International Prospect: Romain Sato

[admiralsnackbar]

Our starting sg next season will be hill.

Is this from the horse's mouth? I've heard it from enough people on the board to assume it must be, but it surprises me to think the FO has enough confidence in Temple to bump him up to 2nd string PG position so quickly -- well within the realm of the imagination based on his late-season play, but surprising nonetheless.

[benefactor]

Our starting sg next season will be hill...I dont see the spurs going after starters (except splitter) this offseason.
TP-Hill-RJ-TD-Splitter will be our starting 5 I think next season.

Starting jobs have never really mattered much to the Spurs. It's not about them going after a starter as much as it is going after a rotation player.

The Spurs need another SG. There is really no debating that. I actually like the idea of Sato starting and Hill and Manu running the second unit. Sato is bigger and stronger than Hill and should have an easier time bigger 2 guards that Hill might struggle with.

The other positive thing I see when looking at Sato's stats is that he has always been a good 3pt shooter. It's not something he has had to add to his game or develop over time. Since going to Europe in 2006, he has shot 40% from distance over four seasons. There is no reason to believe it will just disappear when he comes to the NBA.

[DesignatedT]

Is this from the horse's mouth? I've heard it from enough people on the board to assume it must be, but it surprises me to think the FO has enough confidence in Temple to bump him up to 2nd string PG position so quickly -- well within the realm of the imagination based on his late-season play, but surprising nonetheless.

I expect the spurs to bring in another PG. a veteran guard who can help run the point behind Tony. It's obvious Hill cant handle that duty for heavy minutes. Unless they really start to trust Temple, I don't see him being the guy.

[Blackjack]

Thanks, mountainballer.

Here's a recent video of him. I agree with you that he looks bigger than the measurements indicate.



I also agree with you that at 28 years old, this is probably his last shot at the NBA if he wants to come over. He jumper looks good and if he is as good as advertised defensively then he might be a nice LLE option if there are not worthwhile veteran guards to pick from among the other free agents.

Damn, I loved this guy when he was drafted. If memory serves, Pop and the whole team did as well -- I remember them raving about his eagerness to please everyone and how good of a kid he was. 6-11 wingspan, if memory serves, and an unbelievable rebounder for his size. Good defender and spot-up three-point shooter, as well.

What strikes me in this YouTube is how much better his shot looks than I remember. He had a bit of a Barbosa-esque push shot but his form looks much improved and his balance going up and how he manages to come down almost exactly where he left, is impressive. And I can see that little bit of Jason Richardson DPG saw -- the under the rim athleticism on his finishes -- but there's also a good bit of Mayo and (please don't misunderstand) Kobe.

Watch the turn over his right shoulder as he goes glass at :20 sec. from the left box. Tell me you haven't seen that before; or the drive with his left to the middle at the 1:00 mark where he comes back to his right after raising up for the short jumper from the middle of the lane. Actually, even a couple of his finishes around the rim look similar to the Kobe of nowadays.

Again, I'm not comparing the player, just a similar look to particular moves. And considering Sean always likes to call Mayo a miniature Kobe, seeing a bit of those two in some of his moves, it makes sense.

It's hard not to think about how you could fit him on the Spurs. They obviously liked him when they drafted him and when he was with the team ... and he's really made some great strides in his game. Plus, at 28, he's at the perfect age -- a lot of players best years come in that 27-30 range when their intelligence for the game meets their athleticism at maybe its highest level. The proverbial "peak."

mogrovejo, how would you compare Sato to someone like Bell defensively and who would you rather have if you're the Spurs?

[TD 21]

Length helps when guarding similar sized players. For example, Hill's length is an asset against Paul, but it's useless against Bryant, because at the end of the day Bryant can still rise up and shoot up over the top of him with ease. The same goes for Blair. Sure, he's long, but that doesn't help him when he has to guard Gasol.

My point is, for the role Sato would fill if the Spurs signed him (3D wing off the bench, guarding Bryant, Anthony, Durant, etc.), I'm not sure his length/wingspan would help him any. At the end of the day, he'd still be 6-3 to their 6-6, or 6-8, or 6-9.

