Three Little Things That Can Throw off Lakers

[da_suns_fan]

You have no idea what you are talking about. I guess that comes with being a Suns fan and watching that garbage team with that garbage front office.

Adding RJ might not be enough to beat the Lakers, but that does not mean it was a mistake.

So I dont know what Im talking about but you dont refute any of my arguments?

I just dont see Jefferson mixing in well with the Spurs. Given his salary, I think Spurs fan will eventually come to the realization the trading for him was a mistake.

A lot of Spurs fans only look at the trade from a Oberto/Bowen/Udoka vs. Jefferson perspective which is pretty short-sighted. Keeping those guys and letting their contracts expire would have put the Spurs in position to go after a marquee free agent. With Ginobili and Duncan getting older, next summer would have been the perfect time to get a franchise type player to pair with Parker for the next decade.

But according to you, being that Im a Suns means that I made the decisions the front office of the team that I root for made, thus I have no credibility.

Grow up, .

[all_heart]

So I dont know what Im talking about but you dont refute any of my arguments?

I just dont see Jefferson mixing in well with the Spurs. Given his salary, I think Spurs fan will eventually come to the realization the trading for him was a mistake.

A lot of Spurs fans only look at the trade from a Oberto/Bowen/Udoka vs. Jefferson perspective which is pretty short-sighted. Keeping those guys and letting their contracts expire would have put the Spurs in position to go after a marquee free agent. With Ginobili and Duncan getting older, next summer would have been the perfect time to get a franchise type player to pair with Parker for the next decade.

But according to you, being that Im a Suns means that I made the decisions the front office of the team that I root for made, thus I have no credibility.

Grow up, .

So Suns fan, if you think you are so smart, why aren't you working in some front office somewhere?! Like I mentioned before, Spurs weren't winning with the roster they had last year, even Pop admitted it. But now all the players including coach Pop are feeling good about their chances.... however you being the armchair GM think you know better?! You sound like a closet bandwagon Lakers fan, I guess it still hurts 2 years later huh?!

[da_suns_fan]

So Suns fan, if you think you are so smart, why aren't you working in some front office somewhere?! Like I mentioned before, Spurs weren't winning with the roster they had last year, even Pop admitted it. But now all the players including coach Pop are feeling good about their chances.... however you being the armchair GM think you know better?! You sound like a closet bandwagon Lakers fan, I guess it still hurts 2 years later huh?!

Wow.

Yeah, Im a closet Laker fan. Because everyone knows now is NOT the time to be open about your allegiance to the Lakers since they did so horrible last year. I have to hide behind the shining beacon of championships that is the Phoenix Suns, but deep down I wish I could let everyone know how much I love Kobe, the most arrogant, phony jackass ever to play sports.

Im glad you think I should be working as a GM somewhere, though.

And again, no one refutes my points, just more ad-hominem arguments.

[hater]

No, because the Spurs put all their eggs in one basket by agreeing to take on a one-dimensional player with a huge contract who doesnt fill any of their needs.

he is a near allstar, can create his own plays, can defend the bigger guards/SF, can score 20ppg and shoots 40%+ from 3.

yeah, he does not fit our needs at all

[da_suns_fan]

he is a near allstar, can create his own plays, can defend the bigger guards and shoots 40%+ from 3.

yeah, he does not fit our needs at all

1) He's NEVER been an all-star and I doubt he ever will be in his career.

2) He cant create his own plays. He has poor ball handling, makes bad decisions and cant go to his left. Hes more athlete than basketball player.

3) Defend bigger guards? Better than who? Ginobili? Finley? Certainly not Bowen. You think Jefferson is gonna make a difference against Kobe Bryant? You think he's gonna defend Nash as well as Bowen did? Bowen is retired so that point might be completely mute, but Jefferson is no elite defender. Hollinger's latest scouting report points out how little effot he gives chasing through screens. If Boston and LA are the Spurs' main compe ion, I'll take Ray Allen and Kobe's chances against Richard Jefferson any day of the week.

