What are some of the worst..

[picc84]

Full laker frontcourt to dominate the boards, alter 1on1 matchups, and affect shots inside = elimination of main reason Boston won in 2008.

[picc84]

Since Ron Artest guarded Paul Pierce extremely well, that obviously means Trevor Ariza would have guarded him well in 2008.

Naw....Trevor's 2009 playoffs proves how big an upgrade he would have been over Vlad Rad. 2010 goes to Bynum >>> Turiaf.

[Muser]

So does that mean L.A's 2010 le is asterisked because of Perkins going down?

[Goran Dragic]

Naw....Trevor's 2009 playoffs proves how big an upgrade he would have been over Vlad Rad. 2010 goes to Bynum >>> Turiaf.

You're also neglecting to mention:

2008 KG >>> 2010 KG
2008 Pierce >>> 2010 Pierce
2008 Allen >>> 2010 Allen
James Posey >>> Tony Allen

[Dunc n Dave]

I'm a Macro Level thinker....I have a global perspective of things...so I say worst close-out games of all time is Lakers 16 NBA les > Miami 1

To be fair though Miami 4 's on their team > to Lakers 0.....

Luke Walton says "Hi!"

[picc84]

So does that mean L.A's 2010 le is asterisked because of Perkins going down?

Maybe if Bynum had been anywhere near healthy the entire series, and if Rasheed hadn't beasted in his place in game 7.

Too bad LA didn't have Sheed replacing Bynum in 08. Probably would have won then too.

[Goran Dragic]

Sheed was good on offense but he played absolutely atrocious defense and didn't box anything out.

[Muser]

picc, leave this kind of trolling to luva.

[picc84]

You're also neglecting to mention:

2008 KG >>> 2010 KG
2008 Pierce >>> 2010 Pierce
2008 Allen >>> 2010 Allen
James Posey >>> Tony Allen

2010 Pierce had just come off possibly his best playoff series in 3 years in the ECF. He just ran into Ron Artest. Thats all. Ray was about the same. He had a similar slump in the 08 playoffs, only that one lasted 2 1/2 rounds. KG is worse, but Rondo is tons better. Tony Allen not a large dropoff from Posey, and Nate played better than any backup PG they had then. Wallace and Baby were better than Brown and Powe.

Not to mention:

2008 Kobe >> 2010 Kobe
2008 Bynum >> 2010 Bynum
2008 Ariza >>>> 2008 Vlad Rad

I mean, we could do this all day. But the players that matter were all around the same relative effectiveness they were back then. Only difference is LA was missing 2 starters, both of whom have proved they matter in a big way the last 2 years.

Bynum for matchups and inside presence. Ariza for all-around. Trevor didn't stop Carmelo in the 09 WCF, but that didn't stop him from having a huge impact on the series. Bada bing.

[Goran Dragic]

He just ran into Ron Artest.

Which wouldn't have happened in 2008.

[Muser]

Having Bynum and Ariza wouldn't of changed that elimination game ass raping.

[Goran Dragic]

Tony Allen not a large dropoff from Posey

yeah Tony Allen woulda been able to knock down all those clutch 3 pointers Posey did during Boston's game 4 comeback.

[picc84]

Sheed was good on offense but he played absolutely atrocious defense and didn't box anything out.

Sheed played his ass off in that game....don't go trying to act like he wasn't balling because it doesn't flow with your angle. I remember watching the game and wishing Perkins was healthy b/c Sheed was giving it to us, and I do believe one of the commentators made a remark echoing the sentiment.

Something about Perk's injury being bittersweet for the Lakers because of Sheed's beasting. Don't remember which of them it was.

Perk's replacement in '10 finals: 9/4/1
Bynum's replacement in '08 finals: 0/.7/0

If only we could have had that luxury.

[Goran Dragic]

If only LA had those 9 extra points, that way they only lose by 30 instead of 39.

[picc84]

Having Bynum and Ariza wouldn't of changed that elimination game ass raping.

Wouldn't have been an elimination game in the first place.

[picc84]

yeah Tony Allen woulda been able to knock down all those clutch 3 pointers Posey did during Boston's game 4 comeback.

You clinging to such a minute point amidst all the other comparison.

[Muser]

Right, because Ariza would of shut down Pierce..

[Muser]

Can I use the injury card to say Ginobili was injured in 08 too? IMO Lakers visit to the finals should have an asterisk.

[picc84]

Right, because Ariza would of shut down Pierce..

Didn't say he would have. Still would have been better defensively than Vlad Rad though, by far - especially on help D. Not as good as Artest, but better than Vlad or Luke. And bolstered by the twin towers in the middle with Big Bynum back.

Like I mentioned, Trevor didn't shut down Melo in the WCF but still had a huge series. He's a much better player than Vlad or Luke and has significant impact on games - that's the point. There was question as to whether he should be resigned over Odom. Thats not an inconsequential player.

Can I use the injury card to say Ginobili was injured in 08 too? IMO Lakers visit to the finals should have an asterisk.

Sorry, that only works when the other team is healthy, chum. At least Ginobili was playing - he's the only reason SA won the one game they did.

[JamStone]

Not sure why you brought up Ronny Turiaf. His minutes actually went down in the playoffs, and against the Celtics in the Finals compared to the regular season. Bynum's minutes weren't really replaced by Turiaf. Bynum's absence was covered by Phil Jackson playing both Gasol and Odom 38-40 mpg each. Turiaf was getting spot minutes he might not have gotten, but the majority of Bynum's minutes were covered by Gasol/Odom.

Warped distortion to compare Turiaf to Wallace as replacements for Bynum and Perkins respectively.

[picc84]

No real reason. Just musing on the strength of Boston's replacement C compared to LA's. Would have loved to have had him back then, enjoying the luxury Boston had this year.

[jacobdrj]

I was and still am in many ways a big fan of Chauncey Billups. He was always confident, borderline y, but he always "tried" to be diplomatic despite that iness. Well spoken and really a great leader because not only of his supreme confidence in himself and his teammates but also because of his knowledge of the game (which he greatly improved on during his Pistons tenure) and self-motivation.

But one thing that irritated the out of me when it came to Billups was that he was the king of excuses. Always an "if" man when his team lost. If the Pistons had homecourt advantage, then they would have beaten the Spurs in 2005. If he didn't get hurt or one of his teammates didn't get hurt, they'd have beaten the Heat or the Cavs or the Celtics or whoever else... It was always retrospective excuse making with Chauncey when the team lost in the playoffs. Again, he'd be diplomatic and give credit to the team that beat him and the Pistons, but he'd always use a caveat and say something to the effect "if" this or "if" that, it would have turned out differently. Bugged the out of me and got really old, especially by 2007 after Daniel Gibson shat all over Chauncey and 2008 when Chauncey once again used an ankle injury as an excuse.

This is the first time I've ever heard the excuse that Steve Nash winning the 2006 League MVP made Chauncey Billups play poorly. Never heard that. And it's beyond stupid for that to be a logical justification for playing like crap in the playoffs.

My observations were that once we started to hear that it was likely that Nash was going to win, Billups played noticeably different. It is possible that Billups just started sucking when that happened. But I distinctly remember that he wanted that MVP more than the championship that season, and being the ball dominator that he was that season, he directly impacted how the rest of the team played by his complete lack of urgency... IMHO, he had his ring, he wanted 'his' MVP...