Granted, a guy like Allen (Tony) is 6-4 and generally does a nice job defensively against top opposition wings. It's not often I see his lack of size being a detriment against them, so there are exceptions.

However, when you're aspiring to win a championship every part of the team (and rotation, specifically) matters. This is an important role and the Spurs would have to have a good idea that he could fill this role adequately-admirably before pulling the trigger.

That would be my primary concern with Sato. Physically and skill set-wise, he sounds like a fit. Minutes-wise, I wouldn't worry about him complaining. Essentially, the wing the Spurs are looking for is a primary backup to Jefferson, who'd be the 8th or 9th man. So he'd be in the rotation and probably play 15-20 mpg.

But, this is already an undersized team. Specifically on the wings, they lack a true backup SF. If Hairston is going to be the 10th man and play at least semi-consistently (and there's a good chance of this), then the wing ahead of him should be at least his size, but ideally taller.

[Blackjack]

I get that. I want size on the wing also. But if it comes down to Bell or Sato, I don't think you turn down Sato if he's thought to be the better overall player and a comparable or better defender.

Plus, it's not out of the realm he could start at the 2. I mean, I love Hill and he's going to be playing 35 a night most likely, but Sato's got better size and experience than him and just because you start doesn't mean a whole lot in the grand scheme of things.

I'm not saying the Spurs need to sign him or claiming I know or have seen enough to tell you how good he is at this stage, but I like what I'm hearing and where he's at in his career -- Sato could be in for something similar to Anthony Parker when he first came over.

There's no getting around that they need more length on the wing defensively, so hopefully they can find it in the draft (and that the guy's capable of playing good minutes defensively as a rookie). But I'm just not seeing too many options for the Spurs out there that bring the size they're looking for and a price they can afford. Unless they've got some way of making a trade for some size on the perimeter -- I'm all ears if there's something legitimately feasible -- Bell and Sato might be the best they can do (as far as established players).

[TD 21]

I agree with most of this.

Bringing Hill off the bench isn't a way of getting around the lack of size on the perimeter. Against good opposition and in the playoffs, whether he starts or not, the Spurs are most likely going to play five perimeter players. Four are already spoken for, so let's say Sato is the fifth. Even if he starts, the Spurs are still in a position where either him, Ginobili, or both, has to play backup SF.

I like the size of a guy like Butler, but he's not that good a shooter and he's not a noted defender, either. A guy like Cook, who I've brought up, I think is due for a bounce back year, but he's strictly a two and not established. Evans is a guy with the strength, but not the length, to play full time three and he's like Butler, in that he's not that good a shooter. Bell is still the best option I see available, but he's old, was slipping defensively two seasons ago and basically will not have played in a year by the time next season rolls around, so who knows where he'll be at?

The front office has got to come up with something though, because as much as everyone talks about the needs amongst the bigs, if they don't fill this backup wing spot with someone who can offer up solid, reliable, 3D, then they're still not going to be a championship caliber team, even if they do land Splitter.

[Bruno]

I'm the furthest thing from a cap-ologist, but couldn't we use the LLE to sign him (to fill Mason's shoes as a potential starting SG, with Manu returning to the bench as the closer 2)? That still leaves us with the 20 to either draft or swap (as Mountainballer stated elsewhere) for a long 3, and the MLE for Splitter and another spare part (Bonner? DeColo?).

It isn't a financial problem, it's a minute problem.

Come playoffs time, Parker, Hill and Ginobili will play all the minutes available at PG/SG. To give minutes to Sato, you either has to cut Parker/Hill/Ginobili minutes or to play Ginobili at the SF spot. I don't like both solutions.

[benefactor]

It isn't a financial problem, it's a minute problem.

Come playoffs time, Parker, Hill and Ginobili will play all the minutes available at PG/SG. To give minutes to Sato, you either has to cut Parker/Hill/Ginobili minutes or to play Ginobili at the SF spot. I don't like both solutions.