4) Im sure he'll shoot 40% from 3 in the corners. And it only cost you 29 million dollars (for two seasons).

Now lets say the Spurs signed Ariza. T.A. plays defense just as good as RJ. In fact, I'd say hes more natural defender than RJ. Ariza can hit the three pointer and he's even proven he can do it in clutch times like the finals. Ariza rebounds very well for a 3 and runs the floor just as well as RJ.

Biggest difference? Ariza does a lot more when he's not scoring and costs about 1/3 the price.

[DPG21920]

So I dont know what Im talking about but you dont refute any of my arguments?

I just dont see Jefferson mixing in well with the Spurs. Given his salary, I think Spurs fan will eventually come to the realization the trading for him was a mistake.

A lot of Spurs fans only look at the trade from a Oberto/Bowen/Udoka vs. Jefferson perspective which is pretty short-sighted. Keeping those guys and letting their contracts expire would have put the Spurs in position to go after a marquee free agent. With Ginobili and Duncan getting older, next summer would have been the perfect time to get a franchise type player to pair with Parker for the next decade.

But according to you, being that Im a Suns means that I made the decisions the front office of the team that I root for made, thus I have no credibility.

Grow up, .

There is no need to explain things to someone like you. You can say throw away lines such as "grow up, ", but the fact of the matter is you are either trolling or you are so dumb with regards to basketball nothing anyone will say can help you.

Being a Suns fan has certainly not helped you.

[da_suns_fan]

There is no need to explain things to someone like you. You can say throw away lines such as "grow up, ", but the fact of the matter is you are either trolling or you are so dumb with regards to basketball nothing anyone will say can help you.

Being a Suns fan has certainly not helped you.

Sounds like your upset because I bust your bubble. I would love to hear any additional reasons you think Jefferson was a good move or worth the price.

Then again, you think Im too stupid to understand.

I guess Hollinger is too stupid too:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/holli...seasonType%3d2

Maybe I should apply at ESPN. I didnt even need any fancy SQL queries to come to my conclusions.

[Morg1411]

Sounds like your upset because I bust your bubble. I would love to hear any additional reasons you think Jefferson was a good move or worth the price.

Then again, you think Im too stupid to understand.

I guess Hollinger is too stupid too:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/holli...seasonType%3d2

Maybe I should apply at ESPN. I didnt even need any fancy SQL queries to come to my conclusions.

Yeah, you're awesome. You've also convinced yourself that your right, you're not actually listening to other people's arguments as opposed to just shooting them down out of spite, and you apparently love to agree with yourself.

[phyzik]

Sounds like your upset because I bust your bubble. I would love to hear any additional reasons you think Jefferson was a good move or worth the price.

Then again, you think Im too stupid to understand.

I guess Hollinger is too stupid too:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/holli...seasonType%3d2

Maybe I should apply at ESPN. I didnt even need any fancy SQL queries to come to my conclusions.

I dont know about you, but I'll take the 15th best SF (based off of PER) in the league as my 4th man. , chances are, him not being the go to guy will probably help him increase his PER if anything. Nevermind that him and the GREAT Artest are only separated by a mere 2 tenths of a point in that category.

[hater]

1) He's NEVER been an all-star and I doubt he ever will be in his career.

