The Second Banana: Dirk vs. Manu

[ElNono]

I love Arcade Fire. Check out their song called 'Rebellion'. They're great.

How that worked out for you?

[insert Mavs beat Spurs trophy picture here]

[Findog]

Yeah, I'm talking about '06

Dirk played very well in the Finals after that missed FT. But if you want to talk about choking, I'd rather it take place in G3 than in G7:

[Findog]

How that worked out for you?

[insert Mavs beat Spurs trophy picture here]

Are you too lazy to insert it in your post?

[benefactor]

DN lateral quickness is lacking that's why he's been such an ineffective post defender. In this case, his defensive inadequacy would equal that of someone like Bonner. Trust me, I don't have anything against Dirk and I do watch a lot of his games but I understand that Manu has been the better player over the course of his career because his teams have won because of his contributions. Can you say that about Dirk?

And please don't make the argument that his role players choke or haven't been good enough because that is complete bull. Dirk has had great teams around him and he has failed to lead them to a le. Sure he can score on anyone but so can someone like Michael Redd. Does that make him better than Manu?

You're whole post is full of fail. Dirk would not be leading anything...just like Manu didn't lead anything. Duncan is the unquestioned leader and Dirk would be the second option just like Manu is...only he would be a hundred times better because there is not a front line player in the league that could guard him on the perimeter. Did you just compare Dirk to Micheal Redd....I mean...seriously????

[benefactor]

Dammit I wish I would have payed more attention when I was making the poll. I'd love to see all the failures that voted for Manu.

[weebo]

That's funny cuz Dirk made the free throw after Manu helped send his own team packing in 06.

Dirk getting ed slapped by david west and getting punked by sjax and the 8th seeded warrios. so much for dirk...

[ElNono]

Dirk played very well in the Finals after that missed FT. But if you want to talk about choking, I'd rather it take place in G3 than in G7:

Manu was the reason we got to that play at all. Furthermore, Manu won 2 NBA championships before that play, and one more after that.

Dirk is still wondering what happened that year... Where did he go to clean his soul? Australia? LOL

[ElNono]

Are you too lazy to insert it in your post?

I'm too lazy to search for it. You know exactly what it looks like.

[baseline bum]

I'd trade Manu and any two Spurs not named Duncan nor Parker for Dirk. In a second. Too bad Dallas wouldn't agree.

[ElNono]

This is how you close out a NBA Finals Game 7...

[BadOdor]

I'm gonna take a wild guess here, but is Elnono from argentine?

[anonoftheinternets]

Dammit I wish I would have payed more attention when I was making the poll. I'd love to see all the failures that voted for Manu.

well its not as clear cut as you put it. In the other poll i voted dirk + duncan would win, because yes Dirk is a very very special franchise player. But this question was second banana. And I dont think i ever saw anyone give up more, or be more flexible than manu (taking less salary, playing second/third fiddle, even coming off the bench). And this makes him a GREAT teammate and an excellent second banana. So Manu is a better second banana, but dirk is a better banana .

Also obv a team with two francise players is just plain "wrong", and it would not happen. The only exception was kobe and shaq, and as we saw it failed coz the pond is not big enough, and eventually someone will offer one of the franchise players a team. (nash, dirk).

[mardigan]

Man, these poll results are pathetic.

[benefactor]

Mono needs to break out the trolls.

[Findog]

Manu was the reason we got to that play at all.

More so Tim Duncan, but whatevs.

Furthermore, Manu won 2 NBA championships before that play, and one more after that.

Not as a franchise player. Manu is a borderline All Star; Dirk is a franchise player.


Two Franchise Players (Duncan/Dirk) is better than a franchise player and a borderline All Star (Tim/Manu.)

Do you believe Barack Obama was born in Hawaii?

[ElNono]

I'm gonna take a wild guess here, but is Elnono from argentine?

I was born there. Been in the US for the past 11+ years.

I DID say 'call me a homer'

And I can only vote once...

[ElNono]

Not as a franchise player. Manu is a borderline All Star; Dirk is a franchise player.

Nope. He was made a franchise player, but he can't foot the bill. It's ok, it happens to a lot of guys. He would be a tremendous second banana, just like Manu is a tremendous second banana.

Do you believe Barack Obama was born in Hawaii?

I'm not Yoni...

[Findog]

Nope. He was made a franchise player, but he can't foot the bill. It's ok, it happens to a lot of guys. He would be a tremendous second banana, just like Manu is a tremendous second banana.

A team with Dirk as its best player can win a le. They came within an inch of it. At this point, it's not likely, but still possible. Manu is your best player and you're lucky to grab the eighth seed. If Dirk can't "cut it" as a franchise player, Manu surely can't. You're making my argument for me.

[barbacoataco]

As much as I love Manu, Dirk with Duncan would be an unstoppable matchup for any team. Dirk is such a matchup nightmare anyway. They would be perfect together, because Dirk doesn't play under the basket, and Duncan would make up for Dirk's shortcomings on defense and rebounding.

Manu is more clutch than Dirk by a mile, but from an objective point of view Nowitski is the better player and I'm not that much of a homer.

[ElNono]

A team with Dirk as its best player can win a le. They came within an inch of it. At this point, it's not likely, but still possible. Manu is your best player and you're lucky to grab the eighth seed. If Dirk can't "cut it" as a franchise player, Manu surely can't. You're making my argument for me.

I'm not claiming Dirk is a franchise player, you are, and he simply isn't a franchise player. Just as much as I don't claim Manu to be a franchise player, and he isn't.
The thread asked who would you rather have AS A SECOND BANANA (because, frankly, next to Duncan they both are) in their primes.
In their primes, I would take Gino every time. You'll disagree, that's fine.

[Findog]

I'm not claiming Dirk is a franchise player, you are, and he simply isn't a franchise player. Just as much as I don't claim Manu to be a franchise player, and he isn't.
The thread asked who would you rather have AS A SECOND BANANA (because, frankly, next to Duncan they both are) in their primes.
In their primes, I would take Gino every time. You'll disagree, that's fine.

Dirk is a top 10 player. Manu is a top 30 player. I personally believe that a top 10 player is by definition a franchise player and someone that is capable of being the best player on a championship team. In any given era, there's maybe 8-12 of those guys. Some it's more likely than others (Duncan 4 rings, KG 1). So if you asked me what I'd rather have, 1 top 5 player and another top 10 player (Duncan/Dirk), as opposed to 1 top 5 player and another top 30 player (Tim and Manu), I'd take the first option.

[ElNono]

Dirk is a top 10 player. Manu is a top 30 player. I personally believe that a top 10 player is by definition a franchise player and someone that is capable of being the best player on a championship team.

Opinion. I don't agree. I think they're both 1.5 players.

[Findog]

Opinion. I don't agree. I think they're both 1.5 players.

No, Manu is a 2.

[ElNono]

No, Manu is a 2.

No. Manu is a 1.5. He has been the Spurs option number 1 plenty of times, and even more so in crunch time. That made him unquestionably a 1.5.
You're a Mav fan, so I can't hold it against you if you didn't watch many Spurs games when Manu was in his prime.

[Findog]

No. Manu is a 1.5. He has been the Spurs option number 1 plenty of times, and even more so in crunch time. That made him unquestionably a 1.5.
You're a Mav fan, so I can't hold it against you if you didn't watch many Spurs games when Manu was in his prime.

You're massively overrating Manu. Yes, the Spurs like to run their offense through Manu on the second unit when Duncan catches a breather, and he's on the floor in crunchtime to play off of Duncan... but every time the Spurs play an overtime game, they begin feeding it in to Duncan non stop.