...but during the season the Spurs will need another reliable SG, one that can be called upon in the playoffs if the situation necessitates it. In the playoffs one also has to account for foul trouble and potential mismatches on the perimeter. I love Hill, but there are going to be times when he is going to have to deal with SG's that are just too big and can shoot over him. Having a player like Sato(who has 5 extra inches of standing reach) ready to go off the bench during these times would be very beneficial.

[Muser]

"Tony Allen with a Jumpshot"

That'd be sweet.

[Bruno]

...but during the season the Spurs will need another reliable SG, one that can be called upon in the playoffs if the situation necessitates it. In the playoffs one also has to account for foul trouble and potential mismatches on the perimeter. I love Hill, but there are going to be times when he is going to have to deal with SG's that are just too big and can shoot over him. Having a player like Sato(who has 5 extra inches of standing reach) ready to go off the bench during these times would be very beneficial.

Spending $2M, that is to say $4M with the tax, for a player who will play about 10mpg during the regular season and in some playoffs match ups is expensive. To fit that role, I rather see Spurs going after a vet min or give a chance to one of Temple, Gee or Hairston.

If Spurs had to spend $2M on a perimeter player, it should be on a SF. Even if Spurs draft one at #20, there is no guarantee that this player is playoff ready is in rookie season.

[benefactor]

Spending $2M, that is to say $4M with the tax, for a player who will play about 10mpg during the regular season and in some playoffs match ups is expensive. To fit that role, I rather see Spurs going after a vet min or give a chance to one of Temple, Gee or Hairston.

If Spurs had to spend $2M on a perimeter player, it should be on a SF. Even if Spurs draft one at #20, there is no guarantee that this player is playoff ready is in rookie season.

It will actually be a little less than 2 million(LLE fluctuates with the cap?)...and that's a pretty good deal considering what they had to pay Mason just to be a shooter.

The Spurs are going to need better quality depth if they plan on competing next season...depth that can shoot. I like the young prospects, but depending on Temple or Gee is basically like depending on a rookie...and Hairston has yet to prove in his NBA minutes that he can do much more offensively than make the occasional drive to the basket(he's more of an SF anyway). And I REALLY don't want to see them fill that gap with another Keith Boganesque garbage vet minimum.

I agree with you that I would like to see the Spurs use the LLE on an SF, but I don't see any out there that would accept it or would be worth paying it to. I'm not saying Sato is the only or even the best LLE option, I'm just saying he would be a good one when looking at the skills he brings to the table.

[benefactor]

Just looked up the LLE...it is set at 2.08 million for next season. Still a pretty good deal for a player like Sato IMO.

There is also the chance that Splitter does not use the whole MLE. If that is the case they could sign Sato for a little bit cheaper and give him a partially guaranteed third year.

[yavozerb]

I would rather get De Colo in a spurs uni than Sato.

[mogrovejo]

He is not quite as athletic seemingly as a Tony Allen, but from his highlights, he reminds me of a less athletic Jason Richardson.

He is as athletic as Tony Allen post his last knee reconstruction. This highlights video doesn't show it, he wasn't doing anything impressive from an athletic standpoint, but he is. I'm pretty sure there's plenty of videos of him finishing impressive alley-oops + great transition dunks (he's very good in transition). But his athleticism goes beyond the leaping ability + explosiveness off the floor.

The Tony Allen comparison isn't that good because Sato isn't the loose canon Allen can be, he's a more conservative player and he doesn't have Allen's ball-handling/Shot-creation skills.

mogrovejo, how would you compare Sato to someone like Bell defensively and who would you rather have if you're the Spurs?

Bell is a solid comparison as another defensive specialist who wasn't ready for the NBA coming out off college. Bell is a more cerebral and fundamental defender than Sato, who relies more on his athletic abilities + instincts.

Comparing primes, I'd take Bell; right now, I'd easily take Sato. Bell hasn't played in awhile and has been declining for a couple of seasons.


--

Bruno mentions size: I think height isn't that important defensively. You need strength to avoid biggers players to post you, length to contest shots - I think for all effects you can consider Sato a regular 6'5'' player.

