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I'm going to be very pissed if we take any sides.
IMO, israel was wrong but I would rather have us be quiet and let the rest of the world know we don't give a .
Israel not only just lost their only ally in the region.
They've made it an enemy in less than a day.
Has to be a new record in political screw-ups.
If we are lucky (for the rest of the world, that is) both sides will kill each other.
Of course, then the "International" part on our daily's newspapers will get very boring...
I'm going to be very pissed if we take any sides.
IMO, israel was wrong but I would rather have us be quiet and let the rest of the world know we don't give a .
It's pretty simple, turkey knew there were inspections of ships going into the WB.
This cannot be blamed on israel. The turks provoked the attack by having (armed) passengers shouting death threats and lynching israeli commandos.
I don't know how more proportionate can you get. THey went in armed with their primary weapon being paintball guns.
PAINTBALL GUNS.
If anything we should be investigating the intent of Turkey in this.
I can acknowledge anything you want. However, what we're discussing is a legal matter. That you don't want to discuss it doesn't mean it isn't so.
Furthermore, the burden of proving that these people 'broke' any 'natural law' or stepped on any 'natural rights' is entirely on you, which you have not done. It's also on you the burden to prove that natural rights or laws unequivocally trump legal rights and laws in this instance, another thing you have not done either.
You keep claiming 'Israel has a right to defend itself', which in this conversation is a complete and utter straw man, because nobody here is claiming that they don't have that right.
As a matter of fact, you're actually making a case for the civilians, who were undeniably attacked, and have the same natural rights and laws you invoke.
Unless you're a hypocrite and claim that somehow Israel's natural laws and rights somehow are more important than somebody else's natural laws and rights.
Not only do you omit relevant information in articles but it's clear you omit facts. The ship was not only humanitarian, it was loaded with hostiles and weapons ready to confront with force and death.
Why do you have a serial habit of lying and omiting facts.
Could you be honest with yourself for once?
what the are you talking about you idiot?
Do you honestly think any ship in the see is going to be without weapons, whether basic ones?
Have you ever been on a ship?
Why do you think they were throwing metal poles if they had legit weapons.
The zionist leader in this forum has just owned himself. Congrats.
El Nono, i know you're foreign, but that doesn't excuse you to be ignorant.
Self Defense is not instigating or making the first blow.
From the video, the crowd clearly dragged and beat, stabbed the commando before he even landed on the ship. He was taken atop his descending rope.
This is not about civilians defending themselves, but about a political group and country trying to frame a whole country when they already knew the precedents going in concerning ship inspections.
Their propaganda works on useful idiots, and i'm sad to say you are one of them.
It is really something when a bunch of Liberals, Communist or Humanist always fall back
on the same old BS. Civilian ships on the high seas with only civilians on board and
those mean old Jews attack them for no reason.
What do you think you are talking to a bunch of idiots that believe all this gibberish?
This was a deliberate attempt to provoke. Just like the next attempt will be.
So grow up and talk like adults.
This old man has been around for many years and trying to educate a bunch of you
is getting downright tiresome. Either study a little history and I mean history before
Martin Luther King and JFK and the civil rights movement and even before the
McCarthy era. You do know about the McCarthy era, right? Or in case you ever
read the newspapers in that time, McCarthy was right.
Why don't you ask the 10 dead citizens how they feel about the illegal boarding?
I hate the fact that violence broke out and people were both dead and hurt.
This could have been entirely avoided.
Eggnog, you are either one naive er, or you don't konw how the world works. You carry basic protection when you travel by sea due to fear of piracy, especially cargo ships carrying supplies like this one.
Hijacking a ship at sea is more difficult than in air.
sigh*, the zionists on this board have no moral standing whatsoever.
1) Israel had no right to board turkish ships in international waters (not without permission of Turkey). Turkey is rightfully pissed.
2) Funnily enough, the turkish crew is permitted to defend itself (in international waters) when agressed (for example, same applies when Somalian pirates attack your ship in international waters...)
