Are blacks better athletes than EVERY OTHER RACE

[Winehole23]

That question is difficult to answer that way.

No it's not. It's easy to answer. That's why you had to tweak the example

What do you do of a paper co-authored by a psychologist, a biologist and a geneticist? It's 2/3 science and 1/3 liberal art?

Maybe. I don't really know.

[mogrovejo]

No it's not. It's easy to answer. That's why you had to tweak the example

It may be easy, I said difficult in the sense of irrelevant.

Maybe. I don't really know.

It's the product that matter, not the producer, when evaluating what science is. If not, if a geneticist writes a poem one would call it science.

Maybe. I doubt racial differences in heredity are really as important as you are suggesting.

What's the degree of importance I'm suggesting? What I said was that "research when it comes to the brain is abandoned because of the fear of repercurssions if "politically incorrect" results are find". I even provided an example. Are you saying that the genetics of the brain isn't important?

The only reason you know this is that scientists are free to do science. Right?

Are they? Are you sure that some scientific works aren't being done because researches just don't want to bother to deal with accusations of racism?

I can see what you mean with Arthur Jensen, but he is still a professor emeritus at UCal-Berkeley and he still publishes.

Charles Murray does whatever it is potted plants at the AEI do, and James Watson retired at the age of 79. Watson is free to pop off without fear of repercussions, and the AEI pays Charles Murray to do it. I see nothing disgraceful there.

Oh please, what's disgraceful is to accuse scientists of being racists for no good reason. What's disgraceful for a civilized society is the appliance of the racism boggey-man to the field of science and the politicization of shouldn't be politicized.

[MannyIsGod]

you guys trying to slam meteorology. You should see the math I'm having to take. If you even try to consider it not a hard science you will go immediately on ignore.

[MiamiHeat]

Isn't that suggestion of ulterior motives a way of conditioning the interest of people by using a bogey man? "Oh, this guy is researching the relationship between race, genes and intelligence, I wonder if he likes to burn crosses...".

The obvious problem with this kind of pressures - that are very intense and widespread in the academic/political world - is the precedent they open. I find the analogy with the creationism/evolutionism debate quite apt. It's a form of obscurantism to use scaremongering, even if with the best intentions and for good political reasons, to obstruct the discovery of the truth.

Maybe we're better without knowing some things. I admit that. All the preliminary evidence that points to an existence of a relationship between ethnic groups, certain genes, big head sizes and psychometric tests results will eventually lead to some racist groups claiming a scientific support for their political thesis. I don't see the big deal. It doesn't make them right in any way. But in the end we can't really know what things we're better without knowing, because we don't know what we don't know and it will prove to be futile: the impetus to search the truth is too strong.

What if there are some guys with a couple of alleles selected and their common in some populations but not others (and, because of that, have some sort of cognitive advantage)? Dr. Lahn research has pretty much settled that there are differences in brain function between groups. Yeah, probably asians are smarter than whites and whites are smarter than blacks because of their different evolutionary process. But as you say the differences withing groups are much, much larger, and, in the end, the difference in genetics is microscopic when compared with the similitudes.

The danger is that, as it's already happening, genetics research when it comes to the brain is abandoned because of the fear of repercurssions if "politically incorrect" results are find:




This is grothesc because it has to do with pressure motivaded by political views and not sound scientif reasons. We know there are genetic differences between races that give advtanges or disavantges. Adult whites can digest milk much better than asians or blakcs. Some blacks have a gene that protects them from malaria that whites miss. Etc. etc. The brain is a potentially more dangerous territory, but that's not a good reason to not make science.

What has been happening to scientists like James Walton, Charles Murray, Arthur Jensen and many others is an absolute disgrace for a free and civilized society.

Wow. I haven't read a quality post like this... since.... since I read one of my own posts. Definitely been a long time since I have read this type of quality from someone else.

[nuclearfm]

you guys trying to slam meteorology. You should see the math I'm having to take. If you even try to consider it not a hard science you will go immediately on ignore.

It is very hard, were are you going to school at?

[nuclearfm]

Shouldn't you be posting at the stormfront sports forum jack?

The funny thing is that many many posts are of this type there.

[jack sommerset]

The funny thing is that many many posts are of this type there.

Not a racist bone in my body.

[NoOptionB]

If blacks are not dominating a certain sport, that just means they have not found it yet.

