Will they?
Why should they? Seems to me they will continue to rise.
Why should they be lower with the current plan? There is no tort reform in it. It mandates more coverage by private insurers that will just drive up costs. It will hurt the economy by it's use of 2.5% taxes on the people and 8% payroll taxes.
If the reform effort fails, it's just status quo. Expenses will continue to rise at the same sort of pace.
If the current reform effort passes, we'll spend even more of our GDP on health care for probably no real benefit. The costs will just be more spread out.
Between those 2 options, yes. No doubt we need reform, but we don't need the reform Obama et al are pushing. The centralization of power and anti-capitalist agenda of the proposed legislation is just asking for more trouble with no way to bail out.
The focus is all wrong, and their looking at it from the wrong direction. Everyone looks at it and things "how can we distribute this cost to make it affordable" and no one addresses "how can we lower the base cost" or "how can we keep the base costs from increasing"?
On page 26, section 122 starts. On the next page, says the following:
This will get tremendously expensive and run private insurance out of business, especially since the government will ration their coverage.does not impose any annual or lifetime limit on the coverage of covered health care items and services;
so you want death squads?
will health care costs come down if reform effort fails?
No. But that doesn't automatically make the reform effort a better alternative.
The poorer you are (unemployed, under employed?), the sicker you are, so the for-profit scammers will keep raising prices, 7%/year?, to price these sickos out of the market.
aka, by pricing health insurance higher and higher, the for-profit insurance is cherry-picking the the middle-to-upper class more healthy people (higher premiums, less pay out), and abandoning the poor/sick to the govt (taxpayers).
I want them for you but you probably won't be on the public plan, so you don't really have to worry about that, do you?
Why should we want health care expenditures to go down considering the lifestyle a majority of this country leads? We spend a lot on health insurance because the way we live demands a lot of it, and we expect immediate care, not postponed care due to the great bogeyman "costs."
Speaking of costs, there's nothing to indicate that the costs to the federal government of these proposals will not be enormous and add to an already mounting federal debt. The number of American citizens who are uninsured and unable to obtain coverage is on the order of 15 million, or 5% of the population. It would be a better deal if Uncle Sam simply provided them insurance outright instead of nationalizing an entire industry and forcing everyone to enjoy the same miserable utopian cluster .
It's closer to 50 million then 15 million.
What the are you saying? A "free" public option?
I see you suffer from selective reading.I am one that believes the number is smaller than that, especially if you exclude the illegal aliens.The number of American citizens who are uninsured and unable to obtain coverage is on the order of 15 million, or 5% of the population.
Actually, the number of Americans than are ineligible for insurance is closer to 5 million.
Okay, I was wrong; it is about 15 million Americans who are ineligible for health insurance. But, of those 15 million, many are uninsured simply because they are between employers or, because they choose not to buy insurance because they are young, healthy adults who simply think it makes economic sense to assume the small risk that they will incur large medical expenses. Accidents are the biggest threat to their health; car accidents are covered by automobile insurance and work-related accidents are covered by workmen's comp. The chance of a young person contracting a catastrophic disease (leukemia, say) is remote, and people aren't stupid: they know that if they contract such a disease they will be treated whether they can pay or not. And young, single people have not acquired a substantial net worth that they could lose to medical bills. This is why, when Pizza Hut made cheap health insurance available to its part-time employees a few years ago, hardly any of them chose to take advantage of it.
One of the purposes of most health care "reform" proposals, stated or unstated, is to force these young people into the system--to force them, that is, to contribute money to pay the medical bills of others, beyond what they already pay in Medicare taxes. Whatever you think of either the justice or the wisdom of such a policy, it is not worth turning our health care system upside down in order to achieve.
I want to say I read another article that actually analyzed the 15 million and whittled it down to 5 million, the number I originally posted.
If I find it, I'll post it.
Meanwhile, Keith Hennessey has analyzed 20 statements made by President Obama during the town hall meeting on health care at Portsmouth, New Hampshire.
