The official "It's only December" thread.

[Mel_13]

Parker played all summer so he should clearly be in rhythm. As for Ginobili, I think he maybe is done. I also think the FO understood that and tried to bring in more firepower in Richard Jefferson.

Bottom line is clear. If those three don't play better, the Spurs won't be contenders. Which is what prompted the last question in my last post. What say you on that?

For me, Parker's summer and the ankle injury are part of the reason for his less than stellar play.

[Chieflion]

Bottom line is clear. If those three don't play better, the Spurs won't be contenders. Which is what prompted the last question in my last post. What say you on that?

For me, Parker's summer and the ankle injury are part of the reason for his less than stellar play.

It is simple. A team can only go as far as their top players take them. Which is why I usually don't blame role players for losses. If he is an injury, he should just rest it out. I realise he does not want to see his team lose but in the long run, his ankle injury would come back to haunt him for the rest of his career, and his speed made him the player he is. As for Ginobili, I think he is done playing at an all-star level. Jefferson on the other hand, was never an all-star and never went to the All-Star weekend before as he did not want to be there if he is not on the All-Star team, he is brought in to score and is not getting his touches.

If they fail to do so, a re-tooling is necessary. For the idiots at home, re-tooling does not mean rebuilding.

[SpurNation]

This year IS different for several reasons. Age of our key players. Brutal B2B's at the end of the season this year. Acclimation of a roster that features 3 new faces in the starting lineup as well as a rookie and 2nd year player as possible key components coming off the bench.

Factor that along with the annual rodeo trip...Early wins this year are more important than in years past IMO.

To help this happen, I would start Parker, Duncan, Ginobili, Jefferson and McDyess until February. Then alterenate the starters during the rodeo road trip only to bring back that starting 5 during the last 2 months of the season for the first games of those B2B's and the games between.

[Mel_13]

It is simple. A team can only go as far as their top players take them. Which is why I usually don't blame role players for losses. If he is an injury, he should just rest it out. I realise he does not want to see his team lose but in the long run, his ankle injury would come back to haunt him for the rest of his career, and his speed made him the player he is. As for Ginobili, I think he is done playing at an all-star level. Jefferson on the other hand, was never an all-star and never went to the All-Star weekend before as he did not want to be there if he is not on the All-Star team, he is brought in to score and is not getting his touches.

If they fail to do so, a re-tooling is necessary. For the idiots at home, re-tooling does not mean rebuilding.

Now you lost me. First a definition. Retooling, to me, means keeping your core and adding to it. That's what they attempted to do this past summer.

If the main problem is found within the group of Tony, Manu, and RJ, how can you retool without breaking up the core? To take it to a further level of detail:

1. The RJ was an unequal or unbalanced trade. The conventional recap of that deal was that the Spurs increased the talent level of the team by accepting a significant increase in payroll. The Bucks saved money by losing talent. Trading RJ's contract now to improve the team would seem to be nearly impossible for the very same reasons. Trading his contract to reduce payroll may become possible, but that would be part of a rebuild rather than a retool.

2. Trading Tony has to net a PG in return. So where are the trade partners that would want Tony enough to send back a decent PG plus another player good enough to improve the team? I don't see it. Now trading Tony to a contender for a package of players with potential may be possible, but again that would be rebuilding rather than retooloing.

3. So we're left with treating Manu as an expiring contract and trying to find another unequal trade where the Spurs improve by assuming increased future payroll expenses. If you assume that Manu can't help the Spurs win any longer, then there would be some possibilities in this area, but no sure things ( Manu for SJax plus filler, for example). There is one big problem with this approach. If things are not going well with the retooling efforts from this past summer, I have serious doubts that ownership would approve even more spending to undergo a midseason retooling.

My best guess is that this is the group that we'll see all season, with the possibility of a minor tweak along the way. Based on how close this group comes to becoming a championship contender will determine whether we see further retooling next summer or the inevitable start of a rebuilding effort.

[Chieflion]

Now you lost me. First a definition. Retooling, to me, means keeping your core and adding to it. That's what they attempted to do this past summer.

