RICHARD JEFFERSON opts OUT!!

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Every one of those 6'7" guys is bigger and stronger than James Anderson. You're a ing idiot if you think Anderson could guard any of those guys on the low block.

You're also a re for not comprehending that the game has changed since the Spurs last won a le. Lewis, Smith, and Diaw all run at the SF. You're wrong there. All drop to the 4 when their teams go "small", I'll give you that, but then we still don't have someone that can match up with them at that spot either.

Go beat off to your 6'5" small forward idea and call it a night.

They are 6-6 and the point is that your assertion that its all about length at the 3 is full of .

You were talking about length and now pulling the bait and switch with this weight bull .

Really who other than Diaw a few years back when he played the 3 for Phoenix has given us problems on the postup? All of our 3s have been lithe but its been the slashing 3s that get in the lane forcing our double teams to come quick and thus stressing the rotations that give us problems.

[LongtimeSpursFan]

Every one of those 6'7" guys is bigger and stronger than James Anderson. You're a ing idiot if you think Anderson could guard any of those guys on the low block.

You're also a re for not comprehending that the game has changed since the Spurs last won a le. Lewis, Smith, and Diaw all run at the SF. You're wrong there. All drop to the 4 when their teams go "small", I'll give you that, but then we still don't have someone that can match up with them at that spot either.

Go beat off to your 6'5" small forward idea and call it a night.

I'm with you on this one AggieFan. We dont need any more of those 6'6" small forwards especially if they are Anderson or Hairston (nor Hill at 6'4"). RJ at 6'7" is the right size for the small forward postion.

[ace3g]

DeJuan45

WOW!!!!! I LOVE WAT I SEE!!! Hahaha


-----

just kidding I don't know what he is referring to

[hsxvvd]

Pop's new Findog II

[Amuseddaysleeper]

I don't see any benefit to signing Jefferson to a multi-year deal from the Spurs perspective. He's just a terrible fit here, period. We spent the past season moaning and groaning of how little he contributes to the court and now some rumors are saying the Spurs may look to extend him?

No thanks, I'd rather take my chances with Hairston for the time being and let him develop at an even greater pace with the extra minutes.

[Man In Black]

I've asked Larry Coon, the nation's pre-eminent capologist to ansk if RJ helps or hinders the Spurs with his contract. Since it's that time of the year, I know he won't get back to that question soon, or if at all, however, he did do a chat last evening and here is all that applies to the Spurs.

8:57
[Comment From Bubbles]
Smart move by Jefferson?

8:57
Larry Coon: I'm at a loss to explain Jefferson opting out. I don't think he's able to make up for it by signing a FA deal, even factoring in the uncertainty with the next CBA.

9:10
[Comment From Nas]
How happy are the Spurs?
9:11
Larry Coon: Nas -- I wouldn't go so far as to say it's Christmas in June for them, but they're definitely smiling.

9:23
[Comment From Lone Star]
Do the Spurs have any cap space now that RJ has opted out?

9:23
Larry Coon: Lone Star -- nope. Still capped-out.

12:06
[Comment From Joe]
I thought it was a dollar for dollar tax once over the cap? What is this about not being capable of going over?

12:07
Larry Coon: The cap is about $12 million less than the tax threshold. It's dollar-for-dollar when you're above the luxury tax threshold. Teams can't be over the cap without using an exception.

12:11
[Comment From nyk9327]
I think it's likely that David Lee will be a Spur now that Jefferson is out...

12:12
Larry Coon: Spurs didn't gain any cap room, even with RJ gone.

[PhxDog]

Having read the first ten pages, I am impressed by your collective ignorance.



1. The MLE and LLE are exceptions that every team receives at the beginning of free agency (except those who used the LLE the previous year--teams only get the LLE once every two years). The catch is that the exceptions count as holds against a team's salary cap.

In order to sign players, the team must use either cap space or an exception; in order to use your cap space, you first need to renounce your exceptions.

So, unless the Spurs get under the cap by, say, $8m (or however much is needed to sign a significant improvement over Splitter) their cap space isn't worth anything.


2. I'm sure Peter Holt is ecstatic like the reporters say--for whatever reason, he promised to pay luxury tax for two years to field non-championship teams, and suddenly his obligation is cut in half.

That doesn't mean that you should be ecstatic as a fan, obviously.