One of the statements Hennessey examines pertains to what, for Obama and many others, is the starting point in the debate - the number of people who are uninsured.
In Portsmouth, Obama had this to say:
So, just who are these nearly 46 (actually 45.7) million Americans?
And keep in mind that being uninsured is not the same as having to pay (or pay much) for treatment.
Obama knows he needs a big number of "uninsured" to even get in the vicinity of selling what he has in mind to a skeptical public. But the big number he has selected would not get him in the vicinity if the public better understood who it consists of.
Exactly!
This is an issue that is just now starting to be looked into as far as reform. Not to say it's not been discussed...just that just now is something being brought up for reform.
I do agree with Obama in this aspect... It's something that needs to be reformed. However...just because he is the first to get the ball rolling does not mean his views are the correct procedure for the good of all.
Free healthcare is already implemented in this country. One cannot be refused medical assistance.
That has been a double edge sword since the beginning. And I'm not condoning health care to be refused to any person. But rising cost of health care can be greatly attributed to those who receive care and cannot pay.
It's been a greed based on need industry for over 100 years now. All en ies involved with health care have been busy pointing the finger at each other only to justify their need to raise costs.
But too is... the people themselves. How many people do you know that forego insurance because they put their desires above their needs?
Too is...providing care for those with tax money that are not legal to be in this country.
Too is...the amount of tax money provided to care for others in other countries.
Too is...expenditiures the government deems neccessary over health care.
Too is...this is not an easy fix as per reasons stated above (and there's more but too much to list)
Point is...somebody is going to suffer and benefit regardless of any decision made because there is no way to rectify all of the reasons stated above.
This is a country deeply devided. The gap becomes farther and farther apart with no willingness to give in depending on party affiliation and personal beliefs.
I'm not sure what would be best but...I think it's important enough that we as a people should at least bring to the table other solutions to discuss other than just whether it will be this way or that.
Of course that would mean disregarding many of the elected officials we now have in public office and truly making it a government by and for the people.
The Situation
Forty-six million Americans are uninsured. More than 9 million of them are children. More than eight out of 10 are in working families. They are our friends, neighbors and colleagues--forced to gamble every day that they won't get sick or injured.
Living without health insurance is a risk no one should have to take.
The Response
Cover the Uninsured, a project of the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation, is a national effort to highlight the fact that too many Americans are living without health insurance and demand solutions from our nation's leaders.
We know that reaching the goal of affordable and stable health care will require changes in public policy. Through Cover the Uninsured, we are working to build and sustain broad-based support for change.
This includes raising awareness and building support among policy-makers, health care professionals, grassroots advocates, faith leaders, the business community and active citizens through Cover the Uninsured Week and reaching out to enroll eligible uninsured families in public health coverage programs during the annual Back-to-School Campaign.
And our work is making a difference.
Thanks in large part to thousands of individuals and organizations working in their communities, concern about access to affordable health coverage is high among American voters. Broad-based coalitions from across the country and our nation's governors have joined together in the fight. In February 2009, President Obama and Congress reauthorized the Children’s Health Insurance Program (CHIP) to cover more than 4 million more children.
The time for change is now.
2009 is the year to build upon this momentum to increase awareness about the issue, amplify diverse voices on behalf of the uninsured, and demand solutions from our nation's leaders.
To learn how you can help raise awareness about the uninsured, please visit How To Help.
http://covertheuninsured.org/about
What's your point Afro? How many of the 9 million kids and how many of the 8 out of 10 working families fall into the groups described in my post? What's a working family anyway?
This do ent is also available as a printable .pdf file.
Facts on Health Insurance Coverage
Facts on the Cost of Health Insurance Coverage
Most Americans have health insurance through their employers, yet employment is no longer a guarantee of health insurance coverage. As America continues to move from a manufacturing-based economy to a service economy, and employee
working patterns continue to evolve, health insurance coverage has become less stable. The service sector offers less access to health insurance than its manufacturing counterparts.
