Ginobili

[Culburn369]

Just cuz I love stats...

Pau Gasol (stats averaged to 40MPG):

20.4 PPG 10.37 RPG 3.78 APG

Would you say Gasol is one of the elite players in the league?

I've caught you telling bald face lies twice already about things I've said, Shasta.

Go pound salt.

[Shastafarian]

I've caught you telling bald face lies twice already about things I've said, Shasta.

Go pound salt.

Alright why don't you explain what you meant when you said, "Duncan is now a good player. Artest is a good player."

[Culburn369]

Saying they're both "good players" isn't saying such?

Precisely.

[johngateswhiteley]

He equated their play as "good". There's a clear gap.

true and i think TD is still a great player. that being said, two players can be good and one still significantly better than the other...wait, that does sound off. the gap isn't that close, i agree.

TD = great

artest = good

[KSeal]

I'll take it...

I hated Ron that night, he was abusing Ariza and hitting every single three he took.

[Culburn369]

Alright why don't you explain what you meant when you said, "Duncan is now a good player. Artest is a good player."

I already did, balloonhead, but, you were too busy typing your response to read it.

[Shastafarian]

Precisely.

So even though you equated the level of their quality, you didn't mean to?

[Culburn369]

I hated Ron that night, he was abusing Ariza and hitting every single three he took.

Of course, he probably took the game off before the Laker game so he could rest up.

[Shastafarian]

[Culburn369]

So even though you equated the level of their quality, you didn't mean to?

Shasta, forget it, you don't want a discussion, you want revenge. Revenge for the Lakers winning the le and you stuck with a MASH unit.

Tough beans.

[johngateswhiteley]

Dominate players such as Kobe and Gasol tend to carry their skill level at least until 35 years of age.

what about Duncan?

Right now, Kobe and Gasol is the best one-two punch in the league, and have been for the past two seasons. No one is even close to that combo right now.

KG and Pierce were better last year...and showed by annihilating the lakers in the finals.

[Shastafarian]

Shasta, forget it, you don't want a discussion, you want revenge. Revenge for the Lakers winning the le and you stuck with a MASH unit.

Tough beans.

Not really. I just want to point out that you equated Ron Artest and Tim Duncan when Duncan is clearly a better player, even now. You keep dodging.

[Culburn369]

what about Duncan?

Duncan is a good player. He is no longer dominant.

Christ, take one honest look at him, John. He's deteriorated. There is prime left, but, it's not apparent at first blush. You have to watch the entire game and pick the moment.

[jack sommerset]

Mangoo is overrated in the Spews community. Bowen was worth a of lot more to the Spews then Mangoo ever was. Injuries and suspensions to other teams were a of alot more important to the Spews than Mangoo was or is. Mangoo is a wild beast that runs around like one. Thank Duncan for giving him some more room to do this. He might be a true 6th man this year for the Spews.

[Culburn369]

I just want to point out that you equated Ron Artest and Tim Duncan

Never said such.

[johngateswhiteley]

Duncan will still be an all-star at 35, just like Shaq. There is no reason why Kobe, and Gasol wont be either.

The Celtics did beat us bad, but no team has a higher winning percentage since the Lakers got Gasol.

thats fine, but the playoffs are what mattered.

on another note...artest is not shooting 47-48% next year. his career average is 42...and i bet shoots around 44.

[KSeal]

Mangoo is overrated in the Spews community. Bowen was worth a of lot more to the Spews then Mangoo ever was. Injuries and suspensions to other teams were a of alot more important to the Spews than Mangoo was or is. Mangoo is a wild beast that runs around like one. Thank Duncan for giving him some more room to do this. He might be a true 6th man this year for the Spews.

Can't put it much better then this.

[Shastafarian]

Never said such.

You did whether you intended to or not.

Aside from the BB IQ being low you just described Duncan.

Close

if you are going to argue at least do it right.

not only is the difference IQ...but TD is one of the most skilled players in the league, head and shoulders above artest.

Poppy , pure & unadulterated style.

Close again

& Artest remains a "good player"......the Duncan you accurately describe no longer draws breath on earth.

Getting there...

you didn't answer my question. further, there are very few great players in the nba...artest isn't one of them.

Neither is Duncan any longer.

Oh so close.

But, that wasn't my point, John. Viewed in a vacuum, your memory erased, blinders on, Duncan is now a good player. Artest is a good player.

There it is

[Culburn369]

There it is

Yes, they're both good players.

[johngateswhiteley]

Duncan is a good player. He is no longer dominant.

Christ, take one honest look at him, John. He's deteriorated. There is prime left, but, it's not apparent at first blush. You have to watch the entire game and pick the moment.

i don't think he is as good as he once was, never said otherwise. but don't underestimate his supporting cast making things easier for him...he wore down last year, it was as clear as day. there is less chance of that happening with this current squad, imo. and the same goes for manu.

the spurs don't need MVP duncan to win the NBA finals this year...they don't need manu in his prime either. they just need to be relatively healthy...and the odds of that are fairly good. its like that toby keith song..."i aint as good as i once was, but i'm as good once, as i ever was."

fwiw, kobe isn't what he was either...but he's still great.

[Shastafarian]

Yes, they're both good players.

Is Pau Gasol a "good" player? Or is he on a different tier?

[exstatic]

His shooting percentage will jump 7-8% playing on the best team in the league. No need for him to go one on one anymore, we have the best in the game at that.

A normal person might react like that, although I think maybe a 4% bump in FG% might be more realistic, but this IS Artest we're talking about.

[Culburn369]

i don't think he is as good as he once was, never said otherwise. but don't underestimate his supporting cast making things easier for him...he wore down last year, it was as clear as day. there is less chance of that happening with this current squad, imo. and the same goes for manu.

the spurs don't need MVP duncan to win the NBA finals this year...they don't need manu in his prime either. they just need to be relatively healthy...and the odds of that are fairly good.

fwiw, kobe isn't what he was either...but he's still great.

Your capitulation on these points is commendable.

And in the spirit you've cast I'll readily admit that yes indeed Kobe has deteriorated. To claim otherwise would be ridiculous.

[johngateswhiteley]

Your capitulation on these points is commendable.

but what did i give up?

[BadOdor]

Your capitulation on these points is commendable.

And in the spirit you've cast I'll readily admit that yes indeed Kobe has deteriorated. To claim otherwise would be ridiculous.

Indeed. However, kobe was still competing for the mvp last year, and will so again. Kobe has just the right set of skills and work ethic to be very effective for 4-6 more years.

Duncan is a different case. He has tendinitis, which will only detereiorate with time. He is slow and can't jump. He is no longer the duncan of old......and without the duncan of old, the spurs are done. In 4 years, when Duncan is retired and parker has escaped into a bigger market, they will return to obscurity.