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If you can trade Manu and by doing so you make the team better now and also do not cripple your future, you do it. You don't just trade him for a salary cap break and hope for the best.
A haiku goes 5-7-5.
http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57088
If you can trade Manu and by doing so you make the team better now and also do not cripple your future, you do it. You don't just trade him for a salary cap break and hope for the best.
There are ramnifications with trading away Manu. If the Spurs expect to have players be loyal to them and not jump at the next big chance, they have to build a culture of loyalty. Robinson and Duncan has been largely loyal (judging by the end result), Popovich has been with the organization forever.
They have also treated their front office personnel with their interest in mind. Sam Presti, Danny Ferry, Terry Porter, Avery Johnson and Mike Brown all had a career boost from the Spurs recommendations. Even Carlisimo has gotten a second chance.
By showing the league that the organization will look out for your best interest (without being utterly stupid of course), the players would in turn look out for the interest of the organization without being totally selfish.
Derek Anderson and Stephen Jackson didn't work out, and there are bad investment that you have to get rid of, like Udrich, but overall, the Spurs have looked after their players quite well, providing them with 2nd and 3rd chances to prove themselves.
If the Spurs traded away Manu after what he has done to the franchise, a large part of this culture would be destroyed.
I disagree. Manu is a large part of this franchise's success but he is not at the superstar level of Robinson or Duncan. Trading Manu would be along the same lines of when they traded Elliott. People would be pissed but not to the level of if a Robinson or Duncan was traded. The culture of loyalty you described would take a hit but not as big of one as you might think.
No question that Manu is similar to Elliott in terms of value to the franchise. You can even argue that Elliott > Manu based strictly on the value to the franchise, but Eliott wasn't as big a part of the Spurs franchise back when he was traded, as he made most of his mark after being traded back to the Spurs. Also, trading Eliott back then created a lot of negative feedback from the fans.
Finally, Manu is all passion, he is the heart and soul. You just don't trade away your heart and soul.
You can't comapre what Elliott had done before being traded to what Manu has done.
If you're talking about emotional binding then OK.
I trust Pop's judgement.
This is something we already knew. For the Spurs to contend, they have to add to a HEALTHY Duncan, Parker & Ginobili. The elite teams are all so deep, it would do nothing to trade Ginobili for someone of equal value. That would just keep the Spurs a float, not elevate them to serious contender status.
The Spurs have to make a decent trade or FA signing and have the big 3 healthy in order to have any chance of winning #5.
I don't think Manu needs to take a paycut. He might have played for his country but that doesn't mean he hasn't given the Spurs his heart and soul. Tim played for the USA in 2003-2004. David played for the USA in 1992 and 1996, no one cared then. He has been the best deal in the NBA over the last decade. There is not a single player that is close to his talent that has been paid as little as he has.
Yep, and we'd have a couple fewer rings without him. Your boy Parker sure wouldn't have been able to carry us all those years.
STFU ducks.
Elliott had his two best scoring years immediately after the trade but his ASG appearances were split, one before and one after. And yes there was tons of negative feedback with the Elliott deal as I alluded to. The backlash over Manu would be louder because there are now more ways to communicate but I would wager that if the same options were around at the time of Sean's trade, it would be very similar and for the same reasons.
You do if you makes the team better now and doesn't cripple the future. However that being said, I don't know what kind of deal, if any, would accomplish that.Finally, Manu is all passion, he is the heart and soul. You just don't trade away your heart and soul
Actually you can, you can compare anyone.
Statistically, they are about dead even with Elliott having a very slight edge in all but 1 category.
This, however, was my point.
Finally we can put that inane idea to rest.
WTF does Tony Parker have to do with this?
The mere presence of ducks posting in the thread suggests it...
We're one season removed from Manu Ginobili being a third team All-NBA player who led his team in scoring through a strong regular season and a tough second round series against New Orleans and into the conference finals.
He has a team-favorable contract -- certainly a deal that won't allow the Spurs to get value-for-value, from a talent standpoint in a trade. Moreover, there's just no way that the Spurs can get back in such a trade anything resembling the intangible value and compe iveness that Manu has. When Kobe Bryant tells the whole world that you're a "bad man," it suggests to me at least that there's more to Manu than just talent.
That he had an injury plagued season -- one that started with him being injured as a carry over from the end of the prior season -- doesn't strike me as a particularly good reason to jettison him at this point. In fact, even at something less than 100% during 2008-09, Manu was 4th among SG in PER and 11th in the league. It's not like the guy can't play any more.
I've beena Spurs fan since the days when we were sharing the team with Dallas. At first I was just feeding the lack of professional basketball I grew to love while in school in NYC.
But the arrival of the Iceman with his wonderful offensive moves gave me a reason to stay and keep my season tickets. In every game I ever watched him play he would make some miraculous shot that was worth the price of my entertainment dollar.
When it comes down to the nitty gritty, this is all about entertainment dollars, folks. Especially in a small market where the stands have to be filled for the franchise to succeed, let alone compete.
Manu is that "seat filler" player for the Spurs. I love to watch his magic. Every game he makes the fans fell like they got their money's worth. Tim and Tony are great for stats and wonerful play, but people walk out of the arena talking about the Great Ginobilli and his daring feats.
It also doesn't hurt that with a population of Hispanics over 50%, that Manu "speaks their language" literally and figuritively: A macho guy who will take the risk (last second foul in WCF) for the love of the game and his individual pride.
Financially, it would be stupid to trade Manu. Artistically it would be boring.
It is funny that the blog notes that Popovich "cannot envision trading" Manu, but ESPN had a headline a little while ago that said something like "Popovich admits that Manu could be traded."
Exactly! You don't have to build up one player by knocking down another.
The Spurs will not trade any of the big 3. They'll roll with them for however long Duncan and Ginobli have left. After that it's rebuilding mode.
Has this link http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/s...anu_stays.html been posted from Buck Harvey?
Very interesting excerpts in there:
A team put in a call to the Spurs last season with a legitimate offer for Manu Ginobili.
“ uva player for a uva player,” is the way Gregg Popovich describes the proposal now.Could Washington have offered Caron Butler straight up for Manu?A rumor surfaced this month that the Wizards called the Spurs with an offer for him, and maybe all of this made Ginobili wonder if the ground had shifted. Asked by the Argentine press this week whether he thought he could be traded, he said “impossible” had lost a few letters.
The article has been updated since the original was posted.
I'm assuming Caron Butler is the player Pop is talking about otherwise no reason to even mention the offer.
It's possible the first offer didn't include Butler but now they are??
Regardless, it's pretty clear the Spurs won't trade him.
Antawn Jamison's number in 2008-09 was almost an exact match with Ginobili salary-wise. FWIW.
quit living in the past
manu is not the same player
keep buring your head in the sand
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