Do you believe in god?

[boutons_deux]

"saying all theses creatures that have no souls"

Even childish, fairy-tale-believing "Christians" believe God is everywhere. But they've been indoctrinated not to think beyond/deeper than/behind the cant programmed into them.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Organized religions in this world believe things such as:

1) If you're good while you live then you get to a lot after your dead.
2) If you're good while you live then you get your own planet and a lot when your dead.
3) If you with God's chosen people then he'll send a guy with wings to kill a bunch of your children unless you put sheep blood on your door
4) a guy can take demons out of people and put them into pigs.

The idea of a creator sure is convenient though.

Its hard to think of mechanism by which the single cell organisms who were the only life on earth for a billion years evolved into multicellular organisms. Lets say god did it.

Can't explain the phsyics in the first billionth of a billionth of a second after the big bang? God did it...

Relations between Egypt and Israel normalize and of course it has to be god...

Get a raise? God did it.

Lose your job? Well thats your fault.

Quite franly the whole western idea of god is pretty lame. the western god is singular, sentient in the same sense as we are and is singular. hes omniscient and omnipotent and hasnt done for 15 or so centuries to prove his existence, then they wrap it up in the whole 'you cannot possibly understand the mind of god' crap.

Ive always liked that one by the way. Its kind of like saying that because I cannot understand how accounting works that you cannot either. Its stupid. Not to mention that by saying that god has a mind your saying that he perceives things as we do.

Now this is not to say I do not believe in the possibility of different modes of perception or other beings/things that are more powerful/perceptive than we are; I just refuse to use that as an answer for everything that I don't understand or let me be led around by the nose by people that try to feed me that bull

[AussieFanKurt]

Good answer Fuzzy, I agree with a lot of what you said, if not all of it

[SnakeBoy]

The reason I asked the questions I went to a Catholic church for three years straight I was trying to bang this girl and I had to get in good with the parents. I wanted to know if you shared the same experience as I,

I've banged a few catholic girls, never had to do that. Taking them out to a really nice dinner always worked for me. You should have tried that first and saved yourself alot of time.

[z0sa]

who said there were any egdes to the universe?

perhaps the universe is a sphere.

A dark flow pulling clusters of galaxies (the largest structures in the universe) to a point outside of said universe means there's something beyond the universe.

What's outside the bubble?

[Blake]

That doesn't answer my question.

Do you believe in mega massive flying spaghetti monsters?

No. Get to your point.

[z0sa]

No.

Idiot.

What's outside the bubble?

[Blake]

Idiot.

That was a fantastic question.

Get to your point.

What's outside the bubble?

We don't know.

What do you think is outside the bubble?

[z0sa]

That was a fantastic question.

Thank you.

We don't know.

Do you agree there is something outside the known universe pulling huge clusters of galaxies towards it?

[Blake]

ok so from what I can gather from all these topics is..........

There was a huge bang then the earth took a few billion years to cool down then some sort of bacteria formed legs crawled out of the warm liquid and evolved into many different creatures, and after a few billion more years there was man?

And your saying all theses creatures that have no souls evolved into a human that can care,hate,love,cry,think,invent,laugh,kill,forgive ,create,and worship?

oh almost forgot .....can also deceive others.

And the other option is a creator? What do you think common sense suggest?

has it ever occured to you that god might have created the universe 14 billion years ago using a big bang?

[Blake]

Thank you.

fantastic thank you.

Do you agree there is something outside the known universe pulling huge clusters of galaxies towards it?

It has been observed that something beyond the visible universe is pulling galaxy clusters to it at extraordinary speeds.

What do you think it is that is outside the bubble?

[Blake]

Do you know that the article you linked made reference to a 14 billion old universe?

Do you still believe in a young universe?

[rjv]

i'm surprised no one has even brought up the topics of multiverses yet (or string theory and the 11 or 12 dimensions which should exist, mathematically speaking).

good to see you to blake (it would be nice to use a&m beating tech this weekend as an example of a "miracle" )

[z0sa]

It has been observed that something beyond the visible universe is pulling galaxy clusters to it at extraordinary speeds.