I must say i've never met a ship armed with SLINGSHOTS!!!!!
not only that, but knives.
Do you think if that they would have been worried about fending off pirates they would have armed the ship personell with more than just slingshots?
Are you sincerely believing this ?.
It's not the ship was simply armed. But that it's civilians were armed and ready to take on the commandos when all the other ships were complying and knew of the rules.
All the other ships were actually contributing humanitarian aide. THis ship had other intentions.
It doesn't take a literate person to figure this out.
Being American doesn't excuse you from being able to read. Unless you're ignorant.
Also, as for the activists... I totally don't see a Nobel prize winner and some newspaper reporters carrying AK-47's to Hamas.
You're right. Israel could have not inspected the ships. That would have sent a new precedent for other organizations to manuever out of getting inspected. Jam a bunch of protesters wielding bats and knives and thusly you could store weapons and not get inspected.
Genius, you should go to the middle east and solve all their problems, but i guess that's why you were born in the americas as a blemish to the hispanic race.
Why don't you tell us how you really feel, ray?
The quicker we get back to slavery, the better, right?
Maybe giving those damned women a right to vote wasn't that wise after all, uh?
I know what you said. The problem is, is that you talk out of both sides of your mouth.
You're saying that the israelis acted within their own right, but then you go on to say that the passengers were only defending themselves against the offensive of the commandos.
Both those statements negate each other.
And about image, fine. You then agree with me. This does no good to israels image. But we all knew that, and it's 2010. This whole conflict didn't start in 2008, it's been going on a while. The world will act according to script so we shouldn't give a about the world.
wait....so I guess you didn't read the part about them going unstopped that last 5 times they delivered aid? They just happened to this this one time?I must say i've never met a ship armed with SLINGSHOTS!!!!!
not only that, but knives.
Do you think if that they would have been worried about fending off pirates they would have armed the ship personell with more than just slingshots?
Are you sincerely believing this ?.
It's not the ship was simply armed. But that it's civilians were armed and ready to take on the commandos when all the other ships were complying and knew of the rules.
All the other ships were actually contributing humanitarian aide. THis ship had other intentions.
It doesn't take a literate person to figure this out.
Idiot, please read the whole story.
Israel could have inspected the ships in international waters instead of boarding them with commandos. That was an actual lawful option.
There's two threads full of information about the subject so you can educate yourself. Unfortunately, I suspect you prefer to remain ignorant.
On a personal level, please tell me:
Are you mad I'm taking one of your American jobs?
Are you mad that I married an American girl?
Why don't you tell me how much does that bother you?
Point two is bull .
The weapons on board of the ship were instigating weapons and not proper weapons that could deter pirates who have rpg's and AK's. Don't tell me that they were going to defeat pirates with slingshots. They're not the lostboys and the pirates aren't the Capn Hook kind. LOL x10000000
How do they negate each other?
El Nono strikes again. Great logic. You would send unarmed inspectors to get lynched by the turkish mob.
Why are you brown? you disgrace me.
Mind you, personally, as I said before, both sides suck.
Best the US can do is let go of Israel's hand, and let both sides kill each other...
Or let the U.N do it's ing job: Tell both sides to sit, and threaten both sides with and doom, bombs and war, blockades and nukes; to stay put till a peace is arranged. You give the palestinians the state they want, you tell the arabs to stop threatening Israel, you tell Israel to stop being such a re ed kid...
After that, you disarm everyone, and you keep a close eye in the region for decades to come. It's hard, but it's the only way to ensure peace. The rest of the world of tired of this children always fighting each other. Seriously, don't you see that if we do nothing, they'll just continue the fighting, the wars, and that the rest of the world will suffer because of it?
I'll say it again, I wish both sides dissapear.
They are both a threat to Peace world-wide.
Because you are saying that the israelis fired upon the mob therefore the mob also had the right to fire back. That's not the way things went down.
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