I'll still take Kobe.
Kobe's been playing hurt and has teammates that have been hurt.
Has lebron played better lately...for sure and he's the #1 right now. Still, when Kobe was healthier earlier in the year, he was hands down the best and all of the pundits stated as such. People continue to disparage the greatest player since Magic.
There is an All Kobe, All the time thread here if you guys missed it:
http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthre...144287&page=19
People tend to forget it takes more than just being able to pass really well to be a good team leader. Kobe > Lebron as a leader. Kobe has taken soft, weak-minded players and maximized their talent. Scrubs on other teams become key players on the Lakers because of Kobe's influence. He made names like Trevor Ariza, Shannon Brown, and even SMUSH PARKER relevant. I'd still take Kobe without hesitation.
but of course. in other news sky is blue
Only delusional lakerfans would disagree
he made Trevor Ariza what he is???
and what brilliant careers are Smush Parker and Shannon Brown having
the point is he made them relevant, when those guys were struggling to find a place in the NBA.
he made Trevor Ariza what he is???
and what brilliant careers are Smush Parker and Shannon Brown having
Prove it.
how are Smush and Brown relevant? Smush is a scrub and Brown an average NBA player
Maybe you don't understand my point. When scrubs play with Kobe, Kobe elevates their play. When they don't play with Kobe (leave the lakers), they revert back to being scrubs or maybe slightly better than they were before playing with Kobe.
And you are right, brown is an average player. But you barely heard about him, if at all, when he was on the cavs or bobcats.
The point is actually a valid one.
When Smush Parker played alongside Kobe, he was not very good, but at least a serviceable NBA player. Kobe is the reason Smush got a contract from the Heat. But since leaving the Lakers, Smush basically got dumped and can't get another NBA job. Before Shannon Brown got traded to the Lakers, he couldn't get any playing time on the other teams he was on. Now, playing alongside Kobe and practicing with Kobe every day, the once 15th man on the roster on bad teams is now a solid rotation team on a contender. The same goes for Trevor Ariza. With Kobe, a very good role player. Now not playing with Kobe and asked to do more individually, he's not very good.
The point made actually has quite a bit of merit.
Without a low post player Kobe has never done anything so of course if you give LeBron the same options he has this season he'd definantly elevate the team and probably wouldn't have choked on Garnett/Pierce like Kobe did either...what's new?
If i was famous i'd be banging kim kardashian, emanuelle chirqui, megan fox..
What ifs..
No doubt.
If i was famous i'd be banging kim kardashian, emanuelle chirqui, megan fox..
What ifs..
Maybe it's not Kobe that elevates their play. Maybe it's Phil Jackson and the system.
A lot more accurate.
At the end of the day though, Kobe's legacy is still solid.
LeBron will have a interesting career no doubt, but you're comparing someone with a history to someone without one.
Why not have both Kobe AND Lebron?
The Lakers should re-aquire Javaris Critterton so they can offer him on a trade for Lebron... worked the last time...
This is why even Reggie Miller, an LA guy and Laker fanatic, i.e. the last guy on Earth who would ever say something like this...can't deny that LeBron is a better player.
1A. LeBron leads by sharing the basketball with everybody on his team, regardless of how limited they are offensively.
1B. Bryant doesn't lead. Bryant does whatever he wants to do, which normally means jacking up tons of shots, and expects the other guys to be good despite what he's doing. And if they aren't good, he yells at them and demeans them, then goes to the press and cries for more "help."
2A. LeBron always has his teammates' back, and they respond by playing over their heads much of the time.
2B. As opposed to having his teammates' back, Bryant stabs them in the back. So his super-talented teammates often respond by playing below their capabilities.
3A. We all know how untalented Cleveland is apart from LeBron, yet they exceed expectations.
3B. We all know how talented the Lakers are, yet they do not always play up to expectations.
4A. LeBron truly elevates his teammates.
4B. Bryant truly alienates his teammates.
That probably has more to do with playing on a big market team like the Lakers than playing with Kobe. I see your point though.
LeBron's a great player and he does help his teammates score, but I think it's exaggerated how he makes his teammates play over their heads. I think that's a misconception. Larry Hughes got worse playing next to LeBron. Last year, Mo Williams was basically the same player he was in Milwaukee. The two areas he improved were his three point shooting, which makes sense since defenses do focus on LeBron so much. So that's one. And his free throw shooting, which has next to nothing to do with LeBron. In pretty much every other area, Mo Williams was pretty much the same or got worse. Donyell Marshall got worse playing next to LeBron. Which teammates did LeBron really make better? Anderson Varejao maybe? But, he's only played with the Cavs so we don't know if he'd be as good without LeBron. Players that were actually good who joined the Cavs didn't really become better players playing alongside LeBron.
There's a difference between being an unselfish player who gets teammates easy baskets and being a the type of teammate that actually makes other teammates better players. It takes more than just getting assists. LeBron helps teammates score. That doesn't necessarily mean he's elevating their games.
I've seen Kobe actually coach his teammates on the court and on the bench discussing strategies and sets. I see LeBron on the bench dancing and clipping his fingernails. You can call Kobe an asshole and a jerk. That would be true. But, just because he doesn't get as many assists as LeBron, it doesn't mean he doesn't help his teammates become better players. I think Jordan Farmar actually has learned and grown as a player from Kobe. I even think Kobe's bashing of Andrew Bynum actually motivated him to work harder to become better. I think as much of a jerk as Kobe can be, you cannot deny his work ethic and determination and will to be great, and that in itself can motivate teammates to step up their games, their practice habits, their training. LeBron is everybody's best friend on his team who hooks them up with cool shoes and gear and Beats by Dre headphones. Kobe is the guy teammates might think is a jerk and may even fear, but they respect at least when it comes to how he works and prepares for basketball.
You can look at it as LeBron is a nice guy and gets more assists and Kobe is a jerk and will berate his teammate and doesn't get as many assists, so LeBron must be the better teammate and better leader. But I think you'd be naive to think so.
I think Lebron now is better then Kobe. i also think Lebron now is better than MJ.
You must have wrote this back in 2006. Have you seen a game since then?
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