This is wrong in a very key area. Reread the article, dimwit.

Second, you don't believe in a mega massive spaghetti monster. Why do you contend one is pulling clusters of hundreds of galaxies towards itself?

[z0sa]

Do you know that the article you linked made reference to a 14 billion old universe?

Yep.

Do you still believe in a young universe?

Did you read the article?

[Blake]

i'm surprised no one has even brought up the topics of multiverses yet (or string theory and the 11 or 12 dimensions which should exist, mathematically speaking).

that starts around page 20

good to see you to blake (it would be nice to use a&m beating tech this weekend as an example of a "miracle" )

too bad the only way to see it is to go to the game in lubbock.....

a&m stinks so bad that nobody wants to pick up the coverage. If they can keep the deficit to with 30, it will be a miracle.

[Blake]

This is wrong in a very key area. Reread the article, dimwit.

A survey of hundreds of moving galaxy clusters, each of which contains hundreds of millions of stars, shows that they are defying expectations by moving at roughly two million miles per hour towards a particular location that may lie beyond the horizon of our observable universe.

The universe is approximately 14 billion years old and the "cosmological horizon" is defined by the distance from where the light emitted at the moment of the big bang reaches us today - roughly 14 billion light years.

Reread your article, dimwit.

Second, you don't believe in a mega massive spaghetti monster. Why do you contend one is pulling clusters of hundreds of galaxies towards itself?

I never said I believe a mega massive spaghetti monster is pulling clusters of galaxies towards itself.

reread my posts, dimwit.

you still haven't answered the question.

"what do you think is outside the bubble that is pulling these clusters?"


You can't win.

[Blake]

Yep.

Do you believe in your article?

Did you read the article?

Yep.

[z0sa]

Reread your article, dimwit.

Did you or did you not say they are being dragged beyond the visible universe?

I never said I believe a mega massive spaghetti monster is pulling clusters of galaxies towards itself.

Yes, you did. I know it makes you realize how stupid you are.

you still haven't answered the question.

"what do you think is outside the bubble that is pulling these clusters?"

Because I'm still discerning why it would be a flying spaghetti monster, Blake.

According to your theory, is it pulling the galaxies with its invisible noodly appendage?

You can't win.

You're an easily outsmarted person, and your arguments are full of logical fallacies. Therefore, I contend not only can I win, I do so by default.

[Blake]

Did you or did you not say they are being dragged beyond the visible universe?

I said:

It has been observed that something beyond the visible universe is pulling galaxy clusters to it at extraordinary speeds.

What do you think it is that is outside the bubble?

Yes, you did. I know it makes you realize how stupid you are.

yes, that is my mistake for you using sarcasm. Apparently you don't know how to detect it.

It's also why when you directly asked "do you believe in FSM?" I said, "no".

Because I'm still discerning why it would be a flying spaghetti monster, Blake.

According to your theory, is it pulling the galaxies with its invisible noodly appendage?

No. what do you think is pulling it?

You're an easily outsmarted person, and your arguments are full of logical fallacies. Therefore, I contend not only can I win, I do so by default.

what do you think is pulling it?

Do you believe your article is correct?

Are you simply trolling this thread?

Why can you not detect sarcasm?

You are an idiot.

[z0sa]

Does a dark flow suggest God exists in your opinion?

What's outside of the bubble?

A Flying Spaghetti Monster

So a Flying Spaghetti Monster has been pulling thousands of galaxies from outside the observable universe for 5 billion years?

Disprove it.

I never said I believe a mega massive spaghetti monster is pulling clusters of galaxies towards itself.

You can't prove a negative. Therefore, you're clearly implying that is what is pulling the galaxies out.

You're one of the challenged kids, I understand.

