Does this mean that I am a neocon?

[MiamiHeat]

and again, I want to ask

WHY ARE THESE "AMERICAN" STUDENTS OFFENDED AT THE SIGHT OF THE FLAG OF THEIR BIRTH COUNTRY?

what type of patriotism is this? seriously what the ?

a generation of ungrateful little s brainwashed by their parents to just "use and abuse" america because their "real mother country" is mexico but it's a hole right now?

[Winehole23]

These "Mexican-American" little s have been brainwashed by their immigrant parents. They basically see Mexico as their "nationality" and have no affiliation to AMERICA, where they live, enjoy prosperity, and these little s were probably even born here in USA.

How would you know so much about it?

[MiamiHeat]

How would you know so much about it?

I'm a ing wizard.

do you have another explanation?

[Winehole23]

and again, I want to ask

WHY ARE THESE "AMERICAN" STUDENTS OFFENDED AT THE SIGHT OF THE FLAG OF THEIR BIRTH COUNTRY?

You're hung up on the prop. The students were counter-protesting Cinco de Mayo. That's the supposed potential "disruption" here. The t-shirt could've been anything at all.

what type of patriotism is this? seriously what the ?

Idolatry of the flag and the nation aren't required, just strongly encouraged.

[Winehole23]

I'm a ing wizard.

[MiamiHeat]

You're hung up on the prop. The students were counter-protesting Cinco de Mayo. That's the supposed potential "disruption" here. The t-shirt could've been anything at all.

Why are these students celebrating Cinco de mayo with such fervor that they get offended by perceived "disruptions" in the first place?

Why are these kids doing this? They are americans, not mexicans.

Idolatry of the flag and the nation aren't required, just strongly encouraged.

We are many centuries away from a planet that no longer needs stupid borders and nationalities. Heck, maybe even many millenia away. Humans have a lot of growing up to do.

Until then, we all need to love our ing country, including the mother ing flag. Even with our George W Bush's and Karl Roves, our Wall Street ponzi schemes, and all the other bull . Any problem we have, can be fixed. Respect it, because it's our home and it's one of the greatest homes on this planet.

So you mexican "americans" that celebrate Cinco De Mayo like if it's the fourth of july.

a big you.

[word]

Funny thing is....the Catholic Church teaches...in the official Catechism of the Church, to obey the laws of the country which you live. I assume most of these 'reconquistas' are Catholic. maybe they got some PROTESTant blood in 'em. Who knows. Oddly the Church can't even follow it's own doctrine, as has been seen by the archdioses of SA and now, LA. But hey, Gomez is Opus Dei, who's doctirine is not that far off from the Masons. It's the 'New World Order'. Some say, expecially the SSPX'ers, that the Church has been infiltrated by the Masons via OD, and that there are no borders and we must all live as one. The new world order. Those forces ARE out there.

[Nbadan]

Blah...unless the Vatican is as bad at gaining power as it is at protecting kids, I don't see how anything like that works...Seriously, I see the fundamentalist right in America drifting further and further from the Vatican....maybe someday splinting like the Church of England..

[Nbadan]

and now.... this...

[The Reckoning]

who in here honestly believes that the mexican-american students (or the principal, for that matter) would know the difference if the five kids wore french flag shirts?

[Winehole23]

Nothing would happen. Just like (H/T, word) if someone wore a Union Jack on the 4th of July. Most kids wouldn't even get it. The rest would probably laugh, as they surely would have if a Fleur-de-Lis crewe had materialized in a Arizona middle school on Cinco de Mayo.

[ploto]

Also in California:

Vintage High School students were suspended for fighting and burning a Mexican national flag during incidents on campus Wednesday, school Principal Craig Lewis said.

At 3 p.m., four female students were involved in a fight related to the burning of a flag, according to Napa police.

Thursday, school administrators found out the burned flag had been discarded on the school campus. They checked trash cans and found a partially burned Mexican national flag, police said.

Investigators believe two students burned it in protest for the celebration of Cinco De Mayo, police said. The investigation continues and school officials are dealing with the involved students.

http://www.napavalleyregister.com/ne...cc4c002e0.html

Obviously, this is not the same thing, but it does point to the notion that maybe there is valid cause for concern by the principal.

[EmptyMan]

If they are so proud of Mexico, I'm sure the Mexican government would be happy to have their help fighting the cartels.


lol celebrating Mexican independence and then fleeing that madre as fast as you can.

[Winehole23]

Obviously, this is not the same thing, but it does point to the notion that maybe there is valid cause for concern by the principal.

Maybe, maybe not. Flag burning and t-shirt wearing don't seem very alike to me.

[Nbadan]

Well. administrators earn their wings by putting out fires not starting them...all districts have policies on what shirts can say...most let you turn them inside out.

[boutons_deux]

"Flag burning and t-shirt wearing"

They are both symbols of protest, provocation, disrespect, especially the "US flag" tee on 5 May.

[admiralsnackbar]

Wow. got unreasonable in here with a quickness.

[LnGrrrR]

Obviously, this is not the same thing, but it does point to the notion that maybe there is valid cause for concern by the principal.

Liberty > security.

Just because something bad MIGHT happen is not ipso facto a valid reason to deny liberty. It's a balancing act.

I see why the principal did what he did. I just don't agree with it.

[LnGrrrR]

Just for being little jackasses.

The world I grew up (early/mid 1970's, San Antonio, Tx., USA),in was way more tolerant of this, JMO. A lot of things were settled informally. That kind of behavior is excessively criminalized and clientelized now.