I said near allstar. that is a fact

2) He cant create his own plays. He has poor ball handling, makes bad decisions and cant go to his left. Hes more athlete than basketball player.

mmm your word vs. Pop's and RC Bufords... I'll take theirs

3) Defend bigger guards? Better than who? Ginobili? Finley? Certainly not Bowen. You think Jefferson is gonna make a difference against Kobe Bryant? You think he's gonna defend Nash as well as Bowen did? Bowen is retired so that point might be completely mute, but Jefferson is no elite defender. Hollinger's latest scouting report points out how little effot he gives chasing through screens. If Boston and LA are the Spurs' main compe ion, I'll take Ray Allen and Kobe's chances against Richard Jefferson any day of the week.

didn't say he is elite. He can hold his own vs. bigger guards/sf that is a fact

4) Im sure he'll shoot 40% from 3 in the corners. And it only cost you 29 million dollars (for two seasons).

that's just one of the things he brings

Now lets say the Spurs signed Ariza. T.A. plays defense just as good as RJ. In fact, I'd say hes more natural defender than RJ. Ariza can hit the three pointer and he's even proven he can do it in clutch times like the finals. Ariza rebounds very well for a 3 and runs the floor just as well as RJ.

Biggest difference? Ariza does a lot more when he's not scoring and costs about 1/3 the price.

RJ >>> Ariza

oh and take Hollinger's out of your mouth before posting

[hater]

let's see, had RJ been traded to Suns, he'd instantly be the 3rd best player

[da_suns_fan]

let's see, had RJ been traded to Suns, he'd instantly be the 3rd best player

We already have a Richard Jefferson. His name is Jason Richardson. I would trade him in a heart beat (but not for Richard Jefferson).

[hater]

We already have a Richard Jefferson. His name is Jason Richardson. I would trade him in a heart beat (but not for Richard Jefferson).

funny, I would not trade Jefferson for Richardson in 1000000 years

[da_suns_fan]

I said near allstar. that is a fact

This one is funny. Do you know what the word "fact" means? I dont want to be too mean, but the idiocy is someone claiming that it is a "fact" that anyone is a "near" all-star is humorous. Whether or not he is a near all-star is completely subjective. The only FACT is that he's never made an all-star team. And I doubt he ever will.

mmm your word vs. Pop's and RC Bufords... I'll take theirs

Not just mine. Dont forget that two teams have already bailed on Jefferson. One for cap space.

didn't say he is elite. He can hold his own vs. bigger guards/sf that is a fact

More with the "facts" game. I cant disprove that Jefferson defends bigger guards/sf anymoe than you can prove it so I'll leave it alone. But Im pretty sure Kobe's gonna do whatever he wants against Richard Jefferson.

that's just one of the things he brings

It actually one of two needs I think he fills for the Spurs. Corner three point shooting and runs the floor well.

RJ >>> Ariza

Are we talking about salaries? Cuz RJ makes well over twice as much. Ariza certainly rebounds and produces a greater amount of steals than RJ. RJ is a better jump shooter. Thats probably it.

oh and take Hollinger's out of your mouth before posting

Just cuz you slob all over anyone in sliver and black doesnt mean I have any man love for Hollinger. Im not the biggest Hollinger fan, but I have to give Kudos for PERFECTLY stating my point. Maybe theres something to his analysis.

[phyzik]

We already have a Richard Jefferson. His name is Jason Richardson. I would trade him in a heart beat (but not for Richard Jefferson).

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/holli...seasonType%3d2

Keep in mind, RJ was often the first option on his last team. I hope I dont have to explain myself by saying that.

Was Jason richardson ever the first option on a team? and if so, what was his PER at that time?

[DPG21920]

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/holli...seasonType%3d2

Keep in mind, RJ was often the first option on his last team. I hope I dont have to explain myself by saying that.

Was Jason richardson ever the first option on a team? and if so, what was his PER at that time?

So Leandro Barbosa is > Joe Johnson. It is also funny how DSF said the Spurs should have waited to get Joe Johnson. Why not Barbosa? Because Hollinger says Barbosa is better than Joe Johnson by PER and Joe is way overpaid compared to what a guy like Barbosa can give you. Just like the Ariza vs RJ comparison.

[Culburn369]

[[[This one is funny. Do you know what the word "fact" means? I dont want to be too mean, but the idiocy is someone claiming that it is a "fact" that anyone is a "near" all-star is humorous. Whether or not he is a near all-star is completely subjective. The only FACT is that he's never made an all-star team. And I doubt he ever will.]]]

da is correct here, hater. You look like a dip saying "near" like that.