If the main problem is found within the group of Tony, Manu, and RJ, how can you retool without breaking up the core? To take it to a further level of detail:

1. The RJ was an unequal or unbalanced trade. The conventional recap of that deal was that the Spurs increased the talent level of the team by accepting a significant increase in payroll. The Bucks saved money by losing talent. Trading RJ's contract now to improve the team would seem to be nearly impossible for the very same reasons. Trading his contract to reduce payroll may become possible, but that would be part of a rebuild rather than a retool.

2. Trading Tony has to net a PG in return. So where are the trade partners that would want Tony enough to send back a decent PG plus another player good enough to improve the team? I don't see it. Now trading Tony to a contender for a package of players with potential may be possible, but again that would be rebuilding rather than retooloing.

3. So we're left with treating Manu as an expiring contract and trying to find another unequal trade where the Spurs improve by assuming increased future payroll expenses. If you assume that Manu can't help the Spurs win any longer, then there would be some possibilities in this area, but no sure things ( Manu for SJax plus filler, for example). There is one big problem with this approach. If things are not going well with the retooling efforts from this past summer, I have serious doubts that ownership would approve even more spending to undergo a midseason retooling.

My best guess is that this is the group that we'll see all season, with the possibility of a minor tweak along the way. Based on how close this group comes to becoming a championship contender will determine whether we see further retooling next summer or the inevitable start of a rebuilding effort.

The expiring role players can be traded for better role players whose contracts expire in 2011/12. This is what I meant. Role players who can score and defend at the same time, which will reduce the load of the team. At the same time, the team needs to shop Manu around. Manu can be had if a clear upgrade is available.

[LOL@MavsFan]

First of all, who doesn't go on a win streak, maybe New Jersey and Minnesota. Heck, even the Knicks had a win streak. What is your definition of a win streak?

6-10 games in a row....is that okay or should I have more or less????

[admiralsnackbar]

The expiring role players can be traded for better role players whose contracts expire in 2011/12. This is what I meant. Role players who can score and defend at the same time, which will reduce the load of the team. At the same time, the team needs to shop Manu around. Manu can be had if a clear upgrade is available.

Why is the assumption always that upgrades are available? Tony's stinking it up lately, but who could we realistically get in return that would actually help the team? Manu is an unknown quan y thanks to his health, which means his trade value would be solely based upon his expiring contract. Given that, when healthy, he plays well above his dollar value, we would stand a high chance of trading for a lesser player.

As for our expiring role players: they all play well above their market value (excepting, perhaps, Mase), making 9/10ths of all realistic trade scenarios redundant or a down-grade. We could dream for a role-player package to get us an a-list player, but the combined salaries of our utility guys still don't add up to much, so again, I have trouble seeing a return on our investment.

[Chieflion]

Why is the assumption always that upgrades are available? Tony's stinking it up lately, but who could we realistically get in return that would actually help the team? Manu is an unknown quan y thanks to his health, which means his trade value would be solely based upon his expiring contract. Given that, when healthy, he plays well above his dollar value, we would stand a high chance of trading for a lesser player.

As for our expiring role players: they all play well above their market value (excepting, perhaps, Mase), making 9/10ths of all realistic trade scenarios redundant or a down-grade. We could dream for a role-player package to get us an a-list player, but the combined salaries of our utility guys still don't add up to much, so again, I have trouble seeing a return on our investment.

Who cares? It is do or die at this point. Aside from Manu's game against Toronto, there are no games you could think of that helps to think that Ginobili can be back at full strength. Looks like he is more injury prone every game. If everything does not work, we are going to be looking at the 2011 FA class which includes the 2007 draft class who did not get an extension. This year will mark the end of the glory days of the San Antonio Spurs if we do not win the championship because Timmy will continue his slow decline.

For the bolded part, yes it is true they are playing above expected levels and Spurs fans are still blaming the loss on them. To be honest, no one likes to hear this, but the Lakers have a better starting line-up than the Spurs so the bench needs to take advantage. I am not looking for any stars at this point, just starters who are willing to play off the bench productively and not lose our firepower. The Spurs have the contract and should do whatever it takes to get us a Mikael Pietrus and Kendrick Perkins type of player if at all possible.

[admiralsnackbar]

Who cares? It is do or die at this point.