Due to rising health insurance premiums, many small employers cannot afford to offer health benefits. Companies that do offer health insurance, often require employees to contribute a larger share toward their coverage. As a result, an increasing number of Americans have opted not to take advantage of job-based health insurance because they cannot afford it.
How Many Americans Are Uninsured?
Several studies estimate the number of uninsured Americans. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, nearly 46 million Americans, or 18 percent of the population under the age of 65, were without health insurance in 2007, their latest data available.1
The Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality, using the Medical Expenditure Panel Survey (MEPS) estimated that the percentage of uninsured Americans under age 65 represented 27 percent of the population. According to the MEPS data, nearly 54 million Americans under the age of 65 were uninsured in the first-half of 2007. 2
A recent study shows that based on the effects of the recession alone (not job loss), it is projected that nearly seven (7) million Americans will lose their health insurance coverage between 2008 and 2010. 3 Urban Ins ute researchers estimate that if unemployment reaches 10 percent, another six (6) million Americans will lose their health insurance coverage. Taking these numbers together, it is conceivable that by next year, 57 to 60 million Americans will be uninsured.
The Urban Ins ute estimates that under a worse case scenario, 66 million Americans will be uninsured by 2019. 4
Nearly 90 million people – about one-third of the population below the age of 65 spent a portion of either 2007 or 2008 without health coverage.5
Who Are the Uninsured?
The large majority of the uninsured (85 percent) are native or naturalized citizens.6
Nearly 1.3 million full-time workers lost their health insurance in 2006. 1
Over 8 in 10 uninsured people come from working families – almost 70 percent from families with one or 7
The percentage and the number of uninsured Hispanics increased to 32.1 percent and overall to 15 million in 2007.1
Why is the Number of Uninsured People Increasing?
Even if employees are offered coverage on the job, they can’t always afford their portion of the premium. Health insurance premiums have increased 119 percent for employers since 1999 and employee spending for health insurance coverage (employee’s share of family coverage) has increased 117 percent between 1999 and 2008.7
Rapidly rising health insurance premiums are the main reason cited by all small firms for not offering coverage. Health insurance premiums are rising at extraordinary rates. The average annual increase in inflation has been 2.5 percent while health insurance premiums for small firms have escalated an average of 12 percent annually.7
How Does Being Uninsured Harm Individuals and Families?
Studies estimate that the number of excess deaths among uninsured adults age 25-64 is in the range of 22,000 a year. This mortality figure is more than the number of deaths from diabetes (17,500) within the same age group.8
Lack of insurance compromises the health of the uninsured because they receive less preventive care, they are diagnosed at more advanced disease stages, and once diagnosed, tend to receive less therapeutic care and have higher mortality rates than insured individuals.9
Controlling for age, race, sex, and income, uninsured cancer patients are 1.6 times more likely than insured patients to die within five years of diagnosis. 10
The high cost of health care can damage the overall economic well-being of families. One in three low-income parents without coverage report medical bills have a major financial impact on their families.11
On average, the uninsured are 9 to 10 times more likely to forgo medical care because of cost and twice as likely to have medical debt. 9
The uninsured are increasingly paying “up front” -- before services will be rendered. When they are unable to pay the full medical bill in cash at the time of service, they can be turned away except in life-threatening cir stances.12
Access to an emergency room for uninsured patients does not qualify as access to coordinated care. While physicians are required to stabilize patients in an emergency, they are not required to treat the condition comprehensively. 13
Over the last decade, disparities between the uninsured and insured widened in access to a usual source of care, annual check-ups, and preventive care, and are the greatest in disparities and our growing. 6
References
1. DeNavas-Walt, C.B. Proctor, and J. Smith. Income, Poverty, and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2007. U.S. Census Bureau., August 2008.
