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Kobe Bryant and this "clutch" garbage is HYPE. it's all ing MYTH. and that's a ing fact. People are just repeating it because they heard it somewhere, but it's NOT BASED ON ANY FACT WHATSOEVER
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/feature...ame/index.html
Kobe, LeBron or D-Wade: Which one is most clutch?
Posted Nov 5 2009 12:25PM
LeBron James #1
Carmelo #2
Wade #3
Bryant #4
Last week, we looked at clutch free-throw shooting, and that sparked a few questions like this one from Grady Farmer:
"Is Kobe Bryant really that more clutch than LeBron James or Dwyane Wade?"
So Grady, the answer is no. Kobe isn't more clutch than LeBron or D-Wade.
Kobe Bryant and this "clutch" garbage is HYPE. it's all ing MYTH. and that's a ing fact. People are just repeating it because they heard it somewhere, but it's NOT BASED ON ANY FACT WHATSOEVER
and of course
I will be labeled a "HATER" even though I'm posting ing FACTS AND STATS
if Kome was the real deal, I WOULD ING SAY IT.
HE'S OVERRATED. FACT.
And you're obsessed. FACT.
The Lakers are 11.8 points per 100 possessions better than their opponents when Kobe is in the game and 8.8 points per 100 possessions worse than their opponents when he sits. Meanwhile, the Cavs are 9.5 points better than their opponents when LeBron plays and only 5.7 points worse than their opponents when LeBron sits. Some of that has to do with the Cavs’ unorthodox strategy of making one of their worst five-man units their starting lineup, but in any case it’s a point in Kobe’s favor.
"I eat first," said Bryant. "Everybody knows that. It's not an issue."
Casey Jacobsen being a writer?
http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba...nding-success/
Going back to the question I asked…the best example for me to illustrate this situation is a former 2008 teammate: Pau Gasol. Drafted by Memphis in 2001, Pau blossomed from a skinny talented foreigner into one of the most athletic and feared offensive big men in the game. Memphis, a team no one expected to be any good for years, surrounded Pau with good role players like Battier, Bonzi Wells and Mike Miller. The Grizzlies made the playoffs for three consecutive years (2003-2006), although they got swept every year in the first round.
The question surrounding that team after those failures were: Is Pau really a “superstar” player? Can you build a championship team around him? Or was it that they needed to add more quality players around him to get to that next level? During the next year in 2007, frustrations boiled over after the Grizzlies took a giant step back and missed the Playoffs. Pau stated that summer that he wanted to be traded if Memphis wasn’t serious about contending for a championship. That next season, our team was bad and Pau made it clear he was unhappy. In a way to dump Gasol’s huge contract and save money, Memphis traded Pau to the Lakers at the trade deadline in 2008.
I knew Pau hit the lottery with his new situation. Most people think any good player would have been happy to be traded to L.A. and join forces with Kobe, but I would disagree. Kobe has such an alpha-male strangle hold that I believe there would be certain guys who, if unwilling to defer to Kobe, would mess up that team.
I always thought Pau Gasol was uncomfortable in the “franchise player” role. He didn’t want that pressure or responsibility, and I don’t mean that in a bad way. Not everyone is comfortable taking that on…some want to be paid like a franchise guy, but don’t want the rest that comes along with it. I always thought Pau would be much more comfortable as a second option on a good team, but the people in Memphis wanted more from him.
Pau is a team player with a star’s skill set. He is a great teammate because he loves to pass and he doesn’t care if he averages 20 and 10, as long as he is allowed to help a team win. Pau is a really, really good player, but he is not an true superstar. Kobe is. That is why the two of them have flourished together.
It's easy to define Kobe's clutch, there aren't any complex mathematical equations needed. Just count 'em up.
Oddly enough, in all of the "Kobe isn't clutch" articles I've read, this simple math is never brought up.
Bird 36
Kobe ~30
Jordan 25
EfficiencyIt's easy to define Kobe's clutch, there aren't any complex mathematical equations needed. Just count 'em up.
Oddly enough, in all of the "Kobe isn't clutch" articles I've read, this simple math is never brought up.
Bird 36
Kobe ~30
Jordan 25
Kobe has the lowest % of the Top 10. He's under 35%.
it also has a lot to do with the style of play. the lakers play a MUCH faster and offensive oriented style than the Cavs play.
