What to do with RJ

[ElNono]

You can tell he's not comfortable out there. He needs the ball in his hands. He's turning into a spot up shooter when he's with the starting unit and we need him to be much more than that.

- Does Pop need to call and iso or two just for him to see if we can get him going?
- Should we move him to the bench and let him handle the rock more often in that role?
- Do we just let him be a spot up shooter and live with whatever he can give us?
- Is it too early to worry about this?

This is not a knock on RJ. I'm just interested in what you all think...

[HarlemHeat37]

It's not too early at all..this is the time we should be talking about this and adjusting to RJ's game..

Jefferson isn't a great 1 on 1 player at all..that's pretty much all he's getting right now from an individual standpoint..1 on 1 or spot-up shooting, and he isn't great at either of those..he can do it against certain teams, but not against most..

We've seen some success from RJ when he's coming off screens towards the basket..curling to the basket during the 2-man game with Duncan..quick moves off the catch and driving baseline..pretty good at posting up..great at finishing on the break..we just need to see more of that..

He CAN'T play consistently when it's 1 on 1 off the dribble, especially when he's doing it through the middle..that isn't working, and I don't want to see it anymore..

[murpjf88]

Nothing. You can't fix what is broken. You can't give him the ball and tell him to create his own shot because he can't finish. You can't have him drive the lane because he'll lose the basketball. The only you can do is let him shoot spot up jump shots. He can't screw that up. The spurs dropped the ball. They needed a player like vince and settled for a player in RJ. It will probably cost them in the long run

[timvp]

The main problem with RJ right now is lack of spacing when he's on the court with Duncan. It's difficult for him to post up when Duncan is also down low. Plus his driving lanes aren't as open with TD on the court. Add in the fact that RJ isn't a very good pick-and-roll player at this point and it has him struggling to spread his wings.

I think Pop needs to call more plays for RJ to get him going early. Running more often will help. Duncan also needs to figure out what RJ likes to do and go to the high post more often.

It's a work in progress but I don't think it's time to worry. If the same issues are around come Christmas, then it may be time for more drastic efforts.

[bigdog]

I think the problem is actually with Parker. With Parker in the game at the same time, Jefferson is much less effective. I'd like to see more running, also. Another thing would be to possibly run those same plays where Finley comes off screens for Jefferson. Another thing would be to maybe run some plays that are set for RJ to cut to the basket like maybe a backdoor play. Posting him up works only when Duncan is either at the high post or out of the game. Like timvp said, his cutting lanes aren't open right now, so the spurs need to find a way to get him going, and get him going early.

[SpursRulez4eVeR]

maybe he should starts moving around more and work harder to get to where he wants the ball EARLY... i always see him stand beyond the three point arc ...i mean i even see bogans slashes to the basket more times than RJ does ...

[024]

i would like to see him concentrate more on defense and then taking over the scoring load when duncan and parker aren't on the floor.

[honestfool84]

i wouldn't mind him being regulated to the bench.. but then what happens to manu?

like many of y'all have said, i think it's a bit early to worry, but come january...if we still have a problem, then we can start worrying.

[exstatic]

We're not even close to having set rotations yet. When everyone is healthy and playing normal minutes, Pop will start mixing and matching and working out combos to be on the floor together.

[Spursfan092120]

Nothing. You can't fix what is broken. You can't give him the ball and tell him to create his own shot because he can't finish. You can't have him drive the lane because he'll lose the basketball. The only you can do is let him shoot spot up jump shots. He can't screw that up. The spurs dropped the ball. They needed a player like vince and settled for a player in RJ. It will probably cost them in the long run

Very dumb post here...RJ has a lot of talent, as he showed when Tony and Tim were out of the lineup. He CAN drive..he CAN create...have you even watched the Spurs this year? When put with the right lineup, and the right offensive strategy, he does a lot of good things for this team on offense. He just has to find his flow in our system...and that's not easy for anyone to do.

[jag]

I think the problem is actually with Parker.

This is getting irritating.

[duhoh]

Nothing. You can't fix what is broken. You can't give him the ball and tell him to create his own shot because he can't finish. You can't have him drive the lane because he'll lose the basketball. The only you can do is let him shoot spot up jump shots. He can't screw that up. The spurs dropped the ball. They needed a player like vince and settled for a player in RJ. It will probably cost them in the long run

re ation has hit a new low

[murpjf88]

re ation has hit a new low

Your wearing blinders. Come back to this thread after game 40. If you wanna see a re , look in the mirror.