He has the standing reach of Richard Jefferson/Jason Richardson/Car Landry. I don't mean wingspan, but standing reach. He's also extremely strong, way above average lower body strength for a guy with his height. I mean, would it really matter if his neck had 2 more inches? Only to see the floor better, but that's unimportant for a player with his role.

Rebounding could be the problem, but Sato is one of the best rebounding guards in Europe. He has great rebounding instincts, fights for them, has very long arms and strong hands. He'd be a very good rebounder for the SG position in the NBA and an average rebounder for the SF position. Blair is one of the best rebounders in the league and he lacks height as well.

Of course, if you still want a guy who plays bigger than a typical 6'5'' player, then you probably should look somewhere. I'd be very enticed with Sato+Ginobili+Hill in my backcourt because those 3 guys can defend more than 1 position and all can defend the quicker guards in the league. That would offer lots of options to switch on small/small plays, I think the ability to crossmatch defensively is very underrated. Anyway, I can see why the Spurs would rather have a bigger backcourt player to go with Parker/Hill/Manu/Jefferson, especially if they also keep Temple.

Salary: I think he wont' ask for the LLE. A smaller part of the MLE shall be enough; I also think that in the right situation, a place where he wants to be and where he feels he's really wanted, a minimum contract shall suffice.

[benefactor]

I would rather get De Colo in a spurs uni than Sato.

For next year, I'd have to disagree. I want De Colo too, but Sato is a more established veteran with almost twice as many games played. He's more "big stage" ready than De Colo is at this point. Sato is also far and away a better perimeter defender and much stronger.

He is as athletic as Tony Allen post his last knee reconstruction. This highlights video doesn't show it, he wasn't doing anything impressive from an athletic standpoint, but he is. I'm pretty sure there's plenty of videos of him finishing impressive alley-oops + great transition dunks (he's very good in transition). But his athleticism goes beyond the leaping ability + explosiveness off the floor.

The Tony Allen comparison isn't that good because Sato isn't the loose canon Allen can be, he's a more conservative player and he doesn't have Allen's ball-handling/Shot-creation skills.



Bell is a solid comparison as another defensive specialist who wasn't ready for the NBA coming out off college. Bell is a more cerebral and fundamental defender than Sato, who relies more on his athletic abilities + instincts.

Comparing primes, I'd take Bell; right now, I'd easily take Sato. Bell hasn't played in awhile and has been declining for a couple of seasons.


--

Bruno mentions size: I think height isn't that important defensively. You need strength to avoid biggers players to post you, length to contest shots - I think for all effects you can consider Sato a regular 6'5'' player.

He has the standing reach of Richard Jefferson/Jason Richardson/Car Landry. I don't mean wingspan, but standing reach. He's also extremely strong, way above average lower body strength for a guy with his height. I mean, would it really matter if his neck had 2 more inches? Only to see the floor better, but that's unimportant for a player with his role.

Rebounding could be the problem, but Sato is one of the best rebounding guards in Europe. He has great rebounding instincts, fights for them, has very long arms and strong hands. He'd be a very good rebounder for the SG position in the NBA and an average rebounder for the SF position. Blair is one of the best rebounders in the league and he lacks height as well.

Of course, if you still want a guy who plays bigger than a typical 6'5'' player, then you probably should look somewhere. I'd be very enticed with Sato+Ginobili+Hill in my backcourt because those 3 guys can defend more than 1 position and all can defend the quicker guards in the league. That would offer lots of options to switch on small/small plays, I think the ability to crossmatch defensively is very underrated. Anyway, I can see why the Spurs would rather have a bigger backcourt player to go with Parker/Hill/Manu/Jefferson, especially if they also keep Temple.

Salary: I think he wont' ask for the LLE. A smaller part of the MLE shall be enough; I also think that in the right situation, a place where he wants to be and where he feels he's really wanted, a minimum contract shall suffice.

Thanks for the breakdown mogrovejo.

Your comments about salary are encouraging. Though I think he's likely worth the LLE, I'd much rather see him signed with a small part of the MLE and I think that would be much more realistic as far as what the Spurs would want to spend goes.