Who cares about how efficient you are when you are winning the game? Do the other 9 "efficient" clutch players actually win games?
Cuz Kobe has won more than any active player and only trails Larry Legend.
Does clutch "efficiency" translate to wins? Please Name the top "10 most efficient" and clutch players please.
Let's see all the clutch "efficient" players ahead of Kobe on your list. Name those other 9 guys who are more "efficient" at clutch than Kobe and we'll talk about them.
Last edited by Allanon; 01-20-2010 at 01:04 PM.
Who cares about how efficient you are when you are winning the game? Do the other 9 "efficient" clutch players actually win games?
Cuz Kobe has won more than any active player and only trails Larry Legend.
Does clutch "efficiency" translate to wins? Please Name the top "10 most efficient" and clutch players please.
Let's see all the clutch "efficient" players ahead of Kobe on your list. Name those other 9 guys who are more "efficient" at clutch than Kobe and we'll talk about them.
Lebron
Ray Allen
Carmelo
Dirk
Vince Carter
Ben Gordon
Paul Pierce
Rashard Lewis
Hedo Turkoglu
are all above Kobe percentage wise. these are all players that has at least 10FGA on clutch situations. Per 82games.com thank you.
There are some great names on that list you gave.
Please show me where you got these numbers and I'll show you how flawed this list is.
so, with that logic, my non-NBA ass could attempt 1 million game winners, make 100 of them for an abysmal percentage, but still have 100 game winners and be 64 game winners ahead of Larry BirdIt's easy to define Kobe's clutch, there aren't any complex mathematical equations needed. Just count 'em up.
Oddly enough, in all of the "Kobe isn't clutch" articles I've read, this simple math is never brought up.
Bird 36
Kobe ~30
Jordan 25
Again, you are giving Kobe credit for having more attempts.
he made 30 something game winners, but you are forgetting that he has attempted the most, BY FAR, and has the worst efficiency.
The point is Kobe made them and won the games.
This is about winning the game. Kobe's won 4 games this year with the last shot.
Yet Kobe is less efficient than Shawn Marion according to your link:
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/feature...ame/index.html
So how many games has Shawn Marion won with his great efficiency?
Isn't "clutch" about winning the game or is it better to be "efficiently clutch" while losing the game?
Shawn Marion doesn't qualify with enough attempts.
LeBron, Carmelo, Wade, Allen do have enough game winning attempts
all of them have better efficiency at it than Kobe does.
You are being dishonest by calling a volume shooter 'the most clutch'
Oh, so now we have to qualify this list.
Please show me your list and where you are getting this information.
ps. Are you talking about the John Schuman list? Does that mean Manu Ginobili isn't "qualify" as clutch?
did you avoid reading my post up there?
I already posted the link
here it is again
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/feature...ame/index.html
Quote from the article :
Last week, we looked at clutch free-throw shooting, and that sparked a few questions like this one from Grady Farmer:
"Is Kobe Bryant really that more clutch than LeBron James or Dwyane Wade?"
So Grady, the answer is no. Kobe isn't more clutch than LeBron or D-Wade.
Ok. John Schuman article.
You said Marion doesn't qualify to be clutch because he doesn't have enough attempts.
Does this mean Manu Ginobili doesn't qualify to be clutch?
Here's another
http://www.82games.com/gamewinningshots.htm
LeBron is #1
Kobe is #4
so please, drop the bull myth about kobe being this godly clutch player. he's not.
anyone with a brain, honesty, and time to look at the facts, will realize that he's not even the best clutch player in the league right NOW, much less comparable to all time greats like MJ or Bird
We are still working out the flaws in the John Schumann article you posted.
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/feature...ame/index.html
Let's expose that one first.
Please tell me if Manu Ginobili is clutch or not?
...and then we get to Kobe Bryant. Kobe fans don't like to hear it, but while their man is #4 in the league in total game winners hit, he holds the top spot in a less glamorous category: most game winning opportunity missed shots!
42 - Kobe
35 - Vince Carter
33 - Joe Johnson, LeBron
32 - Crawford
31 - Billups
- from the 82games.com article
We are still working out the flaws in the John Schumann article you posted.
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/feature...ame/index.html
Let's expose that one first.
Please tell me if Manu Ginobili is clutch or not?
I don't care what you think about ginobili, what I do know is that LeBron and others are better clutch players than Kobe is, and the stats prove it.
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