford to get someone better with the resources we have.

If we get rid of him, Oberto and Booner, like you suggest, presumably in a trade I suppose,then what's your idea of who we should replace them with and how? I'd be very interested to get a constructive answer, insead of the usual just-get-rid-of-<insert name here>.

Why should the spurs be hard pressed to get someone better with the resources they have? Players can be traded to open up salary to get upgraded on the front line.

[rascal]

Second best only because the other Spurs bigs are the likes of Oberto and Bonner. Oberto couldn't even get on the court, so you're really saying he's better than Bonner. Congratulations.

I'd expect that a back up big man wouldn't flunk the playoffs and actually be able stay on the court and contribute. Is that not a reasonable expectation? Or did we get him so that he could be a regular season wonder (who ain't really so wonderful)?

Haven't we given up on other players because they sucked in the playoffs? Why does KT get a free pass, and why are we so afraid of moving on?

"We can't find anyone better" is not only a lame excuse but a self-fufilling prophecy.

Good post.

How could the front office really believe they could win with the front line they had.

[Mel_13]

Why should the spurs be hard pressed to get someone better with the resources they have? Players can be traded to open up salary to get upgraded on the front line.

Please explain these magical trades that open up salary. One realistic proposal for this summer or an actual example from the past would be helpful.

[Extra Stout]

If we get rid of him, Oberto and Booner, like you suggest, presumably in a trade I suppose,then what's your idea of who we should replace them with and how? I'd be very interested to get a constructive answer, insead of the usual just-get-rid-of-<insert name here>.

Every contract on the team other than Duncan's and Parker's, and I guess Hill's, is expiring. Expiring contracts are highly desirable to teams looking to clear cap space, and to teams just looking to cut payroll. Next summer is expected to be a free-agent bumper crop, and the economy sucks, so expiring contracts are precious.

The Spurs should have plenty of ammunition to revamp the roster. Scratch that, the Spurs could hardly hope for a better opportunity to revamp the roster.

I have my doubts that they'll get anything done, however.

[rascal]

Please explain these magical trades that open up salary. One realistic proposal for this summer or an actual example from the past would be helpful.

Its the front office's job to make things happen.

The spurs should have made a strong play to get R Wallace when he was traded twice in one year but were too afraid at the time to get a disgruntled player. detroit took the chance and he helped them to a le. That is an example of a missed opportunity in the past. There will be other opportunities in the future and its the front offices job to get it done.

[Mel_13]

Its the front office's job to make things happen.

The spurs should have made a strong play to get R Wallace when he was traded twice in one year but were too afraid at the time to get a disgruntled player. detroit took the chance and he helped them to a le. That is an example of a missed opportunity in the past. There will be other opportunities in the future and its the front offices job to get it done.

Are you this guy?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yo3uxqwTxk0

[Extra Stout]

Please explain these magical trades that open up salary. One realistic proposal for this summer or an actual example from the past would be helpful.

The Spurs have something like $30 million worth of expiring contracts next year.

[Mel_13]

The Spurs have something like $30 million worth of expiring contracts next year.

I understand that. Trading those contracts will bring back similar-sized contracts in return.

Mt question was about this post:

Why should the spurs be hard pressed to get someone better with the resources they have? Players can be traded to open up salary to get upgraded on the front line.

Players may indeed be traded in moves to upgrade the team. I am not aware of the magical trades that open up salary to be used to acquire better players.

[DPG21920]

They might not open up salary for the same year, but a year in which a team plans to make improvements (2010....)