I think you'd have a lot more people arguing this way if kids weren't bringing guns and knives to school much more in this day and age.

[LnGrrrR]

What were the motivations for their political commentary? I challenge you to recreate a realistic conversation between this group of teens which ends with them deciding to wear flag clothing. Then tell me if you'd be comfortable having that conversation around a Mexican you don't know.

I'm not going into ridiculous hypotheticals. You know what, I don't even care if the kids WERE racist. As long as they didn't bring it up in school, and OTHER kids didn't bring it up, then I don't see the big issue.

Was the idea that it was racist towards the other kids brought up by the other kids? Was there an altercation? Or was this just a nervous principal stepping in?

Most kids probably aren't allowed to bring those signs to school or wear T-shirts with dead fetuses. But that said, this is the same thing isn't it? I'm calling these kids s but I'm not begrudging their right to be s.

I would say a picture of aborted fetuses is obviously more 'graphic' and potentially offensive than an American flag, wouldn't you?

I agree with all of that. But what I'm getting at is people were offended by the intent, not the flag itself. I think that's silly too, but positioning this whole issue as flag-banning is intellectually dishonest.

Besides the principal covering his ass, who was offended? It mentions nothing about an altercation breaking out, or anything of the sort.

Again, I think that the wearing of an American flag tshirt isn't DESIGNED to be confrontational, as clothing that includes swear words or graphic images might be.

Isn't it a bit strange that one kid wearing an American flag tshirt might not be offensive, but four friends wearing them suddenly is? Do these shirts have some sort of racial symbiosis?

[LnGrrrR]

"Flag burning and t-shirt wearing"

They are both symbols of protest, provocation, disrespect, especially the "US flag" tee on 5 May.

Uhm... no it's not.

Why can't people understand that giving respect to ONE nation does not automatically imply disrespect for any other?

Tell you what boutons, just let me know which days it's disrespectful for me to be an American, and I'll mark those on the calendar. I'd hate to offend people who more strongly identify with other nations in my own.

[Winehole23]

I think you'd have a lot more people arguing this way if kids weren't bringing guns and knives to school much more in this day and age.

Sure. The past is past. The present is what it is.

[Spurminator]

I'm not going into ridiculous hypotheticals.

It's not a hypothetical at all. A conversation did occur between these kids. I cannot imagine any such conversation carried out in a way that suggests they did not want to be provocative (I've never said racist.)

You know what, I don't even care if the kids WERE racist. As long as they didn't bring it up in school, and OTHER kids didn't bring it up, then I don't see the big issue.

Was the idea that it was racist towards the other kids brought up by the other kids? Was there an altercation? Or was this just a nervous principal stepping in?

Besides the principal covering his ass, who was offended? It mentions nothing about an altercation breaking out, or anything of the sort.

We don't know that other kids didn't bring it up. We don't know that it wasn't causing a stir. Considering they interviewed Hispanic students afterward who were offended, I'd say it's likely that there were some kids who were uncomfortable with it. Justified or not, I think it's perfectly natural for a Hispanic person to be curious about a group of five white guys' motivation for wearing such clothes.

I would say a picture of aborted fetuses is obviously more 'graphic' and potentially offensive than an American flag, wouldn't you?

I didn't mean the clothing is the same, I meant our reaction to it is the same. We both brought up examples of kids being what we perceived to be s, yet we both agree they have a right to be s.

Again, I think that the wearing of an American flag tshirt isn't DESIGNED to be confrontational, as clothing that includes swear words or graphic images might be.

Isn't it a bit strange that one kid wearing an American flag tshirt might not be offensive, but four friends wearing them suddenly is? Do these shirts have some sort of racial symbiosis?

Because, again, it's never been about the flag. It's about the motivation.

[MiamiHeat]

It's not a hypothetical at all. A conversation did occur between these kids. I cannot imagine any such conversation carried out in a way that suggests they did not want to be provocative (I've never said racist.)

We don't know that other kids didn't bring it up. We don't know that it wasn't causing a stir. Considering they interviewed Hispanic students afterward who were offended, I'd say it's likely that there were some kids who were uncomfortable with it. Justified or not, I think it's perfectly natural for a Hispanic person to be curious about a group of five white guys' motivation for wearing such clothes.


I didn't mean the clothing is the same, I meant our reaction to it is the same. We both brought up examples of kids being what we perceived to be s, yet we both agree they have a right to be s.

Tsk tsk tsk

Once again

You say "Hispanic students" as if they were mexican citizens in Mexico, and some bag americans went to Mexico, and started strutting american flags on 5 de mayo.


They are "hispanic" background, but american citizen students. They are american.

So exactly why are they celebrating 5 de mayo with such ferocity and why are they getting offended at ANYONE?

P.S. It is about the flag. There are many mexicans that hate america, claim "reconquista" and wish California and other states were part of Mexico.

These kids are brainwashed and they were angry that these gringo kids were showing off that "american" flag on their day of "national mexican pride"


We might as well deport all of these hispanic kids and families right now and save ourselves the trouble.

[Winehole23]

We might as well deport all of these hispanic kids and families right now and save ourselves the trouble.

It seems your impression is that a state of war already exists b/w the USA and Aztlan, anyone brown is axiomatically in the other camp, and so deserves to be summarily deported, along with all their kin -- the stubborn fact of US citizenship totally notwithstanding.

Correct?