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Your sig excuses you on your comment.
Let me get this straight.
The Spurs won because they were so good and and beat people so badly, that the combined forces of the NBA, the refs, the media, and Kim Il Jong couldn't bring them down.
The Lakers won in 2000 and 2001, the Pistons won in 2004, and the Celtics won in 2008 because of the refs.
Nope, no tinfoil accoutrements on your body!
(We won't talk about 2002 and 2006.)
Your sig excuses you on your comment.
Read the Bill Simmons article on the NBA forum or on the ESPN website. He hits the nail on the head better than Aldridge can. Simmons' article actually makes much more sense.
You've been duped by the mass media. Stern does not fix everything, that is impossible and would become obvious to allt he fans. Stern spot-fixes for effect.
His first fix was game 6 of the '84 Finals.
This more or less describes my viewpoint on the whole thing. I think this was a good article by Aldridge that hits a lot of the high points, that "if the NBA is rigged, they're either doing a very subtle or very poor job of it."
However, there is a definite favoritism by the referees toward league superstars. Kobe gets away with a lot more elbows, charges, etc. than Jordan Farmar does. I don't think you necessarily have to consider this a conspiracy, though. I think it's simply human nature to give the benefit of the doubt to the player you're more familiar with, or who you perceive to have more skill. I think it's a crappy tendency that referees need to suppress at all costs, but it is what it is.
I'll never understand why folks spend money and time following a sport they "know" is fixed.
Well, it's Kim Jong-il. And he's a basketball fan? It must have been a Korean investment group that bought a minority stake in the Cavs, not Chinese. Maybe he got LeBron to the line with 0.5 seconds left at the end of Game 4
Let me get this straight.
The Spurs won because they were so good and and beat people so badly, that the combined forces of the NBA, the refs, the media, and Kim Il Jong couldn't bring them down.
The Lakers won in 2000 and 2001, the Pistons won in 2004, and the Celtics won in 2008 because of the refs.
Nope, no tinfoil accoutrements on your body!
(We won't talk about 2002 and 2006.). Also, the Lakers won in 2000, 2001, AND 2002. Did you not want to talk about 2002 because that Western Conference Finals between the Lakers and Kings was THE most poorly officiated series in recent memory? The Kings still took them to 7. The 2004 Pistons (a badass small market team) further proves my point that if you're blowing out your opponents, there is nothing that a "conspiracy" can do to keep you from winning. I guess Kim Jong-il was too busy with his nuclear missle development in 2004 to alter that series. Also, don't get me started with 2008 (the year of the two shadiest trades in NBA history). That year was knee deep in conspiracy. The refs didn't have to do anything, that Finals was pre-ordained. Boston wouldn't have even sniffed the Playoffs if Garnett wasn't handed to them by Kevin McHale (who conveniently happens to be a former Celtic). How about the Lakers getting Pau Gasol for peanuts? Both teams would still be getting ousted in the first and second rounds if it weren't for those trades. I'm sure all of the paperwork on those trades was examined very closely though.
<----- David Stern and Co. "Ok, here's the deal..."
You're missing the point that there is no room for mediocrity if you're a small market team, because you won't be getting any help from the media, refs, David Stern or Kim Jong-il. And, yes, the four championship Spurs teams were that good. I love how you completely side stepped my "Lakers vs. Lakers" comment. To not admit that there is just a hint of favoritism in the NBA is a bit ignorant on your part. Plus, the Spurs don't have to be directly involved to talk about conspiracy.
Last edited by TFloss32; 05-28-2009 at 05:31 PM.
Reply to the topic subject:
Maybe this year you ass.
