Stealquille O'Neal

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I got no problem with emotion, but, the Nuggets acted like jagoffs during that series....same with the Suns. I realize it's the Kobe factor, but, tough . It was good to see even Billups stoop to it, get down into the with his fellow Nugs. And Bell, he's never been the same since he assaulted Kobe. Just a s since that very day. Blew his entire wad.

Neither the Nuggets nor the Suns benefited whatsoever from their nefarious actions.

I think Laker fans have created their own religion and bible that says god is a die hard Laker fan.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

One white play working lazily is more than enough to deceive you that the white players are generally lazy, as the white players are in underwhelming minority in NBA and the names of white players you can think of are quite calculable even with a single hand. Peja is white and works lazily, but he is himself only. Generally the white players are hardworking and smart like Dirk and JJB, and Kidd as well when he's considered white.

I never said all white players are lazy, I said being white doesn't automatically mean so and so is a hard working, gritty, do-whatever-it-takes-to-win-team-first compe or. When the Suns drafted Robin Lopez everyone assumed his game was as polished as it could be and he would add toughness down low, and he did anything but that.

Everyone was enamored with Joe Alexander because he was supposed to have crazy athleticism but also have that great "white player work ethic". It turns out he is athletic, but he's lazy as and does nothing to improve his game.

[z0sa]

Umm where are you getting these "white guy work ethic" quotes from, dok? Because I'm unaware of any sports journalist or even most players that would take, or touch with a 15foot pole, that angle. I believe most are positive your work ethic has nothing to do with your skin color and don't even ponder the idea.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Umm where are you getting these "white guy work ethic" quotes from, dok? Because I'm unaware of any sports journalist or even most players that would take, or touch with a 15foot pole, that angle. I believe most are positive your work ethic has nothing to do with your skin color and don't even ponder the idea.

Of course no one comes out and says it, but it's clearly implied a lot white players have a way better work ethic than black players and it's also implied they are always team first players.

Has the media ever gone after a white player for tearing a locker room apart?

Has the media ever attacked a white player for not working hard enough?

[Culburn369]

Of course no one comes out and says it, but it's clearly implied a lot white players have a way better work ethic than black players and it's also implied they are always team first players.

Has the media ever gone after a white player for tearing a locker room apart?

Has the media ever attacked a white player for not working hard enough?

DUNCAN is correct...it's code.

But, black players get their hand downs as well.

Media uses both races to "sell newspapers" and they do it splendidly.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

But, black players get their hand downs as well.

This is true, I'm not saying black players are always treated unfairly. I'm just talking about white players.

[Culburn369]

Race baiting has become a cottage industry in this country. It drives people and sells just about anything you aim it to sell.

[SenorSpur]

DoK,
By now, I know and understand that you aren't a Nash fan at all, but in this situation, even you would be hard pressed to give the Big Cactus an "out" on this one. If this story is true, Shaq comes off as a big ol' bag.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

DoK,
By now, I know and understand that you aren't a Nash fan at all, but in this situation, even you would be hard pressed to give the Big Cactus an "out" on this one. If this story is true, Shaq comes off as a big ol' bag.

What are you saying? Are you saying teams are supposed to make roster decisions based on which players come up with reality TV show ideas and which players are posers who just copy reality TV show ideas.........I can't believe I thought, this entire time, that teams are supposed to make roster decisions based off what improves their ability to win basketball games......forgive my sop ric mistake.

[rAm]

He's saying to give it a rest. You suck, your team sucks, Nash sucks, Nash's reality show would have sucked, and you can go blow Shaq's meat pole.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

your team sucks, Nash sucks, Nash's reality show would have sucked

Thanks for telling me what I already know.

[rAm]

np

[DPG21920]

Dude, locker rooms are part of building a good team. If a guy is a , even if he is a good player, it can be a negative thing. Addition by subtraction.

So basically, Shaq can steal ideas, sleep with wives and no one should care or say anything bc he makes the team "better"?

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Addition by subtraction.

So now you're telling me the Cleveland trade will make the Suns a better team?

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

So basically, Shaq can steal ideas, sleep with wives and no one should care or say anything bc he makes the team "better"?

Idk what the deal is with the wife cheating thing, but it's irrelevant to the Suns.

And yes. Nash plays for a team, he should do what is best for the team. If he's mad that he's not famous enough to star in the reality TV show he came up with, he should swallow his ego and recognize he needs to do what's best for the team, not what's best for him.