Hockey is the last frontier.


Once Tiger arrived, I even almost started considering Golf a sport for this very reason.

[jack sommerset]

If blacks are not dominating a certain sport, that just means they have not found it yet.

Hockey is the last frontier.

That is wrong. Soccer,tennis,swimming,rugby,golf,baseball,etc.... . The blacks dominate in Americas top two sports. Football and basketball. The rest of the world is catching up with basketball. It's not like the sports are hiding. They have been around a long long time.

[nuclearfm]

That is wrong. Soccer,tennis,swimming,rugby,golf,baseball,etc.... . The blacks dominate in Americas top two sports. Football and basketball. The rest of the world is catching up with basketball. It's not like the sports are hiding. They have been around a long long time.

If that's the case, why make a big thread about it? What you should look is at the obesity rates in this country, that and culture has a lot to do with it. I don't mean NFL type obesity either, I mean lazy fat ass obesity. Point is, you trying to describe something that you can't. It's stereotyping and yes it is racist.

[Ginobilly]

Yes they are......I wish I was black!

anyways.....
Football: blacks >>>>>>other races
Soccer: blacks > other races (Brazilian blacks have dominated soccer for quite some time, but the gap is closing (i.e. Cristiano Ronaldo, Messi, Kaka, etc)
Basketball: blacks>>>>>>>>>>>>> other races. It's not even funny.
Strongman compe ions: blacks<<<<<<<<<<whites
conquering and military strategy: Whites
Math: Asians

[jack sommerset]

If that's the case, why make a big thread about it? What you should look is at the obesity rates in this country, that and culture has a lot to do with it. I don't mean NFL type obesity either, I mean lazy fat ass obesity. Point is, you trying to describe something that you can't. It's stereotyping and yes it is racist.

I'm tempted to break down your post but that is too much work. You r all over the place.

[MiamiHeat]

If that's the case, why make a big thread about it? What you should look is at the obesity rates in this country, that and culture has a lot to do with it. I don't mean NFL type obesity either, I mean lazy fat ass obesity. Point is, you trying to describe something that you can't. It's stereotyping and yes it is racist.

I don't agree with jack sommerset, but making a thread about it is fine with me.

Nothing wrong with looking at facts, observing the situation, and taking a completely rational and scientific look at things. It's not racist to discuss it

[Ginobilly]

These types of discussions and experiments are incredibly sensitive.

You can't even talk about genetic differences, such as physical traits, or differences in brain development, between whites/blacks/asians without people carrying pitchforks.

Even though it's completely rational, we can't talk about these things without people getting their politically correct hearts broken. It's perfectly OK to talk about brain development in apes, monkeys, birds, dogs, between breeds and such..

but when it comes to human, if you even THINK about trying to say "Whites have an increase in brain matter of at least 7% over blacks, enabling rational thinking and problem solving"

you would be hanged and labeled a racist.

Your exactly right. First of all, there's no such thing races. Scientist today are classifying humans, and breaking us down into sub ethnic breeds. We are more like dogs per say, with each human breed being susceptible to certain behaviors, physical and mental traits. I don't think it's racist....it's rather quite interesting.

[Ginobilly]

People also seem to forget that we are animals! We belong in the Animalia kingdom, along with dogs, horses, and rabbits. Our arrogance is quite indescribable, thinking that the biological laws don't apply to us.

[MiamiHeat]

People also seem to forget that we are animals! We belong in the Animalia kingdom, along with dogs, horses, and rabbits. Our arrogance is quite indescribable, thinking that the biological laws don't apply to us.

Agreed

It would help us understand each other a lot more, why we do things, why we behave certain ways, why we cheat, why we get angry and become violent, etc...

[jack sommerset]

I don't agree with jack sommerset, but making a thread about it is fine with me.

Nothing wrong with looking at facts, observing the situation, and taking a completely rational and scientific look at things. It's not racist to discuss it

Damn straight but I think I am right. If you really believe a race is physically better suited for a job you have to think a race is better suited mentally for a job. I think neither. What I see is a race dominated in the top two American sports and there is a reason for it.

[Winehole23]

It may be easy, I said difficult in the sense of irrelevant.

Then why did you reply to it?

It's the product that matter, not the producer, when evaluating what science is. If not, if a geneticist writes a poem one would call it science.

Good example. To me, Charles Murray writing a book about human intelligence is like a geneticist writing poetry.