3. $32 million sounds awfully low for a Jefferson deal. The problem is, there's a not-insignificant risk he'll get nothing at all for the second year of his deal, and then only 60% of his promised salary in years three and four. In the worst case, that $32 million contract would be worth only $18 million or so in actual dollars.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

This thread is really separating the wheat from the chaff.

This!

Good news for Holt I guess.

[jiggy_55]

Please someone explain something to me, as I'm not aware of all the exact details.

RJ opts out = Spurs are screwed and we cannot sign a replacement since the drop off in salaries is not significant enough to give us more than the MLE. Here's the question: BUT, the Spurs can re-sign him? How is that possible? I just don't get it..
Everyone's been saying forever if he opts out it sucks cuz we won't have any added money to replace him with, but just how is it then possible to resign him or sign and trade him??? Please someone explain this to me.

As far I had understood, we're still left with the MLE whether he had opted out or not.

[Mr Bones]

I generally agree that defensive length is extremely helpful, but if some posters here think it's impossible to play a 6'6" guy at SF and have any success, how do they justify a 6' 6-1/2" guy playing center or PF for the Spurs without the same criticism? And if that's the case, why not trade Blair now while his stock is high, for a 6'10" SF? What about Blair/Hairston for Ilyasova?

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Please someone explain something to me, as I'm not aware of all the exact details.

RJ opts out = Spurs are screwed and we cannot sign a replacement since the drop off in salaries is not significant enough to give us more than the MLE. Here's the question: BUT, the Spurs can re-sign him? How is that possible? I just don't get it..
Everyone's been saying forever if he opts out it sucks cuz we won't have any added money to replace him with, but just how is it then possible to resign him or sign and trade him??? Please someone explain this to me.

As far I had understood, we're still left with the MLE whether he had opted out or not.

The Spurs can resign him or sign and trade him, because they have his Bird rights ( Bird rights IMO have done more damage than good since being introduced ). Either way, the Spurs will only have the MLE, LLE and min contracts to offer to FAs, of which the MLE is likely going to Splitter. So if RJ just leaves it leaves the Spurs with a huge hole at the 3 and only LLE type of money to offer, basically hoping to find a diamond in the rough, ala Bruce.

On the other hand, a potential sign and trade would possibly give the Spurs a very good asset in the form of a trade exception, whcih would be the best case scenario.To get it, the Spurs would have to S&T RJ to a team under the cap, say the Nets, for nothing/ protected 2nd round pick or something similar. This move would give the Spurs a trade exception the size of RJ's first year salary of his new contract, that the Spurs can use within a year on one player ( but cannot combine it with another player and make an offer ).Question is, why would the team under the cap agree to help the Spurs, doing a sign and trade ( as they can sign him outright ), unless the Spurs give them an incentive - be it a 1st round pick, or a player.

[HankChinaski]

Well early this evening when I heard about Jefferson opting out. I felt like there was a giant F'YOU to the spurs from one jeff. But after the initial reaction I sat and thought about it.

Honestly it isn't the worse thing to happen.

Sure puts a lot of pressure on the current squad especially the big 3 when it comes to minutes throughout the regular season. Leaves a giant hole in our rotation, which wasn't that fabulous to begin with in regards to the recent season. So we are back to same thought we had before in finding a serviceable SF just possibly without one Richard Jefferson. Which feels kind of nice.

1. I'm having a hard time envisioning the Front Office signing RJ to long term deal, unless it were a 3 to 4 year contract had some partially guranteed status on its 3rd and/or 4th year somewhere around the 7 million ballpark. I doubt he accepts something like that and he could easily weasel more from a lousy gm elsewhere if they (he and his agent) wait it out. But with a contract that looks to be cut down to half the cost or slightly around it, it becomes a nice pick up renegotiating his contract and considering his production this last season 6-8 mill a year doesn't taste as bad if he can produce consistency with those kind of numbers. He finds his shot again out on the 3pt line and fans would be pleased yet about him endless in a spurs jersey. Hopeful thinking in him finding his touch again but he can't possibly shot any worse than he did behind the arc.

2. Sign and Trade for serviceable replacement/trade exception/pick in some sort of fashion from those options combined or seperately. Allows the slap in the face of him using his player option to not sting as much and leaves us with something as oppose to nothing.