2. Chu, M. C. and J. Rhoades, The Uninsured in America, 1996-2007: Estimates for the the U.S. Civilian Nonins utionalized Population Under Age 65, Medical Expenditure Panel Survey, AHRQ, Statistical Brief #214, July 2008.
3. Gilmer, T. P. and R. G. Kronick, Hard Times And Health Insurance: How Many Americans Will Be Uninsured By 2010?, Health Affairs Web Exclusive, May 28, 2009.
4. Holahan, J., et. al, Health Reform – The Cost of Failure. Robert Wood Johnson Foundation and the Urban Ins ute, May 21, 2009.
5. Families USA. Americans at Risk: One in Three Uninsured, Familes USA, March 2009.
6. The Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation. The Uninsured: A Primer, Key Facts About Americans without Health Insurance. April 2009.
7. The Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation. Employee Health Benefits: 2008 Annual Survey. September 2008. http://www.kff.org/insurance/7672/index.cfm
8. Dorn, S, “Uninsured and Dying Because of It: Updating the Ins ute of Medicine Analysis on the Impact of Uninsurance on Mortality,” Urban Ins ute, 2008.
9. National Center for Health Statistics. “Health, United States, 2007: with Chartbook on Trends in the Health of Americans,” 2007; Center for American Progress, The Case for Health Reform, February 2009.
10. Ward, E. , et all., “Association of Insurance with Cancer Care Utlization and Outcomes,” CA: A Cancer Journal for Clinicians (58), 2008.
11. Schwartz, K., Spotlight on Uninsured Parents: How Lack of Coverage Affects Parents and Their Families, Kaiser Commission on Medicaid and the Uninsured , 2008.
12. Anderson, G., “From ‘Soak the Rich’ to ‘Soak the Poor’: Recent Trends in Hospital Pricing,” Health Affairs (26) 2007.
13. Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act, 42 U.S.C. 1395dd, www.emtala.com.
http://www.nchc.org/facts/coverage.shtml
That's a lot of words! Do they ever get around to discussing:
* 6.4 million are enrolled in Medicaid or S-CHIP and just gave the Census taker the wrong answer. I’m serious. This is called the Medicaid undercount.
* Another 4.3 million are eligible for Medicaid or S-CHIP and have not enrolled. If they need care, the hospital or clinic generally enrolls them. They are protected against risk even though they don’t show up on the rolls as insured.
* Another 9.3 million are non-citizens. Different people come to different conclusions about what portion of this group should receive taxpayer-subsidized health insurance.
* Another 10.1 million have income more than three times the poverty line.
It's a lot of words.Who Are the Uninsured?
The large majority of the uninsured (85 percent) are native or naturalized citizens.6
Nearly 1.3 million full-time workers lost their health insurance in 2006. 1
Over 8 in 10 uninsured people come from working families – almost 70 percent from families with one or 7
The percentage and the number of uninsured Hispanics increased to 32.1 percent and overall to 15 million in 2007.1
So, how many are Medicaid undercounts, eligible but unenrolled, illegal aliens, or make more than $50,000?
Studies estimate that the number of excess deaths among uninsured adults age 25-64 is in the range of 22,000 a year. This mortality figure is more than the number of deaths from diabetes (17,500) within the same age group.8
Lack of insurance compromises the health of the uninsured because they receive less preventive care, they are diagnosed at more advanced disease stages, and once diagnosed, tend to receive less therapeutic care and have higher mortality rates than insured individuals
So, I guess they don't say how many really are insured but didn't bother to tell the Census Bureau, or how many could be insured if they would just bother to enroll, or how many are here illegally, or how many make more than 3 times the poverty rate but are just to cheap to buy affordable insurance.
Do they? Is it just a bunch of bleeding heart pap? Do they ever address the very real facts that many of these people they're talking about are actually insured (undercounts), could be (unenrolled), don't deserve to be (illegal aliens), or can buy their own if they chose to?
Doesn't look like it.
Are you attacking the source?
No, I'm asking if they address those people.
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