The Sad Anniversary - Hiroshima: 64 years ago

[Cry Havoc]

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/200...years_ago.html

[blizz]

why is it sad? they started it. they were warned and did nothing about it. what's sad is the unprovoked, cowardly attack at pearl harbor. the other thing that no one talks about or realizes, is that that more people died in the fire bombings on tokyo than the bombing of hiroshima, the only difference is that this was ONE bomb and it ended the war so that's all that ever gets talked about. that was war...a war we did not start. terrible things happen in war....better them than us. that bomb saved hundreds of thousands of lives that would have ensued had that war continued and saved perhaps millions more since then.

[jaffies]

good point. I'd have to agree.

[blizz]

good point. I'd have to agree.

[Cry Havoc]

why is it sad? they started it. they were warned and did nothing about it. what's sad is the unprovoked, cowardly attack at pearl harbor. the other thing that no one talks about or realizes, is that that more people died in the fire bombings on tokyo than the bombing of hiroshima, the only difference is that this was ONE bomb and it ended the war so that's all that ever gets talked about. that was war...a war we did not start. terrible things happen in war....better them than us. that bomb saved hundreds of thousands of lives that would have ensued had that war continued and saved perhaps millions more since then.

I'm aware the firebombings killed more. But they were nowhere near as sudden or as devastating (in terms of a span of time). One instant, a city was there, the next..... practically nothing.

And I'm also aware the Japanese initiated the conflict. Should that mean I celebrate this? Hundreds of thousands of people died in a few minutes a little less than a lifetime ago. I'm sorry that I no longer see them as "the enemy". I don't blame Truman and the Manhattan Project for what they had to do, but I certainly do not relish the idea of what was done. I am no apologist for any of the atrocities the Japanese committed in that war, but in no way would I ever wish that something like that had to have taken place to end the fighting.

ANY time you remove two cities from the face of the Earth and completely scour the civilians living there, it should be a sad memory of how human ambition and greed took precedence over rationality and peace. This is not to place blame on one side or the other -- it is merely to assert the hopelessness of true peace if we consistently view people not living in our country as "them". The "other" people. They are fellow human beings, mothers, fathers, children, and as such their memory deserves to be honored. Do not think that every person in Japan was so filled with nationalistic pride that they all desired to go to war. We err when we typecast an entire region or country as a group of warmongering savages. That is never, ever the case. Many people just want to live their lives in relative freedom and happiness.

Ask any war veteran who has seen live combat, and they will tell you: There are no winners in war, only losers who lost badly and those who didn't lose as badly.

I am sad that these things were being carried out on both sides of the equation by fellow human beings. Any time you have a loss of life on that scale, it is a terrific, incomprehensible tragedy, whether it was "justified" or not.

[sonic21]

the Nagasaki one was sad, it was not necessary. They didn't wait to see if they were going to surrender after Hiroshima.

[blizz]

Those bombs did create peace, they stopped the war. Would you rather that we had invaded Japan? Seriously? Had we invaded Japan, we would have lost hundreds of thousands of soldiers and killed well over a million Japanese soldiers and civilians including men, women and children because the Japanese trained them all how to attack our soldiers. I don't give a about how sudden....or how quick the people died. Whether it was a matter of minutes or hours, dead is dead. They were warned and did nothing about it. The estimates for the fireboming of Tokyo on March 9/10 1945 put the number at up to 100,000 people killed, over 100,000 injured, over a million homeless, 16 square miles wiped out and 280,000 buildings destroyed. I'm not asking you to celebrate it, I didn't even imply it and I certainly do not see "them" as the enemy. Don't put words in my mouth. Tragic? Sure. Necessary? Definitely. It saved so many more lives, ten/twenty times more, that it took. Ask any veteran of WWII if they regret the bombing of Hiroshima. You will not find one that does.

[blizz]

the Nagasaki one was sad, it was not necessary. They didn't wait to see if they were going to surrender after Hiroshima.

After Hiroshima, Japan had three days and ignored another warning from Truman -"If they do not now accept our terms, they may expect a rain of ruin from the air the likes of which has never been seen on this earth."

Even after Nagasaki, it wasn't until the Russians invaded that Japan surrendered.

[sonic21]

After Hiroshima, Japan had three days and ignored another warning from Truman -"If they do not now accept our terms, they may expect a rain of ruin from the air the likes of which has never been seen on this earth."

Even after Nagasaki, it wasn't until the Russians invaded that Japan surrendered.

i'm not saying i'm right, i don't really know. But i read a lot of articles with US military officers saying japanese had already sued for peace before the bombings.

The second atomic bombing, on Nagasaki, came only three days after the bombing of Hiroshima, when the devastation at Hiroshima had yet to be fully comprehended by the Japanese.

[boutons_deux]

The Allies firestorming and nuking NON-combattants by the 100s of 1000s.

The victors get to write the history.

It's the My Lai logic. "We had to destroy the village(+villagers) to save it".

[SonOfAGun]

Once we got beyond sword and shield the whole system went and got ed up.

[samikeyp]

War sucks. Next time, don't start one.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

The dawn of the nuclear age. Even if you hated Japan with every fiber of your being and wanted them all dead, it's tough to really celebrate the introduction of the weapons technology that would cast a shadow over global politics to this very day.

