It means that Parker in your eyes can make no wrong. And I wasn't arguing about somebody saying something positive about TP or trying to make this a TP vs Manu thing, check my posting historial, you'll see that I'm not that kind of poster.
The only reason I compared Manu and Tony stats is 'cause I want to prove that Ginobili was the best Spurs player of game 1, if Havoc would have said Duncan was the best Spurs player of game 1 I would have compared Tim and Manu's stats. Seriously, how can anyone think that Manu wasn't our best player in the last game? he was our top scorer, assister and defender.
Of course he can make wrong, and he did made wrong, im not that kind of poster either. I just think he was our best player in that game, that doesnt mean im hating on Manu or something, or that tp can make no wrong. If you think otherwise, that's fine, I was just saying and agreeing with Havoc. If someone scores the most points (1 more) doesnt mean he automatically was the best and x factor player.
You guys are taking this the wrong way. LOL, you are providing career averages in different scenarios, and sure in game 1 he did shoot 33% from three but what's more important is it wasn't a result of 1 for 3, or 2 for 6... he shot 9 threes, and almost half of them were unnecessary. One of those did happen to go in, but the point about this is decision making, and not the actual shooting percentage itself...that's what I'm trying to get across. His 3% should have been better, but the actual % is not what is of concern.
The actual concern is the continuous trend lately of taking dumb threes, right at the beginning of possessions, in very closely battled important games in the playoffs in which the Spurs were struggling just to keep up with the Suns.
I've already explained why playing Suns-style will not help the Spurs beat the Suns...they have to play Spurs style. And Manu admitted it himself, what more do you want. In these big games where each possession is much more valuable, especially when trailing or just about tied, chucking threes with a man in your face and tons of time on the clock is not something that helps the team.
Now with that said, I'll say it again, Manu did many things to help the Spurs be in better position to win, obviously. Of course he did not play poorly. I'm strictly addressing a tiny part of the entire game.
What about getting more assists, rebounds and steals too?
well that was close too. What about one player having more minutes than the other?
Last edited by Bukefal; 05-05-2010 at 05:07 PM.
What you have to realize, and what you are missing is, the numbers are very similar...regardless of who technically played better, there's no use of comparing because it's close. Manu had one more point on one less shot attempt....big deal, these are marginal differences. Even when provided with all of the stats that are recorded in games, you can't always say who played better solely based on them, there are a lot of other parts to the game that aren't recorded. For example, Manu fell asleep a couple of times on defense, allowing Richardson to get some easy buckets...like that one where Nash was down in the paint dribbling in circles like he does and Manu was watching him instead of his man J-Rich in front of him who proceeded by cutting right to the basket for an easy 2 points. And that's just one aspect, there's tons of things that statistics simply don't measure.
With that said, I'm not saying Tony played better, or vice versa. They both played well and that is that.
--another example is assists...Manu had 5 while also having 3 turnovers, Tony 3 with only 1 turnover, so Parker's A/TO ratio was technically better, but this isn't even what I'm getting at. Assists are largely dependent on whether or not the player receiving the pass makes the shot.... and we both can agree that the Spurs did not shoot well, especially from the perimeter. Once we understand that not every good pass to an open teammate results in a made shot, we can realize that both numbers are subject to variability.
So all in all, they both played well and having slightly better stats does not necessarily equate to having played better.
So one more point in one less shot attempt, 3 more rebounds, 2 more assists and 4 more steals aren't important but two more minutes are?
Look, I think Manu was our best player you think Tony was, no big deal. They both played great and were our two best players, this is a stupid argument. I just got into it 'cause I was mad after the game. I won't spend another second on this.
Its not all about stats, its relative, it's more than that, especially if the stats of both are so close. I think TP lead the game and was the xfactor.
Besides, It doesnt even matter. I dont see this as a compe ion between Manu or TP, they are both part of our team. It probably matters for you. I was just saying that I think TP was the best in this particular game, that he played very well, nothing more nothing less and you bust my balls because of that, accusing me of tp 'cant make wrong for me'.
So, if you disagree fine, I see it differently. But, dont come saying TP cannot make wrong for me, because I dont care about that. maybe manu can make no wrong for you?
Im also glad TP showed a bit more of his old self
the stats clearly showed who had the better game...
I know it's not all about stats, I watched the game that's way I'm arguing about who the best player of the game was. The reason why I think Manu was our best player is 'cause besides of all he did in offense he was a pest on defense and that doesn't show on a stat sheet except for the steals.
No, it doesn't. I was just mad and bored and wanted to argue about something.Besides, It doesnt even matter. I dont see this as a compe ion between Manu or TP, they are both part of our team. It probably matters for you.
I'm a Manu homer but I try to keep it as objective as I can, I've been pretty critical of him several times and I even said that he was done earlier in the season.I was just saying that I think TP was the best in this particular game, that he played very well, nothing more nothing less and you bust my balls because of that, accusing me of tp 'cant make wrong for me'.
So, if you disagree fine, I see it differently. But, dont come saying TP cannot make wrong for me, because I dont care about that. maybe manu can make no wrong for you?
Im also glad TP showed a bit more of his old self
I've never seen a critical post about TP from you, which is cool, I don't have a problem with that especially with the ungodly amount of unfair criticism he gets in here, I just called you on it 'cause like I said I was cranky after the game and I was agruing about that point. Because that's what you do in a internet forum: argue about things. If you didn't feel like arguing you should just have ignored my post.
I like to argue, I don't mind that, thats why I post. I was just reacting to what you said, that tp cant make no wrong for me, because I dont really care about that. They are both our players and both played well. I like Manu and I praise him when needed. I get your point about being mad and bored, no problem. I guess TP and Manu topics have always been a sensitive/touchy subject on here, from every side
Now, let's hope they both have an outstanding game and see some beautiful sunset tonight
Compare pre Nose incident and post Nose incident season stats and lets see.
*bump*
Keep those re ed unnecessary threes comin' Manu if you wanna lose the game. I know you made a couple, but you were open on them, and there wasn't 20 seconds on the shot clock left.
Ginobili has been attempting those threes through his whole career, you take the good with the bad, same as the TOs. When those shots go in, they change the momentum of games, we just need one of them to go in.
It's a different game in the playoffs, and against the Suns as well. Like I've said several times in this thread, chucking threes will not help the Spurs hold their lead. They can't even hold half of the leads they build for over 2 minutes.
The Suns on the other hand take wide open threes, and that's what kills me. It's like Pop isn't even present in that aspect. I don't get how he hasn't stressed how important it is to get out on the Suns beyond the line.
They've had like 3 or 4 completely wide open threes, they camp out there.
How cute, Alvarez is up past his bed time.
Is it cute? I'm up til at least 3 or 4 am literally every night, it's impossible for me to be tired before then.
That's adorable.
What's adorable is Manu shooting a three while open from a pass from Parker and making it just now...amazing the difference.
And now he's cookin' up. Now establish both threats and attack that rim.
I bet you didn't hate that three.
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