Didn't seem too hard for Tim Donaghy to shave points without anyone noticing
Yeah, I sidestepped you. Just like I sidestep people who say that the moon landings were faked or that a plane didn't hit the Pentagon. Bad reffing happens all the time, every year.Well, it's Kim Jong-il. And he's a basketball fan? It must have been a Korean investment group that bought a minority stake in the Cavs, not Chinese. Maybe he got LeBron to the line with 0.5 seconds left at the end of Game 4
You're missing the point that there is no room for mediocrity if you're a small market team, because you won't be getting any help from the media, refs, David Stern or Kim Jong-il. And, yes, the four championship Spurs teams were that good. I love how you completely side stepped my "Lakers vs. Lakers" comment. To not admit that there is just a hint of favoritism in the NBA is a bit ignorant on your part. Plus, the Spurs don't have to be directly involved to talk about conspiracy.
The bottom line is, for someone to seriously believe that the league is fixed--but only in those years when his favorite team didn't win the le--is beyond pathetic.
Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go find some Reynolds Wrap. It seems somebody has gone out and bought all the stores out.
Yeah it's not conspired at all, yet someone fails to mentioning the ref who got caught up betting on games and even threw quite a few with calls I am sure! I am sure he was not alone as well. Yeah it's not rigged! No conspiracy here, turn the other cheek.
The thing is most Suns fans point out that one game in 07 when he reffed! He didn't make most of the bad calls but they point it out as to why they lost! It goes both ways.
Why would they want SA to win though? Some Suns fans call us the Sterns and others do as well, we point it at LA and other big market teams and say they get all the calls! LOL it might not be rigged afterall just some dumb azz refs here and there! Thats the just.
Yeah because Stern wanted them there so badly to ruin some ratings! Makes perfect since for money!
the theory conspiracy is lame. that doesn't mean some hyped superstars don't have some strange calls sometimes, but that's because of their hyped status, not about a conspiracy.
and you can't argue with the conspiracy theorist. if a hyped star/team wins: they say it proves they're right.
if a humble/small market star/team wins: they did that despite the conspiracy, that's how good they are.
it's just bull .
again, that doesn't mean that hyped superstars that you can see in every advertising or articles don't have some friendly calls sometimes.
My favorite part of the article is how he, himself points out he is not a credible source on this topic, saving me a long-winded rant.
BTW the tinfoil reference made me laugh too, like all the conspiracies which many have came true about the GOVT. later on is not point at all to me! Tinfoil hat people go too far sometimes yet, but to say the GOVT. is not very crooked as it is could mean the NBA and all things geared toward money can be crooked as well? I think they can, we have seen it and always will! Tinfoil my azz, thats just a word to disrcredit conspiracy heads and make them seem crazy, when half the time they are not but mainstream america will not see that.
I hate that tinfoil word alot of times, alot of times conspiracies are 100% true.
Just to let you know...
http://www.forumblueandgold.com/forum-blue/
You, once again, didn't address anything that I said, or the very valid points that I discussed which would make anyone believe that the NBA can be shady. But that's ok...and I never said the league was fixed because the Spurs or (insert your favorite team here) didn't win. The Spurs were simply not good enough to win a le this year, or the previous years in which they lost (with the exception of the whole 0.4 scandal). I already said the Spurs don't have to be directly involved to discuss this topic. Like I said in my previous post, I'm not saying there is a flat out, undeniable "conspiracy" revolving around the NBA, it's just that there is no room for mediocrity if you're a small market team. They don't create big revenue or big ratings, therefore why give them any help? Plus, you're not seeing the writing on the wall. You and I both know there is favoritism displayed to the big market teams, and the superstars on those teams (during the Playoffs, regular season, off season). Hence the "Lakers vs. Lakers" comment made by David Stern. It's been fun ShoogarBear...good luck with the shopping! And you can't see the invisible strings attached to Neil Armstrong when he's bouncing on the "moon"?
Last edited by TFloss32; 05-29-2009 at 09:02 AM.
Hi....have we met?
Thinking there's some league-wide conspiracy is asinine.