[Blackjack]

Bell is a solid comparison as another defensive specialist who wasn't ready for the NBA coming out off college. Bell is a more cerebral and fundamental defender than Sato, who relies more on his athletic abilities + instincts.

Comparing primes, I'd take Bell; right now, I'd easily take Sato. Bell hasn't played in awhile and has been declining for a couple of seasons.

That's what I was getting at. Raja seems the most talked about player for the Spurs to bring in and help them as their "centerpiece" right away (he's a good defending role-player with a three-point shot) but he's undersized, past his prime and I just don't know how good of a pickup he'd really be -- his asking price may be a little higher than you'd like as well.

That's why I asked you to compare him to Bell and who you'd choose between the two if you're the Spurs. And I've got to say, from everything I know and have seen to what you've told me about what Sato's become, I'm on the verge of championing his cause. He doesn't bring the size at the wing you'd hope for but if Bell's the alternative, I think I'd rather have the guy in his prime who's the better overall player and brings a good amount of versatility -- to say nothing of the potential low asking price.

But as it pertains to Sato's defense, how intelligent does he play and are his habits good and his fundamentals sound, or is he a bit of a gambler? He's got some great tools and an uncanny knack for rebounding but if the Spurs view him as a gambler or someone who lacks focus or attention to detail, I don't like his chances that the Spurs would look to him to fill the role -- not at a long 6-3 and not having really played in the league.

Thanks for the insight, mojo.

[TD 21]

Spending $2M, that is to say $4M with the tax, for a player who will play about 10mpg during the regular season and in some playoffs match ups is expensive. To fit that role, I rather see Spurs going after a vet min or give a chance to one of Temple, Gee or Hairston.

If Spurs had to spend $2M on a perimeter player, it should be on a SF. Even if Spurs draft one at #20, there is no guarantee that this player is playoff ready is in rookie season.

Completely agree. Even though benefactor is right in that Hairston is more of an SF than an SG, despite him being relatively short, ideally the Spurs need another backup SF. I know his thinking probably is, if Hairston lacks the ball skills of a SG, then why wouldn't the Spurs pursue an SG? Because they don't need their backup wings to have tremendous ball skills. The ball is going to be in Parker's, Ginobili's, Hill's and Duncan's hands the vast majority of the time. What the Spurs need is role players who can defend and make open shots.

On top of that, between Ginobili and Hill, the vast majority of the SG minutes will be spoken for. Sure, for depth purposes they need another couple of guys who can play there, but technically Hairston and Temple are SG's first, despite the fact that on this team their minutes will primarily come at SF and PG, respectively.

Bruno mentions size: I think height isn't that important defensively. You need strength to avoid biggers players to post you, length to contest shots - I think for all effects you can consider Sato a regular 6'5'' player.

He has the standing reach of Richard Jefferson/Jason Richardson/Car Landry. I don't mean wingspan, but standing reach. He's also extremely strong, way above average lower body strength for a guy with his height. I mean, would it really matter if his neck had 2 more inches? Only to see the floor better, but that's unimportant for a player with his role.

I disagree. Maybe on an individual basis height isn't important, but when you're a team that's already undersized, specifically in terms of backup wings, it's not ideal for your primary backup wing (I assume Ginobili will go back to the bench, but I consider him a guard, not a wing) to be severely undersized, even if he is freakishly long.

Length to contest shots is beneficial when guarding similar sized players. For all Hill's length, that doesn't help him when defending Bryant. It would matter if his neck had two more inches. Again, maybe not individually (it's more of a case by case thing; like I said, T. Allen seems to defend bigger players fairly well for the most part), but based on the composition of this roster they need as much size as they can get.

[angelbelow]

IIRC he was on our 2005 roster? He certainly wasn't ready then but that was 5 years ago.

[Blackjack]

He was the Spurs' second-rounder in '04.