It's not do or die, man -- it's December. Besides, given how injury-prone our big three threatens to be, the idea of depleting the bench at several positions in order to bolster one seems ill-advised. We have most of the tools we need to win a championship (along with some odds and ends that may prove useful if we can figure out how best to use them, like Blair), we just need to stop trying to fix ourselves on paper and get to the business of fixing ourselves on the court.

[Yogurt210]

The injuries are a blessing in disguise. It forces pop to play other players and how to effectively use them.
Let’s bite the bullet now and bare with our team, and enjoy and reap the prize come playoff time. We will be ready.

[JP le Requin]

because its amlost christmas...my girlfriend made a black & silver christmas tree...(sapin de noel in french)



we wanted to share it :-)

[duncan228]

because its amlost christmas...my girlfriend made a black & silver christmas tree...(sapin de noel in french)



we wanted to share it :-)

These would be great on it.

San Antonio Spurs NBA Candy Cane Ornament Set of 6



$13.95

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...SIN=B002LL88KK

[portnoy1]

Thought I might get this started. Some people really need this.

Its only december then January and february and...... Hey!! what do ya know, its April and RJ still cant stop anybody, Parker still cant see the floor and aw crud Manu's ankle is hurting.

[LOL@MavsFan]

Its only december then January and february and...... Hey!! what do ya know, its April and RJ still cant stop anybody, Parker still cant see the floor and aw crud Manu's ankle is hurting.

You guys are the best...

[LOL@MavsFan]

Who cares? It is do or die at this point. Aside from Manu's game against Toronto, there are no games you could think of that helps to think that Ginobili can be back at full strength. Looks like he is more injury prone every game. If everything does not work, we are going to be looking at the 2011 FA class which includes the 2007 draft class who did not get an extension. This year will mark the end of the glory days of the San Antonio Spurs if we do not win the championship because Timmy will continue his slow decline.

For the bolded part, yes it is true they are playing above expected levels and Spurs fans are still blaming the loss on them. To be honest, no one likes to hear this, but the Lakers have a better starting line-up than the Spurs so the bench needs to take advantage. I am not looking for any stars at this point, just starters who are willing to play off the bench productively and not lose our firepower. The Spurs have the contract and should do whatever it takes to get us a Mikael Pietrus and Kendrick Perkins type of player if at all possible.

He was hurt and tonight will be his 3rd game back after missing a couple weeks and half the NBA season last year and he didn't play at all in the summer. Armchair qbs like you expect too much from this guy right away. Give him a chance. I am guessing you have never injured your knee, ankle before, let alone both. It takes awhile to get back to where you were at before the injury. I messed up my knee before, so I know what he is going through.

[Chieflion]

He was hurt and tonight will be his 3rd game back after missing a couple weeks and half the NBA season last year and he didn't play at all in the summer. Armchair qbs like you expect too much from this guy right away. Give him a chance. I am guessing you have never injured your knee, ankle before, let alone both. It takes awhile to get back to where you were at before the injury. I messed up my knee before, so I know what he is going through.

Let me tell you that Manu Ginobili is never going to be the same. There is no way he can go back to his prime form. His days as an all-star calibre player is done. He could still be a star who can put in explosive games once in a while but he is not going to be the Manu Ginobli we all know. For your information, my knee has been hurting since last year and I can't jump properly now, so don't think my knee ain't ed up. I am not so sure what it is and doctor said there was nothing wrong but I got no idea why I limp around after I jump.

[Chieflion]

It's not do or die, man -- it's December. Besides, given how injury-prone our big three threatens to be, the idea of depleting the bench at several positions in order to bolster one seems ill-advised. We have most of the tools we need to win a championship (along with some odds and ends that may prove useful if we can figure out how best to use them, like Blair), we just need to stop trying to fix ourselves on paper and get to the business of fixing ourselves on the court.

This is the kind of people who like to wait until the trade deadline to do something. The best part is that these are the same people that like to talk about chemistry.

[FilSpursFan]

Before "Its November", now "its December", what's next? "Its still January"? Come on, Spurs! Where's your MOJO?

[SKINNYPIMP210]

It's only December...

[Chomag]

Its only December.

[Chieflion]

I am glad to see you guys agree.

[mexicanjunior]

[Höfner]

Is someone arguing that it's not December?

[easy7]

Are we the new NBA Dallas cowboys?

[magui86770]

Are we the new NBA Dallas cowboys?

Funny!