What's the degree of importance I'm suggesting? What I said was that "research when it comes to the brain is abandoned because of the fear of repercurssions if "politically incorrect" results are find". I even provided an example. Are you saying that the genetics of the brain isn't important?

Do you really think I did?

Let's just say I'm skeptical that advances in neurobiology are being held up by political correctness.

Are they? Are you sure that some scientific works aren't being done because researches just don't want to bother to deal with accusations of racism?

I can't help it if researchers lack the courage of their convictions. They have only themselves to blame if they prize their reputations above their professional and personal integrity.

Oh please, what's disgraceful is to accuse scientists of being racists for no good reason. What's disgraceful for a civilized society is the appliance of the racism boggey-man to the field of science and the politicization of shouldn't be politicized.

People get called names and everything gets politicized. It's a shame, but it's also not that big a deal.

What happened to Arthur Jensen isn't too common and it also happened 40 years ago, in a far more explosive social milieu. Putting it forward as an example of what happens to heterodox research now is misleading.

It's not like Dr. Murray lost his job or something; he was merely denounced as a racist: big effing deal. Then he got a lifetime sinecure with AEI. Wah.

Watson resigned in shame after spouting some jackassed foolishness. Was the furore overblown? Sure. But Dr Watson deserved the flames. What he said was just about totally unsupported by scientific data. Embarrass the ins ution, lose your job. Dr. Watson should've known better.

[Ginobilly]

I going to put it in layman terms for everybody:

A long time ago Europe sent conquistadores to America to conquer the Natives and establish colonies. A lot of the men that Europe sent were quite strong: descendants of Viking/Basque warriors who were notorious for being big and strong. They weren't probably the fastest, but their brute strength and power was unmatchable. The natives were overwhelmed. Soon they started bringing in African slaves because the natives just couldn't cut it. Africans aren't known for being strong, but they are agile,tall, fast, and have a history of being exposed to European diseases, thus making them better options for intense labor. A lot of those strong European men raped those helpless poor African Women, thus giving birth to hybrids. Those hybrids got the best of both worlds. The brute, physical strength of the European man, plus the quickness and agility of the African. This happened, as MH has explained for generations(selective breeding), creating some of the worlds best athletes that we see today.

[jack sommerset]

I going to put it in layman terms for everybody:

A long time ago Europe sent conquistadores to America to conquer the Natives and establish colonies. A lot of the men that Europe sent were quite strong: descendants of Viking/Basque warriors who were notorious for being big and strong. They weren't probably the fastest, but their brute strength and power was unmatchable. The natives were overwhelmed. Soon they started bringing in African slaves because the natives just couldn't cut it. Africans aren't known for being strong, but they are agile,tall, fast, and have a history of being exposed to European diseases, thus making them better options for intense labor. A lot of those strong European men raped those helpless poor African Women, thus giving birth to hybrids. Those hybrids got the best of both worlds. The brute, physical strength of the European man, plus the quickness and agility of the African. This happened, as MH has explained for generations(selective breeding), creating some of the worlds best athletes that we see today.

That is crazy racist!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[MiamiHeat]

So in a nuts , without slave-breeding, blacks would be inferior to whites in athleticism as well?

What a loaded question. You just want to imply someone is racist.

It's obvious, without slave breeding, they would be just like native africans.

[Ginobilly]

So in a nuts , without slave-breeding, blacks would be inferior to whites in athleticism as well?

Yup. American blacks got the best of both worlds through selective breeding. Whites are the strongest race on earth. It's no secret why they always win the strongman compe ions.

[jack sommerset]

it's not that I'm racist. it's just the blood that flows through my veins is superior.

Superior in what is the question? Prisons are full of a certain race. That is a fact. Is it fair or are they wrongfully prosecuted.

[MiamiHeat]

it's not that I'm racist. it's just the blood that flows through my veins is superior.

I know you are being sarcastic, but you are wrong in trying to paint others that way

Nobody is superior. Just because, as a population, blacks or whites or asians have an advantage in X subject, it doesn't mean it pertains to ALL of the race.

It's just the 'average'. Every person is still different and could defy the average.

[Ginobilly]

How come those hybrids did not inherit the superior intelligence?

That's more of a question of the social class infrastructure that the slaves were put into by the slave owners. The tools were there, but whitey book blocked out of an education.