[mogrovejo]

Completely agree. Even though benefactor is right in that Hairston is more of an SF than an SG, despite him being relatively short, ideally the Spurs need another backup SF. I know his thinking probably is, if Hairston lacks the ball skills of a SG, then why wouldn't the Spurs pursue an SG? Because they don't need their backup wings to have tremendous ball skills. The ball is going to be in Parker's, Ginobili's, Hill's and Duncan's hands the vast majority of the time. What the Spurs need is role players who can defend and make open shots.

On top of that, between Ginobili and Hill, the vast majority of the SG minutes will be spoken for. Sure, for depth purposes they need another couple of guys who can play there, but technically Hairston and Temple are SG's first, despite the fact that on this team their minutes will primarily come at SF and PG, respectively.



I disagree. Maybe on an individual basis height isn't important, but when you're a team that's already undersized, specifically in terms of backup wings, it's not ideal for your primary backup wing (I assume Ginobili will go back to the bench, but I consider him a guard, not a wing) to be severely undersized, even if he is freakishly long.

Length to contest shots is beneficial when guarding similar sized players. For all Hill's length, that doesn't help him when defending Bryant. It would matter if his neck had two more inches. Again, maybe not individually (it's more of a case by case thing; like I said, T. Allen seems to defend bigger players fairly well for the most part), but based on the composition of this roster they need as much size as they can get.

Have you ever seen a guy contesting shots with the tip of his head?

I think you have no idea what you're talking about. Hill isn't long compared to Sato, he's a midget.

People contest shots and rebound with their arms raised and outstretched. Sato reaches 8' 6.5", Hill reaches 8' 1.5". Hill is in the JJ Red tier, Sato is in the Carl Landry (yeah, the former Houston now in Sacramento power forward) tier. It's an absurd comparison. The reason Tony Allen can defend bigger players is because of his freakish wingspan that puts him at a 6'6'' standing reach. But, again, Sato is even longer than Tony Allen.

[JonNOKC]

Our starting sg next season will be hill...I dont see the spurs going after starters (except splitter) this offseason.
TP-Hill-RJ-TD-Splitter will be our starting 5 I think next season.

If the Spurs choose to go this route next year then it actually makes it easier to sign a guy like Sato as Manu can play PG from an offensive standpoint and then depending on matchups you could switch Sato on defensive side to PG or SG

The problem is we still need a long 3 for certain matchups - like Lakers

[yavozerb]

Wow, all this on romain sato ...This guy would be the 10th or 11th man on the roster if signed, I would rather have a young player.

[JonNOKC]

I expect the spurs to bring in another PG. a veteran guard who can help run the point behind Tony. It's obvious Hill cant handle that duty for heavy minutes. Unless they really start to trust Temple, I don't see him being the guy.

of course for the most part with Hill being able to defend PGS it is really not a big deal if Manu is healthy and goes back to bench - he can play the PG position from the SG spot as well as anyone in the league - so then Temple becomes Mason JR in getting a few spot minutes at PG - especially if you brought in another combo type guy that could defend some PGs (like SATO) and even Manu can matchup against many PG ok

[benefactor]

The Blair/Sato comparison is a bad one. Yes, both are undersized height-wise for their position, but it's apples and oranges when comparing body type. Blair is like an undersized version of Shaq. He can't jump that well and lacks good lateral quickness, so the fact that he can almost reach as high or higher than many PF/C's is nullified a little bit by his lack of athleticism. If you were to put a Jeff Green/Carlos Boozer type frame with Blair's same height and length you would have a PF that would dominate on both ends of the floor.

With Sato you do have a player that is athletic yet lacks ideal height. Saying an athletic guy with FIVE INCHES of extra standing reach on George Hill can't contest the shots of most 2 guards in the league is something you are going to have a hard time selling to me. Did I mention he has averaged 40% from distance since 2006?

Wow, all this on romain sato ...This guy would be the 10th or 11th man on the roster if signed, I would rather have a young player.

lol...you can't be serious. Did the guy cheat on your sister or something?

Look, I'm not saying the guy will be world beater. But 200+ games of consistent production overseas does not lie. If the Spurs don't want to give him the LLE, that's completely understandable. But if he will come over for 1.2-1.5 million of the MLE there is not a lot to think about(this of course depends on Splitter and what it requires to sign him).