Only a re like Blake could misuse Pastafarianism

[rjv]

an interesting excerpt from an article in discovery:

“Scientism,” Dawkins tells me later, “is the pejorative word sometimes used for the view that science can explain everything and kind of arrogates to itself the privilege of explaining everything. Science cannot tell you what is right and wrong. When it comes to really interesting questions, like ‘Where did the laws of physics come from?’ or ‘How did the universe arrive in the first place?’ I genuinely don’t know whether science will answer those deep and at present mysterious questions; I am confident that if science can’t answer them, nothing else can. But it may be that nothing will ever answer them.”
Dawkins expresses skepticism at the Church’s mission to build a bridge between science and theology with the use of philosophy. “There is nothing to build a bridge to,” he says. “Theology is a complete and utter non­subject.” At one point in my talk with Dawkins, Father George Coyne, the well-respected retired head of the Vatican Observatory (and, as such, a former member of the Academy of Sciences), becomes the subject of conversation.
“I met him a few weeks ago and liked him very much,” Dawkins says. “And he said to me that there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to believe in God, and so I said, ‘Why do you believe in God?’ and he said: ‘It’s quite simple. I was brought up Catholic.’ When I think about good scientists — and some are devoutly religious and many of them are Catholic, Jesuit brothers and priests, for instance — I can never make out whether they are compartmentalizing their minds. Sometimes if you press them, it turns out that what they believe is something very different from what it says in the Creed. It turns out that all they really believe is that there is some deeply mysterious unknown at the root of the universe.”
Dawkins’s comments stuck with me. In the many interviews I had with priests, each expressed a sophisticated theology that seemed far more abstract than what you might find occupying the mind of an average believer. Is belief in a deeply mysterious unknown root of the universe such a bad thing for science, even if it is perceived through the framework of Christian concepts and imagery?
“I did not tell Richard Dawkins that there was no reason to believe in God,” says Coyne, who counts Dawkins a friend. “I said reasons are not adequate. Faith is not irrational, it is arational; it goes beyond reason. It doesn’t contradict reason. So my take is precisely that faith, to me, is a gift from God. I didn’t reason to it, I didn’t merit it — it was given to me as a gift through my family and my teachers.... My science helps to enrich that gift from God, because I see in his creation what a marvelous and loving god he is. For instance, by making the universe an evolutionary universe — he didn’t make it a ready-made, like a washing machine or a car — he made it a universe that has in it a participation of creativity. Dawkins’s real question to me should be, ‘How come you have the gift of faith and I don’t?’ And that’s an embarrassment for me. The only thing I can say is that either you have it and don’t know it, or God works with each of us differently, and God does not deny that gift to anybody. I firmly believe that.”



this takes me to the point i want to make which is that i firmly believe that some personalities evolve or shape into a mind set that just cannot rationalize the existence of god and thus there is no faith in god's existence for such personalities. whereas other personalities do make that assertion. additionally, language really limits our abilities to really express our inner beliefs and even limits our arguments for or against the existence of god as well, because as i have mentioned before almost all of it becomes metaphysical. even dawkins concedes as much when he indicates that all science can really offer is tautology. it is interesting to me, however, that here we have two rational, scientific minds on opposite ends of belief, and yet sharing a mutual appreciation for one another. it reminds me of the subject in the book albert camus and the minister.

just thought i'd bring this up as a side point.

[rascal]

Only after you explain your proposition that belief in God can be reconciled with science...

This is a cope out to not answer the question.

[ElNono]

This is a cope out to not answer the question.

Not really. I asked first and got no response.

[Blake]

You can't prove a negative. Therefore, you're clearly implying that is what is pulling the galaxies out.

I've clearly stated I was being sarcastic and do not believe such.

But since you fail to put it all together:

"There is no spaghetti monster pulling the galaxies out."

You're one of the challenged kids, I understand.

I understand you are failing miserably at the game.

Only a re like Blake could misuse Pastafarianism

I did not misuse anything.

What do you think is pulling at the galaxies?

You brought it up. Simple question that you have failed to answer now for about the 5th time.

You are losing again as usual.