[all_heart]

Nothing. You can't fix what is broken. You can't give him the ball and tell him to create his own shot because he can't finish. You can't have him drive the lane because he'll lose the basketball. The only you can do is let him shoot spot up jump shots. He can't screw that up. The spurs dropped the ball. They needed a player like vince and settled for a player in RJ. It will probably cost them in the long run

Can't agree w/this. RJ can finish, that's not the problem. I think Pop needs to call plays for him and like timvp said, spacing needs to be right for him. I would like to see RJ attack the basket more often and just takes what the defensive gives him w/out forcing anything, cause like you said he loses the ball, bad shot etc.. I wouldn't worry about RJ.

[draft87]

Nothing. You can't fix what is broken. You can't give him the ball and tell him to create his own shot because he can't finish. You can't have him drive the lane because he'll lose the basketball. The only you can do is let him shoot spot up jump shots. He can't screw that up. The spurs dropped the ball. They needed a player like vince and settled for a player in RJ. It will probably cost them in the long run

re ation has hit a new low

Your wearing blinders. Come back to this thread after game 40. If you wanna see a re , look in the mirror.

I haven't noticed Murpjf88 that much...is this person an intentional button pusher? like, someone pretending to be totally stupid? Looks like it, Vince>RJ ...."Your=You're"......really re ed basketball talk..... people aren't REALLY that dumb, right?

[timvp]

I think the problem is actually with Parker.

This is a weird myth. Most of RJ's open jumpers that he has gotten in the last few games have been due to Parker's penetration.

Tonight, for example, when RJ played with Parker he got seven field goal attempts in 18 minutes. When he played with Hill running the show, he got two field goal attempts in 14 minutes.

[Spursfan092120]

I haven't noticed Murpjf88 that much...is this person an intentional button pusher? like, someone pretending to be totally stupid? Looks like it, Vince>RJ ...."Your=You're"......really re ed basketball talk..... people aren't REALLY that dumb, right?

If and how he reacts to this post will tell us the answer.

[Spursfan092120]

This is a weird myth. Most of RJ's open jumpers that he has gotten in the last few games have been due to Parker's penetration.

Tonight, for example, when RJ played with Parker he got seven field goal attempts in 18 minutes. When he played with Hill running the show, he got two field goal attempts in 14 minutes.

That's true. I was there tonight. I too was one of the "Parker is RJ's problem" guys. It really seemed tonight that they looked better...RJ just didn't seem too comfortable. Maybe it's us. I mean..in Milwaukee, they NEEDED him to score like he did. Here, we don't need him to. It would be nice for him to average 20 a game, but then again, I think our team will be at it's apex when NOBODY is averaging 20, but we have a bunch averaging 15-19 points a game.

[draft87]

You can tell he's not comfortable out there. He needs the ball in his hands. He's turning into a spot up shooter when he's with the starting unit and we need him to be much more than that.

- Does Pop need to call and iso or two just for him to see if we can get him going?
- Should we move him to the bench and let him handle the rock more often in that role?
- Do we just let him be a spot up shooter and live with whatever he can give us?
- Is it too early to worry about this?

This is not a knock on RJ. I'm just interested in what you all think...

I agree with your concern and with most of the responses.

1) Is it too early to worry? Yes

2) Does that mean we shouldn't be proactive? No.



I started a thread led "2010 Offense"
It has a link to a spreadsheet I did predicting rotations and stats.
The reason I did this is because I feel like some other members have stated: too many stars.

There's something to be said for dudes that can put up 5-12 ppg and NOT need the ball in their hands to get a rhythm and play their role. I love our current roster and I've been looking forward to the season since we started making transactions.

However, I'm also wondering how we're gonna pull it off. From a team and fan perspective this is a level of talent that nobody is used to. We're gonna have to be comfortable with everybody's stats declining. We're gonna need faith that we can become a greater team on the court even though our #s look low on paper. The only thing that should be up on paper is the total score.

RJ didn't play a bad game tonight. It wasn't his best, and he definitely struggled in some areas, and on paper his shooting looks messy BUT he was involved in some great plays. His passing and defense were good. If RJ is ok with how he played. If Pop is, if the team is...and is comfortable knowing there will be times when he (has to) go to town, like against Dallas, then Pop won't have to do too much for RJ and his role.

Does RJ need a lot of touches to get comfortable? So far he has looked more comfortable with the ball more but this might just need adjusting. Look at his career-last year he took on a large offensive load in Milwaukee being that Michael Redd and Andrew Bogut missed significant time. New Jersey was slowly decaying into an offense so poor he NEEDED to drop 26 for them to get to 80. Actually they went back and forth on that-sometimes scoring a lot sometimes in a drought. But as time went on and KMart and Kidd left, Carter went in an out of injury, RJ learned to put matters in his own hands. He's been creating plays for himself for a while now. There were the days when he could count on JKidd to do that for him and I think he can tap back into that mentality and fit in with the Big 3,4, or 5.

