The whole "Jordan needed Pippen" argument is overrated.

[D2Procon]

If Pippen was able to lead a Bulls team without Jordan into the ECF second round forcing a game 7 against the Knicks team that went into the finals, then Michael Jordan who is much better than Pippen could have taken that same team into the Finals without pippen. So IMO the argument fails.

[Killakobe81]

It's NOT that MJ NEEDED Pippen ...


BUT

He NEEDED a reliable #2 star and Pippen was one of the best in NBA history in that role ...

If you gave Jordan Drexler, Nique, Dale Ellis etc. he STILL gets les but maybe not 6 ...

Pippen was a "near perfect fit" with MJ ...and MJ took a lot of pressure off of Pippen who probably, (despite his great playoff run without MJ)was not a true #1 ...

Phil deserves MORE credit for that than PIppen IMHO ...One of Phil's greatest coaching efforts next to keeping Kobe and Shaq from detroying the 3-peat ...

[JoeTait75]

If Pippen was able to lead a Bulls team without Jordan into the ECF second round forcing a game 7 against the Knicks team that went into the finals, then Michael Jordan who is much better than Pippen could have taken that same team into the Finals without pippen. So IMO the argument fails.

That makes no sense. Maybe it's a reading comprehension issue on my part. Let me try again... nope. Still doesn't make sense.

[Ghazi]

we still using "true #1" arguments?

Rajon Rondo's gonna be the best player on a le team this year.

[hitmanyr2k]

If Pippen was able to lead a Bulls team without Jordan into the ECF second round forcing a game 7 against the Knicks team that went into the finals, then Michael Jordan who is much better than Pippen could have taken that same team into the Finals without pippen. So IMO the argument fails.

Replace Pippen with Pete Myers in the 1993 Eastern Conference Finals and see how far Jordan gets

[Killakobe81]

That makes no sense. Maybe it's a reading comprehension issue on my part. Let me try again... nope. Still doesn't make sense.

Put it this way ... Lebron with a Pippen at #2 is winning a le ...soon.

Kobe with a Pippen ditto ...Same for Wade.

Not saying any of those guys = MJ but Pippen was THAT good he just is NOT in the Bird, MAgic Jordan Duncan Kobe, Hakeem class but he was VERY good.

But Pipppen neeeded MJ more than the other way around ...without MJ Pippen may hae NEVER developed fully ... he was the one team-mate you could say MJ legitimately "made" better ...

[Giuseppe]

we still using "true #1" arguments?

Rajon Rondo's gonna be the best player on a le team this year.

, I called Rondo's greatness almost a year ago and everybody said I was talkin' out my ass.

Don't even start, Ghazi.

[Killakobe81]

we still using "true #1" arguments?

Rajon Rondo's gonna be the best player on a le team this year.

Very possible ...but no way they win without Pierce coming up BIG down the stretch ...

[Killakobe81]

, I called Rondo's greatness almost a year ago and everybody said I was talkin' out my ass.

Don't even start, Ghazi.

Me too ..Cully

BUT FT's and jumper still need work but right now only Dwill is playing ahead of Rondo if I had my choice of PG's ...

[JoeTait75]

Replace Pippen with Pete Myers in the 1993 Eastern Conference Finals and see how far Jordan gets

Replace Pippen with Pete Myers in 1988 and '89 and Jordan doesn't even get by Cleveland, IMO. Scottie was... large in some very closely contested games throughout both of those series.

[D2Procon]

What Im saying if Pippen alone got the Bulls in the second round pushing a game 7 against the eventual finalists Knicks, then how would have Jordan done if you took pippen out of that 1994 team and replaced him with Jordan.

[Bob Lanier]

That makes no sense. Maybe it's a reading comprehension issue on my part. Let me try again... nope. Still doesn't make sense.

[hitmanyr2k]

Put it this way ... Lebron with a Pippen at #2 is winning a le ...soon.

Kobe with a Pippen ditto ...Same for Wade.

Not saying any of those guys = MJ but Pippen was THAT good he just is NOT in the Bird, MAgic Jordan Duncan Kobe, Hakeem class but he was VERY good.

But Pipppen neeeded MJ more than the other way around ...without MJ Pippen may hae NEVER developed fully ... he was the one team-mate you could say MJ legitimately "made" better ...

Jordan certainly helped Pippen to become a better player but only to a certain extent. Playing against the best everyday in practice is going to help you get better but at the same time it can kill you. Not everyone Jordan played with turned to gold lol. In fact it usually worked out just the opposite. Pippen had to want to get better, work on his game in the offseason and, improve...otherwise he would have ended up another Lamar Odom. a borderline all-star type.

During the first 3 peat I would say Pippen was good but he didn't truly become a great player until Jordan retired. He could have sat on his 3 rings and coasted but instead he worked even harder to get better. He hit the weights (which helped on both ends of the floor), got more range on his shot, added a post game, and became an even more multi-dimensional player. All of that was done while Jordan was swinging and missing at curveballs.

[Bob Lanier]

What Im saying if Pippen alone got the Bulls in the second round pushing a game 7 against the eventual finalists Knicks, then how would have Jordan done if you took pippen out of that 1994 team and replaced him with Jordan.

Probably still not have beaten the Knicks and definitely not have beaten the Rockets? So who cares?

[D2Procon]

Probably still not have beaten the Knicks and definitely not have beaten the Rockets? So who cares?

So are you saying Pippen = Jordan then?

[Bob Lanier]

So are you saying Pippen = Jordan then?

I'm going to be charitable and assume you're drunk or high, and not just an idiot.

No, I don't think Pippen was nearly as good a basketball player as Jordan. I do think that the '94 Knicks were a considerably better team than your hypothetical BJ Armstrong - Michael Jordan - Pete Myers - Horace Grant - Bill Cartwright Bulls.

[D2Procon]

I'm going to be charitable and assume you're drunk or high, and not just an idiot.

No, I don't think Pippen was nearly as good a basketball player as Jordan. I do think that the '94 Knicks were a considerably better team than your hypothetical BJ Armstrong - Michael Jordan - Pete Myers - Horace Grant - Bill Cartwright Bulls.

So let me get this straight..... You're saying Pippen is no where as near as good as Michael Jordan. Yet if Pippen took the Knicks to 7 games, you dont think Jordan who you said (Is much better than pippen) couldn't win that extra game?

[JoeTait75]

Did you see Scottie play with the Bulls, Tacker?

He was kind of an important part of those teams.

[Roddy Beaubois]

So was Jordan

[Bob Lanier]

So let me get this straight..... You're saying Pippen is no where as near as good as Michael Jordan. Yet if Pippen took the Knicks to 7 games, you dont think Jordan who you said (Is much better than pippen) couldn't win that extra game?

Do you think if the Suns had Michael Jordan instead of Steve Nash, they'd beat the Lakers this year?

[Roddy Beaubois]

way to avoid the question all thread.

[D2Procon]

Did you see Scottie play with the Bulls, Tacker?

He was kind of an important part of those teams.

Im not tacker you idiot its already been proved? and second I did watch him play especially him owning the out of your cavaliers. Take the broom out of your ass and stop underachieving the greatest player.

[D2Procon]

Do you think if the Suns had Michael Jordan instead of Steve Nash, they'd beat the Lakers this year?

Yes.

[JoeTait75]

Yes.

If the Minnesota Timberwolves had Michael Jordan would they win the le this year?

[Bob Lanier]

Well, OK then. If Jordan has superhuman powers, then of course he can win any game if plugged in for any other player. Jordan needs nobody.