Are you seriously trying to tell me I shouldn't be mad at Nash because he put himself before the team and was too petty to let it go? I have a hard time believing you'd be OK with a player on the your favorite team acting this petty.

[DPG21920]

You act like locker room chemistry is not part of building a team. You have to be able to trust your teammates.

[DPG21920]

So now you're telling me the Cleveland trade will make the Suns a better team?

They did not even make the playoffs last year. Cannot get worse than that.

[Findog]

Idk what the deal is with the wife cheating thing, but it's irrelevant to the Suns.

And yes. Nash plays for a team, he should do what is best for the team. If he's mad that he's not famous enough to star in the reality TV show he came up with, he should swallow his ego and recognize he needs to do what's best for the team, not what's best for him.

Are you seriously trying to tell me I shouldn't be mad at Nash because he put himself before the team and was too petty to let it go? I have a hard time believing you'd be OK with a player on the your favorite team acting this petty.

How did Nash's actions negatively affect the team? He got compensation and an executive producer credit, so it sounds like his grievance was not without merit.

All I know is that guys have been clamoring to play with Steve Nash ever since he emerged as a top PG. KG among others wanted to go to Phoenix. O'Neal leaves a trail of broken relationships in his wake. You tell me who was more likely to generate resentment and hard feelings among teammates.

I get that you want the Suns to get on with a necessary rebuilding job, but what was Steve Nash supposed to do? Take less money to go elsewhere? This was his last chance at a contract and he took the highest offer. You would do the same in his shoes.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

They did not even make the playoffs last year. Cannot get worse than that.

I didn't ask if they'd be worse, I asked if you think swapping out Shaquille O'Neal for Robin Lopez will make the Suns a better team.

[Findog]

I didn't ask if they'd be worse, I asked if you think swapping out Shaquille O'Neal for Robin Lopez will make the Suns a better team.

If they win 47 games this year, will you agree the 09-10 Suns were better than the 08-09 Suns, regardless of roster composition?

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I get that you want the Suns to get on with a necessary rebuilding job, but what was Steve Nash supposed to do? Take less money to go elsewhere? This was his last chance at a contract and he took the highest offer. You would do the same in his shoes.

Actually I wouldn't. If I already had more money than I'd possibly ever need, I'd be much more concerned with winning that ring than finding the biggest contract I could find. Then again, I'd never say during an interview I don't care if I win a championship or not.

[Findog]

Actually I wouldn't. If I already had more money than I'd possibly ever need, I'd be much more concerned with winning that ring than finding the biggest contract I could find.

There is a rich history of people expressing one preference in hypothetical scenarios and then doing something different when confronted with real-world choices.

How much is a ring really worth if he has to go pull a Malone and Payton and try to do it as a role player on a powerhouse team in the twilight of his career? I know that Dirk would kill himself trying to win a championship with Dallas, but he's also said many times that winning one with another team wouldn't mean nearly as much to him.

Then again, I'd never say during an interview I don't care if I win a championship or not.

In the context of that interview with Wilbon, he said he didn't need a ring to validate his career.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

If they win 47 games this year, will you agree the 09-10 Suns were better than the 08-09 Suns, regardless of roster composition?

Yes, but if they do win 47 games, it'll be because Amare stayed healthy and because Gentry is leaps and bounds better than Terry Porter. it won't be because Robin Lopez gave them something Shaq didn't.

[DPG21920]

I didn't ask if they'd be worse, I asked if you think swapping out Shaquille O'Neal for Robin Lopez will make the Suns a better team.

Too much simplification. The Shaq move will have benefits besides immediately.Not to mention that this is about winning a le, so from that regard there was nothing the Suns could to, so the trade does not make them worse.

Once you miss the playoffs, you are lumped into one group.

[Findog]

Yes, but if they do win 47 games, it'll be because Amare stayed healthy and because Gentry is leaps and bounds better than Terry Porter. it won't be because Robin Lopez gave them something Shaq didn't.

There's also a school of thought that Shaq got his touches at the expense of the Suns running a more efficient offense. In his prime he was a 30/15 guy. What did he do last year, 17/9 while not being able to guard the p'n'r? Of course even at his old age he's much better than RL, but I wouldn't at all be shocked this year if they are a much better team w/o Shaq.