Thinking there is a conspiracy whose affect is league wide is absolutely natural, especially when obvious ref sham jobs are called out all the time, "do ented" by the casual fans here and there all around the nation in their respective forums. Indeed, it is incredibly unlikely and, to go further, seemingly unprofessional that Stern and other high ranking League officials would not formulate some plans to reward the most popular franchises for realistically keeping the League afloat. The L consistently approves the marketing of individual players and matchups (read: Kobe vs. LeBron). The L consistently shows it does not show favor towards small markets without easily hyped superstars (Joey Crawford is still a ref - had he thrown Kobe out of a game for laughing on the bench, or not called a foul for Fisher as time expires, he'd never ref junior high again). The 'team' game basketball is supposed to personify has been flushed by Stern and Co, because the 'team' game does not make you money. It's obvious in the touch fouls now called to allow one man to get to the basket at will.
Shoog, I agree with you on most things - but not this one. First of all, there doesn't have to be a conspiracy for bias to exist.
Let me get this straight.
The Spurs won because they were so good and and beat people so badly, that the combined forces of the NBA, the refs, the media, and Kim Il Jong couldn't bring them down.
The Lakers won in 2000 and 2001, the Pistons won in 2004, and the Celtics won in 2008 because of the refs.
Nope, no tinfoil accoutrements on your body!
(We won't talk about 2002 and 2006.)
Part of the Celtics re-building plan included tanking games to improve their draft for a couple of seasons. That was widely accepted even before Ryan Gomes' infamous comment to the media. Those two drafts are what allowed the Celtics to acquire Ray Allen and Kevin Garnett. It was absolute horse , and everyone knew it.
In order for the Gasol trade to work, the Lakers had to "sign and trade" Aaron McKie, sending him to Memphis as part of the deal. In order for that to be legit, the league had to pretend that it believed Memphis really had the intention of letting McKie play for them. The story was that he would be a "player coach" with Memphis. It was absolute horse , and everyone knew it.
As for the officiating? The Pistons won in 04 because they deserved it - but they had a much harder time getting past the Pacers and the Nets than they should - in no small part due to the officiating. The year before that, the Pistons got totally screwed by the refs in games 1 and 2 of the Eastern Finals. (Not to mention almost getting Game 6 of the semi-finals taken away from them.)
Last season, the Celtics might not have even made it to the finals, if not for some selective zebra vision. And the same could be said for the Lakers vs. Utah in the Western Conference semis. I'm no big Jazz fan, but I thought the refs totally jobbed them out of an opportunity to advance. In both of those series, one team could do no wrong. That may not point to a conspiracy, but it was sure as biased.
I don't even want to talk about the Spurs '06 semi-finals series against the Mavericks. But I will say that as bad as that was, the Dallas vs. Miami finals was probably worse. I'm not saying conspiracy. But bias? Damn betcha.
This year, I'm looking at some of the calls that went against the Rockets and having a hard time watching any more NBA games. I'm sick of watching the Lakers' bigs camp in the paint, and hack guys across the arms when they drive, and no whistles. I'm sick of watching Odom and Bynum "flash out" and belly-bump opposing guards damn near to the mid-court line. (And Varejao/Ilgauskas doing the same thing for Cleveland.)
And why did the league rescind Kobe's 6th technical foul? As rough as that series, and that game had been, they had every reason to T him up for the head butt. You know the answer. It got rescinded because it's Kobe. If that's not bias, what would it take?
Don't just dismiss every comment as conspiracy theory. I'm not saying that there is a wide spread conspiracy. But I don't believe that all the players and teams are being measured by the same yardstick. That's bias. And sometimes it only takes a teeny bit of that to tip a game or a series - intentional or not.
Great post GSH, totally agree.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlByV...eature=related
If you watch that video and still believe the NBA officiating isn't rigged to benefit certain teams, you need to shove a nice sharp stick up your ass and do a cannonball onto a cement slab.
Amen to that!!!
Stern is a little *** weasel
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