Turkey has announced they will send another flotilla to Gaza escorted by Turk Navy

[ElNono]

If you are going to change my words, don't use my name in the quote, .

I was quoting you...

[ElNono]

If you don't know why, you shouldn't be taking a position.

I do know why. Do you?

[Cry Havoc]

Israel was only enforcing the blockade.

Outside of the blockade in international waters.

[Wild Cobra]

Well, Israel has no right to request that under international law.

Request... Yes... Enforce, No. They knew what these ships were doing. Maybe they should have waited, war5ned, and blew any out of the waters that kept going. Would that be your preference?

Do you think Israel is going to allow their fate be determined by international law when they are always defending themselves from terrorists?

They do have a right for self preservation.

[sook]

Outside of the blockade in international waters.

Which is exactly where this argument ends.

I don't understand where there are any gray areas. There is a reason cuba is still standing such a short distance from the U.S.

[Wild Cobra]

I was quoting you...

OK, so you believe the "American Israel Public Affairs Committee" is the American people?

I guess you aren't as intelligent as I thought.

[Cry Havoc]

They do have a right for self preservation.

Where does self preservation run parallel to "boarding a boat on a humanitarian mission in international waters with armed commandos and opening fire"?

Why do you think Israeli papers are calling for the premier's resignation?

[ElNono]

Do you think Israel is going to allow their fate be determined by international law when they are always defending themselves from terrorists?

So you agree that they broke international law?
Also, why do you think they didn't request to inspect the ships in international waters if they were going to board them there anyways?

[ElNono]

OK, so you believe the "American Israel Public Affairs Committee" is the American people?

I guess you aren't as intelligent as I thought.

Can you prove that the American people unquestionably supports the stance you claim they support?

[ElNono]

They do have a right for self preservation.

So you're in the opinion that by merely claiming 'self-preservation' any nation can attack any civilian boat in international waters...

Crystal clear.

[sook]

el Nono and CH with the duo KO punch.

Nicely done.

[sook]

So you agree that they broke international law?
Also, why do you think they didn't request to inspect the ships in international waters if they were going to board them there anyways?

[angrydude]

Which is exactly where this argument ends.

I don't understand where there are any gray areas. There is a reason cuba is still standing such a short distance from the U.S.

......no.

See the law, especially international law, isn't this black and white thing. Context and shades of grey are everything.

[Drachen]

Bull .

The first guns to be fired were likely the two handguns seized.

They had deadly weapons. Ever been his by a steel pole, or pipe?

them. They deserve what they got. Israel was only enforcing the blockade.

Bull !

You are calling them out as being violent for defending their property against Israels tresspassing.

[ElNono]

See the law, especially international law, isn't this black and white thing. Context and shades of grey are everything.

Especially since yesterday.

[Wild Cobra]

Bull !

You are calling them out as being violent for defending their property against Israels tresspassing.

They were told to turn away. I don't care how far they were. Their mission was clear. Israel has great intelligence in the region. Far better than our own.

Is a Molotov tail standard equipment of a humanitarian vessel? If not, why were they there?

[Drachen]

They were told to turn away. I don't care how far they were. Their mission was clear. Israel has great intelligence in the region. Far better than our own.

Is a Molotov tail standard equipment of a humanitarian vessel? If not, why were they there?

So, when do laws actually apply? I mean, can you go kill someone because they were really angry at you and pulled out of their driveway and got on the highway going toward your house?

[Wild Cobra]

So, when do laws actually apply? I mean, can you go kill someone because they were really angry at you and pulled out of their driveway and got on the highway going toward your house?

Not in the USA.

People break laws all the time that aren't enforce. Want Israel not to break international law? It's not going to happen because the UN doesn't have the balls to enforce it, and Israel knows it.

How about we enforce something closer to home, like illegal immigration. As long as we don't enforce it, the illegals will keep breaking the law.

[Drachen]

Not in the USA.

People break laws all the time that aren't enforce. Want Israel not to break international law? It's not going to happen because the UN doesn't have the balls to enforce it, and Israel knows it.

How about we enforce something closer to home, like illegal immigration. As long as we don't enforce it, the illegals will keep breaking the law.

Well, unfortunately you are painting with a wide liberal brush here. Pay attention to any of the illegal immigration threads that I have posted in and you will see that you and I see very close to eye to eye on that issue.

I understand that the UN should enforce this, and it looks like Turkey will try, but just because it hasn't been enforced doesn't mean that Israel (or its staunch supporters) has the right to get all hurt when they are called out on doing something wrong. Wrong is wrong is wrong. Integrity is doing the right thing when it is not being enforced. If Israel believes the "right thing" is to go against all of the established laws (settlements, attacking in international water, etc), then they (and their supporters) should be prepared for worldwide backlash.

[Cry Havoc]

People break laws all the time that aren't enforce. Want Israel not to break international law? It's not going to happen because the UN doesn't have the balls to enforce it, and Israel knows it.

So, as long as someone won't enforce a law, that makes it completely acceptable to disregard? I just want to be clear on your stance here.

[ChumpDumper]

Why did the activists need to attempt to break a blockade instead of attempting to bring aid to Gaza legally?

Because they believe the blockade to be stupid and illegal.

I'm sure after years of constant warfare, Israel uses commandos because they'd rather be safe than sorry. Looks like they were right

Looks like they provoked an attack by storming the ship.

Unless you can say those "peaceful" activists would have just sat there like good boys and girls if inspectors had been sent aboard.

You can't conclusively say they wouldn't. I have seen no reports of illegal or dangerous cargo on any of the ships (please don't show pictures of slingshots and kitchen knives and claim they were going to Gaza terraists), so why would they object to a simple inspection?

[Wild Cobra]

So, as long as someone won't enforce a law, that makes it completely acceptable to disregard? I just want to be clear on your stance here.

That's not what I'm saying, but rather, making a point.

There is likely even more to the truth behind this that what is said. I'll bet that Israels has good justification for this. I don't see them as taking actions of this nature they cannot prove probable cause for.

Why didn't they "attack" the other five ships? Could they have had probable cause for the one? I wouldn't expect them to show their reasons to the public either, since there is no international enforcement for them need to justify themselves to.

As for the le of this thread. Is the Turkey navy going to follow the ships into the 12 mile limit?

[ElNono]

There is likely even more to the truth behind this that what is said. I'll bet that Israels has good justification for this. I don't see them as taking actions of this nature they cannot prove probable cause for.

Please do tell what you suspect the Israeli knew.

Why didn't they "attack" the other five ships? Could they have had probable cause for the one?

Uh? They attacked and took command of all six ships. They only met resistance on the bigger ship.

[ChumpDumper]

There is likely even more to the truth behind this that what is said. I'll bet that Israels has good justification for this. I don't see them as taking actions of this nature they cannot prove probable cause for.

Tell us what the justification could be.

[Wild Cobra]

Tell us what the justification could be.

I would be guessing. Several possibilities.

Can you say with certainty there wasn't justification?

It doesn't matter. We simply don't have all the facts, and the media will spin as they chose.