Take a peek at my predictions. I'm not saying I'm totally right or I'm a prophet, I mean it only for an aid thinking things through. I don't have anyone averaging more than 17ppg and the role players average 1-8 ppg yet the average total score is 119. That's huge. Look at tonight- 118 total points and on paper it looks like RJ had a rough game, Manu was gone so we must be screwed, George/Bogans couldn't throw it in the ocean. That was not the case. If everyone was on their "A" game every game we'd be scoring 160 points a night. That's just not gonna happen.

The question should be this: "Who's gonna NOT score if we give RJ a bigger role?"

RJs size, athleticism, IQ, and defense will probably benefit the starting lineup. I think the name of the starting SG will also determine whether or not RJ remains a starter. Pulling him pretty much means that Manu would have to start. Their role as 2nd unit playmaker would pretty much be redundant. I do not think that either Manu will be healthy or starting. I hope to God he's healthy so let's just assume what's most likely-he'll be our star 6th man. I'm ok with pulling RJ when Manu comes in AND making the switch early. I like Bogans starting at 2. Even though he's a bit undersized I like him guarding 3s when Manu comes in. The subs ution in skill set works with Bogans swinging from 2-3. Then I like RJ being the segue from Manu eventually running the 2nd unit to taking a break. RJ looked great with Hill, Mason, Blair, and Finley.

RJ looks motivated. He's a team player and he wants to win. He values the tough, positive at ude that Hill has captured and Pop is going to count on the rest of the season. I think he'll end up contributing much more than points(defense, hustle, IQ) to this team and we'll look back and think it a bit silly wondering how to get him to score 25ppg.

[Chieflion]

Jefferson's problem is now within himself. He is not getting any plays run for him and is driving on mostly broken plays, which is not something you want to see out of Pop's system. Now, Jefferson is just big three insurance. He will be called upon to take on the scoring load when someone is injured. I am starting to think he was only traded for because he is a rare player who can play all 82 games for a season.

[TJastal]

We're not even close to having set rotations yet. When everyone is healthy and playing normal minutes, Pop will start mixing and matching and working out combos to be on the floor together.

Wee......


o another 10 game slump.

[TJastal]

I like RJ in the starting unit for his toughness, defense, and rebounding alone and I believe Parker and Duncan will figure out some ways to get him some easy scoring opportunities just like they've done for each other over the years.

If nothing else, Pop should call a play or two for him in the 1st quarter to try to get him involved. Either a clear-out or deep post up, anything that results in a high% shot.

[Spurs Brazil]

The main problem with RJ right now is lack of spacing when he's on the court with Duncan. It's difficult for him to post up when Duncan is also down low. Plus his driving lanes aren't as open with TD on the court. Add in the fact that RJ isn't a very good pick-and-roll player at this point and it has him struggling to spread his wings.

I think Pop noticed that yesterday too. RJ was with the team who played the 4th with TD on the bench. Maybe Pop will sub RJ earlier and put him back when TD sit. But they’ll need to address this for the long run, since RJ and TD will be together to finish games.

I think some blame needs to go to RJ too. He needs to be more aggressive cutting the lane and attacking. Right now he’s only waiting the ball on the corners.

The good thing is his D is improving, man to man and also team D. He’s much better than the first 2 weeks of the season

[TwoHandJam]

What's happening to RJ used to happen to Manu as well when he was in the starting lineup. Parker and Duncan would often dominate the ball and he would turn into a spot up shooter. I agree that Pop needs to work on having RJ become more than just a 3 point threat but I do recognize that Tim down low affects his ability to slash just as it did for Manu.

RJ can not only slash but also post up and finish the break. It still bothers me to see Parker often start and finish his own fast break (sometimes driving into defenders looking for contact) when he has a player now that can finish with a high percentage dunk.

It might be a good idea to leave RJ on when Tim checks out and let him play with the reserves a bit. He seemed to have good synergy with Manu and Hill when both Tim and Tony were out - also Tim wouldn't be down low to affect his game.

[mingus]

RJ is not knocking down his jumpers (esp. the three) and teams obviously have scouting reports on that. defenders are giving him that shot and stepping back to make it harder for him to drive.

one of the main things that makes players successful on this team, and in this system, is the ability to knock down the open three. tons of players have come through here and done just that on offense: S-Jax, Brent Barry, Mario Elie, Jaren Jackson, etc. it's a neccessity when the offense goes through either Manu, Parker, or Timmy 90% of the time and you're getting open looks. McDyess is really starting to shine in this system because he's doing that.

BUT, i would like to see him in the post more (Pop talked about this in the beginning). he needs to get easy baskets tog et confidence.