[da_suns_fan]

So Leandro Barbosa is > Joe Johnson. It is also funny how DSF said the Spurs should have waited to get Joe Johnson. Why not Barbosa? Because Hollinger says Barbosa is better than Joe Johnson by PER and Joe is way overpaid compared to what a guy like Barbosa can give you. Just like the Ariza vs RJ comparison.

I guess that true. But one thing, if you go to phxsuns.net, you'll see that Ive been on a crusade to trade J-Rich because Ive been trying to point out how ridiculously awesome LB's numbers were as a starter (they completely blow away J-Rich and he's not gonna come off the bench). I feel that LB has paid his dues and deserves to start. So while I dont agree that LB is a better player than JJ, I would say I could understand that their contributions on a per minute basis were similar considering LBs stats are pretty fantastic on a per minute basis. Further, If I had to make a choice between having LB at 6 million versus having JJ at 14, I think you gotta take LB, right? Especially if taking LB meant it would position me to get ANOTHER superstar the following season (as taking Ariza would have positioned the Spurs for next summer).

Also, LB isnt a free agent next season (thank god). Joe Johnson is. Thats why I picked out JJ. Plus, everyone seems to have come to conclusion that Bosh was a pipe-dream (which is convenient considering RJ took them out of the free agent market for next year), so I pointed out that theres a completely obtainable All-Star available who will go ANYWHERE for the right price. But that option is history because the Spurs "put all their eggs in one basket" by trading for RJ even though a cheaper, younger, better suited player was available in Trevor Ariza.

[da_suns_fan]

da is correct here, hater. You look like a dip saying "near" like that.

Thank you, Cubby.

[da_suns_fan]

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/holli...seasonType%3d2

Keep in mind, RJ was often the first option on his last team. I hope I dont have to explain myself by saying that.

Was Jason richardson ever the first option on a team? and if so, what was his PER at that time?

Not sure but thanks for posting this. As I said in an earlier post, Ive been trying to convince my fellow Suns fans that we dont need J-Rich and we should dump him for the first offer we get!! PER shows LB was the fifth best SG in the league and was MUCH more effective than J-Rich. So many Suns fans are so used to having LB off the bench they just cant fathom him starting.

[Culburn369]

Thank you, Cubby.

You're most welcome, old horse.

I am flabbergasted that he left himself that weak. I had to read it about 5 times before I realized he'd actually said it.

[phyzik]

Not sure but thanks for posting this. As I said in an earlier post, Ive been trying to convince my fellow Suns fans that we dont need J-Rich and we should dump him for the first offer we get!! PER shows LB was the fifth best SG in the league and was MUCH more effective than J-Rich. So many Suns fans are so used to having LB off the bench they just cant fathom him starting.

No Problem, I like Richardson. Just dont discredit what RJ can bring to the Spurs as a FOURTH option, doing so is rediculous. I would agree with your arguement if he was MAYBE the 2nd or 3rd option, but he is not.

the 15th best SF in the league (acording to PER which I dont follow religiously) is the Spurs 4TH option!!! Im not saying its a guaranteed LOB at all, but just think about that. A 1st option on another team is the Spurs 4th option. Seriously... think about that.

Also, not to discredit your eye for talent as far as chamionships go, but you ARE a ing Suns fan.

[Culburn369]

Im not saying its a guaranteed LOB at all, but just think about that.

phy, are you saying: "it's near an LOB and that's a fact?"

[all_heart]

phy, are you saying: "it's near an LOB and that's a fact?"

yea, like the Lakers 2 yrs ago

[phyzik]

phy, are you saying: "it's near an LOB and that's a fact?"

no, more like:

The Spurs will most likely win it, but happens sometimes.

tee, hee.