3. Let the man walk and Holt and crew don't have to be concerned about dipping into lux tax as heavily as before.

Regardless Spurs are going to have to look hard and make the best evaluated conclusion on whom they can pick up with what little money they can offer and fill out the roster with our 2 obvious holes in a Wing and Big. I don't see that much changing for them whether he comes back on a new contract or leaves.

All I know is I'm looking at this years Free Agency and feeling a bit more excited at what the this team will look like come training camp.

[jiggy_55]

The Spurs can resign him or sign and trade him, because they have his Bird rights ( Bird rights IMO have done more damage than good since being introduced ). Either way, the Spurs will only have the MLE, LLE and min contracts to offer to FAs, of which the MLE is likely going to Splitter. So if RJ just leaves it leaves the Spurs with a huge hole at the 3 and only LLE type of money to offer, basically hoping to find a diamond in the rough, ala Bruce.

I completely understand this now, thanks. It's the Bird rights thing that had me confused.

So basically, we can sign RJ now that he is opted out and this will not take up any of our MLE or etc? Otherwise, as you have said, the Spurs only have the "MLE, LLE and min contracts to offer to FAs".

On the other hand, a potential sign and trade would possibly give the Spurs a very good asset in the form of a trade exception, whcih would be the best case scenario.To get it, the Spurs would have to S&T RJ to a team under the cap, say the Nets, for nothing/ protected 2nd round pick or something similar. This move would give the Spurs a trade exception the size of RJ's first year salary of his new contract, that the Spurs can use within a year on one player ( but cannot combine it with another player and make an offer ).Question is, why would the team under the cap agree to help the Spurs, doing a sign and trade ( as they can sign him outright ), unless the Spurs give them an incentive - be it a 1st round pick, or a player.

So we CANNOT sign and trade RJ directly for another significant player? The only possible deal is as mentioned the trade exceptions? Which could then be used obviously to sign a significant player

[mudyez]

maybe we can back finley for one year!

never have been a big jefferson fan and I couldn't care less about him leaving, if it was nt for that nice expiring we may have been able to turn into something nice come february.

to be honest: If peter is happy to safe some money, I'm happy for him too and if RJ gets a well rounded contract, we should be ok too. and if not it means, that guys like Hairston get a chance we all where rooting for all the way!

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

I completely understand this now, thanks. It's the Bird rights thing that had me confused.

So basically, we can sign RJ now that he is opted out and this will not take up any of our MLE or etc? Otherwise, as you have said, the Spurs only have the "MLE, LLE and min contracts to offer to FAs".



So we CANNOT sign and trade RJ directly for another significant player? The only possible deal is as mentioned the trade exceptions? Which could then be used obviously to sign a significant player?

Yes we can re-sign him without using the MLE.This is one of the options - signing him to a longer contract that'd pay him less per year but giving him more financial security in the future and allowing the Spurs to save lux tax money.I think this is unlikely though.

As for S&T, we can trade him for another player as well, not just for a TE, but IMO netting a nice TE, say about 8-10 mil, would be a wonderful asset for the Spurs, provided that Holt is still in spend mode, as we could just absorb the contract of some player, making within that range, thus being able to provide instant cap relief to other teams.

[jermaine]

Yes we can re-sign him without using the MLE.This is one of the options - signing him to a longer contract that'd pay him less per year but giving him more financial security in the future and allowing the Spurs to save lux tax money.I think this is unlikely though.

As for S&T, we can trade him for another player as well, not just for a TE, but IMO netting a nice TE, say about 8-10 mil, would be a wonderful asset for the Spurs, provided that Holt is still in spend mode, as we could just absorb the contract of some player, making within that range, thus being able to provide instant cap relief to other teams.

All this is re ed as me tryin to figure this out!

[jiggy_55]

Yes we can re-sign him without using the MLE.This is one of the options - signing him to a longer contract that'd pay him less per year but giving him more financial security in the future and allowing the Spurs to save lux tax money.I think this is unlikely though.

As for S&T, we can trade him for another player as well, not just for a TE, but IMO netting a nice TE, say about 8-10 mil, would be a wonderful asset for the Spurs, provided that Holt is still in spend mode, as we could just absorb the contract of some player, making within that range, thus being able to provide instant cap relief to other teams.

I'm gonna have to disagree with that, considering more than a few sources have mentioned Pop working out with RJ this summer in SA. It seems clear to me that after the initial shock of him opting out, he simply CANNOT be that stupid to opt out of 15 million.