[samikeyp]

The dawn of the nuclear age. Even if you hated Japan with every fiber of your being and wanted them all dead, it's tough to really celebrate the introduction of the weapons technology that would cast a shadow over global politics to this very day.

I don't think it needs to be celebrated but it does need to be remembered, as a reminder to continue to seek peace.

[BacktoBasics]

MERICA is always right. MESS WITH MERICA AND GET THE HORNS.

[DarkReign]

I watched about 4 do entaries on the event yesterday without even knowing it was the anniversary.

Thats kind of odd, really. Anyway, just because an evil is necessary doesnt make it better. It just makes it less intolerable.

[mrsmaalox]

Tough lessons learned all the way around; and still so much to learn.

[ploto]

It's a reminder that despite growing up in an era of being taught to be scared of other countries having nuclear weapons that it is the United States after all that is the only country ever to use them, and it was done twice.

[angrydude]

It's a reminder that despite growing up in an era of being taught to be scared of other countries having nuclear weapons that it is the United States after all that is the only country ever to use them, and it was done twice.

easy to understand why.

you kill or be killed.

war stinks.

[CosmicCowboy]

Well, I for one am glad they dropped the bomb. I probably wouldn't be here if they hadn't. My dad was a Corsair fighter pilot flying missions from Okinawa over Japan when they did it. They were already preparing for the invasion and best projections were that his squadron would have 75% casualties and overall they were expecting total casualties in the invasion to be over a million.

[Johnson]

how dare we, after Corregidor

[z0sa]

A sad day? Yes.

What would have been far sadder was the million or so lives, on both sides but mainly civilian Japanese, that would have been slaughtered should we have invaded traditionally. The nukes actually saved many lives on both sides which is why they were dropped.

[ploto]

What would have been far sadder was the million or so lives, on both sides but mainly civilian Japanese, that would have been slaughtered should we have invaded traditionally.

As if those are the only two options.

[Cry Havoc]

Those bombs did create peace, they stopped the war.

Over 200,000 died. That's a tragedy no matter what else happened. When enough people to fill 2+ Rose Bowls disappear from the Earth in a matter of days, it's sad. That's all I'm saying.

ould you rather that we had invaded Japan? Seriously? Had we invaded Japan, we would have lost hundreds of thousands of soldiers and killed well over a million Japanese soldiers and civilians including men, women and children because the Japanese trained them all how to attack our soldiers.

As I said before, I think the devices were necessary. SPOILER ALERT. Not to make this a movie comparison, but at the end of Million Dollar Baby, when he helps her to commit suicide, does it make it okay, just because it was necessary and perhaps even the right thing to do? It is a grim reality.

I don't give a about how sudden....or how quick the people died. Whether it was a matter of minutes or hours, dead is dead. They were warned and did nothing about it.

They had no clue and no evidence that we (or any nation) was capable of inflicting such destruction. They saw the Enola Gay in the air and cut the air raid siren because they thought it was a reconnaissance plane, not realizing one bomb could do what it did.

The estimates for the fireboming of Tokyo on March 9/10 1945 put the number at up to 100,000 people killed, over 100,000 injured, over a million homeless, 16 square miles wiped out and 280,000 buildings destroyed. I'm not asking you to celebrate it, I didn't even imply it and I certainly do not see "them" as the enemy. Don't put words in my mouth.

You jumped to the conclusion that I was unaware or unwilling to acknowledge how devastating the invasion of the Japanese homeland would have been, something I'm not only familiar with, but have studied at my Alma-mater. I'm keenly familiar with the situation. I posted this as in memoriam of the reality of war, the decisions it forces us to make at times.

Tragic? Sure. Necessary? Definitely.

This is what I said in my initial response to you.

It saved so many more lives, ten/twenty times more, that it took. Ask any veteran of WWII if they regret the bombing of Hiroshima. You will not find one that does.

I think that's a bit of a mass generalization. Even the President and staff who ordered the atomic bombings had doubts and regrets about the process. My dad is a vet, and has openly said that anytime you go to war, you are full of regrets from the first day you fire a rifle at another living person. The necessity does not remove the devastating reality of such an act.

"The release of atom power has changed everything except our way of thinking...the solution to this problem lies in the heart of mankind. If only I had known, I should have become a watchmaker."

~Albert Einstein

Yes, it saved lives. Yes, it was necessary. That doesn't mean it is an occasion that should be celebrated. We were forced to use the deadliest weapon in the history of mankind on another civilization. If it happens again, there might not be many people left to weep about it. If there isn't a sad siren warning in that, I don't know what to think about our chances as a species for survival.

[blizz]

Yes, it saved lives. Yes, it was necessary. That doesn't mean it is an occasion that should be celebrated. We were forced to use the deadliest weapon in the history of mankind on another civilization. If it happens again, there might not be many people left to weep about it. If there isn't a sad siren warning in that, I don't know what to think about our chances as a species for survival.

SHOW me where I said...where anyone said...that it should be celebrated. Other than that....I think for the most part we agree. I took your post the wrong way and saw it more as a regret. So sure...I'll say it's sad. Sad so many people died. Unfortunately, that's the reality of war. As an American, I'm not apologetic about the bombing in the least bit though.