If there was no news about Pop working out with him than I would be slightly worried he'd leave us dry, but then again he couldn't have received a guarantee anyway. If Pop truly is working out with him it seems to indicate they are trying to fix some things in his game to make him a Spurs type player. It seems they've discussed this with his agent and management and a deal will be done. No reason to work him out if you don't want him back!

Can't see a sign-and-trade but it is slightly possible. RJ leaving us to sign with another team seems to be completely out of the question, as he could not have received a guarantee elsewhere since he's unable to make contact with anyone but the Spurs. Again, he wouldn't walk from 15 million guaranteed just like that.

[Muser]

Well that's us ed.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

I'm gonna have to disagree with that, considering more than a few sources have mentioned Pop working out with RJ this summer in SA. It seems clear to me that after the initial shock of him opting out, he simply CANNOT be that stupid to opt out of 15 million.

If there was no news about Pop working out with him than I would be slightly worried he'd leave us dry, but then again he couldn't have received a guarantee anyway. If Pop truly is working out with him it seems to indicate they are trying to fix some things in his game to make him a Spurs type player. It seems they've discussed this with his agent and management and a deal will be done. No reason to work him out if you don't want him back!

Can't see a sign-and-trade but it is slightly possible. RJ leaving us to sign with another team seems to be completely out of the question, as he could not have received a guarantee elsewhere since he's unable to make contact with anyone but the Spurs. Again, he wouldn't walk from 15 million guaranteed just like that.

Well who knows, we'll see soon I guess.

Common sense says he doesn't opt out of 15 mil unless he has a serious offer on the table, be it from the Spurs or some other team. Now, obviously he's not officially allowed to speak with other teams but it'd be naive to think his agent hasn't 'hypothetically' discussed alternatives with other teams. We have a very recent example with Byron Davis, who opted out of 17 Mil ( I think ) to sign with the Clippers. No one can prove tampering, of course, but it's naive to think he didn't know the offer from the Clippers would be on the table when he opted out.

[Mr Bones]

To this point in his career, Jefferson has made about 68 million dollars. If he signs a 4 year deal somewhere for 7 or 8 million a year, he maybe finishes his career having made around 100 million dollars. So if he absolutely hates playing for Pop or in San Antonio for any reason, opting out and moving on does make sense. What can he do in his life with 108 million dollars that he can't with 100 million?

[mudyez]

To this point in his career, Jefferson has made about 68 million dollars. If he signs a 4 year deal somewhere for 7 or 8 million a year, he maybe finishes his career having made around 100 million dollars. So if he absolutely hates playing for Pop or in San Antonio for any reason, opting out and moving on does make sense. What can he do in his life with 108 million dollars that he can't with 100 million?

clean the oil leak area for about 2 minutes!

[jiggy_55]

Well who knows, we'll see soon I guess.

Common sense says he doesn't opt out of 15 mil unless he has a serious offer on the table, be it from the Spurs or some other team. Now, obviously he's not officially allowed to speak with other teams but it'd be naive to think his agent hasn't 'hypothetically' discussed alternatives with other teams. We have a very recent example with Byron Davis, who opted out of 17 Mil ( I think ) to sign with the Clippers. No one can prove tampering, of course, but it's naive to think he didn't know the offer from the Clippers would be on the table when he opted out.

Agreed. Of course its highly possible many players talk with teams even before the July 1 date, but it's done in an indirect way probably and nobody ever speaks of it due to the consequences on both sides. I just don't see who wants him after his last year and is willing to pay a big enough amount to convince him to opt out. Can't see it myself.

Like I said, if the Spurs and Pop actually are working out with RJ in SA, the only reason would be is they want him and they convinced him they want him to stay and play a big role and they'd give him a nice 3/4 year contract.

[Mel_13]

I think I posted that 4 years, 32 million somewhere earlier in this thread before.

Mel_13, you Spursreport member, you.

It's not just me. Local media has picked it up.

Maybe the Spurs will announce a new deal for Jefferson in another week that will pay him about $32 million over four seasons.

[Chieflion]

It's not just me. Local media has picked it up.

LOL local media. Chieflion just making the predictions he is going to make like Delfino not being waived. Bunch of copycats catching on to 4 years, 32 million.

[Creation88]

i can't believe no one is considering that extending Jefferson pretty much guarantees no $ for resigning Parker in the off-season. and at the very least binds us to an aged roster for the next 4 years. you guys are morons.