MJ asked again about Kobe vs. LeBron (August 2010)

[21_Blessings]

Wade was at Kobe's mercy in that vid.

1:23

[HarlemHeat37]

Personally what I think about is how LBJ and Kobe faced many of the same struggles as stud players coming out of high school.

Coming out of that rape case, even though he might have not committed the crime, Kobe did at least cheat on his wife and the taunting and humiliation he received was just like the taunting LeBron has gotten over this summer.

Kobe shut his mouth and won. LeBron's not doing that first part really well.

What they did was very comparable..one guy raped a woman, then proceeded to snitch on his teammate for no reason..the other guy left his team through Free Agency, while generating 6 million $ to charity..very comparable..

There's a huge difference between making predictions about how good a college player will be in the NBA and making a determination of which NBA player has been better based on what they have already done. Those are two very different things. Making predictions about the future is much harder to do than making an accurate assessment about what has already occurred.

Except Jordan doesn't actually state his argument to show his assessment of the players..partly because it would waste time at those camps or wherever he was at, and the other part is because he can't..

All these people that say Kobe is the best player in the NBA can't back up their arguments..I have honestly yet to hear one..I can't really imagine a proper argument to back Kobe up..

I don't expect it from any Lakers/Pistons fans on SpursTalk(I group the Pistons, because there are a surprising amount of Pistons fans that are Laker homers here), because pretty much every Laker fan here has no ability to argue about basketball, so feel free to quote a 3rd party's argument..

[HarlemHeat37]

Al-Quobe going off of random, individual plays to make arguments..

[namlook]

All these people that say Kobe is the best player in the NBA can't back up their arguments..I have honestly yet to hear one..I can't really imagine a proper argument to back Kobe up..

People like you can't be convinced no matter how compelling the evidence. You would dismiss it all. So why should anyone waste their breath talking to you about it?

[TheManFromAcme]

Al-Quobe going off of random, individual plays to make arguments..

....but the fact remains that this thread was not about using individual plays for Kobe's sakes. It's about MJ's opinion regarding who he thinks is the better player. Nothing more. Nothing less. He spoke and obviously his resounding opinion is tearing you new one. Never mind that if he would have said it was Lebron, you, Heat and the rest of the Lebron nut-huggers in here would have said case closed.

It's cowardly if you ask me. Take the medicine. Accept that Kobe is the better player for now and move on. The more you go against the collective grains, in this case MJ being Big-Kahuna grain himself, the more stupid and idiotic you Bron lovers in here appear.

You guys insisted that MJ is God, well God spoke and now your commiting heresy. Basketball heathens.

[21_Blessings]

You can't be the best player in the game without a post game anyways. It's an unwritten law among basketball greats.

[ambchang]

There's a huge difference between making predictions about how good a college player will be in the NBA and making a determination of which NBA player has been better based on what they have already done. Those are two very different things. Making predictions about the future is much harder to do than making an accurate assessment about what has already occurred.

How about Jason Richardson and Jared Dudley to Phoenix for Raja Bell, Boris Diaw and Sean Singletary?

Getting Desagana Diop (well for trash, to be fair)?

[picc84]

Al-Quobe going off of random, individual plays to make arguments..

you riding osama bin robin

[ambchang]

People like you can't be convinced no matter how compelling the evidence. You would dismiss it all. So why should anyone waste their breath talking to you about it?

How was the evidence compelling? Because an, at best, average GM who happened to be the GOAT said so?

What other evidence is there? That when Kobe had bad teammates his team couldn't get in the playoffs or got bounced in the 1st round?

That Lebron, with poor teammates, dragged his team to the playoffs (albeit in the much weaker EC)?

That Kobe threw his teammates under the bus multiple times?

That Kobe created turmoil in a team with 4 HoFs and lost to the underdog Pistons?

That Kobe shot 6-24 in the Game 7 for 23 points and required great efforts by Gasol and Artest to win the game, along with a very mysterious 21 FTA in the 4th?

That Game 6 vs. the Kings in 2002 was so ridiculously controversial the NBA removed all references to that game on youtube?

[TheManFromAcme]

MJ's comments are definitely salt to your wounds aren't they ambchang?

[himat]

What they did was very comparable..one guy raped a woman, then proceeded to snitch on his teammate for no reason..the other guy left his team through Free Agency, while generating 6 million $ to charity..very comparable

I'm not saying that LeBron leaving Cleveland is worse than Kobe's rape case, in fact, Kobe's situation was a lot worse.

Kobe kept his mouth shut, worked hard, and rebuilt his reputation. LeBron isn't doing the first part.

Letting his game do all the talking would be a much more effective way to shut people up.

[Killakobe81]

You can't be the best player in the game without a post game anyways. It's an unwritten law among basketball greats.

You can't be the best in the game WITHOUT winning it all. Period. that's how MJ was wired. he knew he was better than Magic and Bird but he needed to PROVE it with a trophy and ring.

Lebron has got an arguuably better Pippen than kobe or MJ saw now he need to go snatch 6 ...

Until then Lebron is the better day in day out but absolute BEST player in the game? Nah, brah no rings no glory ... end of story.

[Killakobe81]

How was the evidence compelling? Because an, at best, average GM who happened to be the GOAT said so?

What other evidence is there? That when Kobe had bad teammates his team couldn't get in the playoffs or got bounced in the 1st round?

That Lebron, with poor teammates, dragged his team to the playoffs (albeit in the much weaker EC)?

That Kobe threw his teammates under the bus multiple times?

That Kobe created turmoil in a team with 4 HoFs and lost to the underdog Pistons?

That Kobe shot 6-24 in the Game 7 for 23 points and required great efforts by Gasol and Artest to win the game, along with a very mysterious 21 FTA in the 4th?

That Game 6 vs. the Kings in 2002 was so ridiculously controversial the NBA removed all references to that game on youtube?

LOL cry me a river rings all that matters ...

[ambchang]

MJ's comments are definitely salt to your wounds aren't they ambchang?

Not really, it was more that Laker fans, all of a sudden, are saying MJ's opinions are somehow the golden standard to which all basketball fans have to agree to, despite his questionable ability to be a talent evaluator.

[ambchang]

LOL cry me a river rings all that matters ...

Do you have anything meaningful to say in this matter. A Laker fan said Harlem's opinion cannot be changed despite overwhelming evidence, and I asked, what evidence?

What was it that I said that was untrue?

Oh, I forgot to mention two MVPs the last two years.

[Killakobe81]

[QUOTE=ambchang;4578122]How was the evidence compelling? Because an, at best, average GM who happened to be the GOAT said so?

What other evidence is there? That when Kobe had bad teammates his team couldn't get in the playoffs or got bounced in the 1st round?

That Lebron, with poor teammates, dragged his team to the playoffs (albeit in the much weaker EC)?

That Kobe threw his teammates under the bus multiple times?

That Kobe created turmoil in a team with 4 HoFs and lost to the underdog Pistons?

That Kobe shot 6-24 in the Game 7 for 23 points and required great efforts by Gasol and Artest to win the game, along with a very mysterious 21 FTA in the 4th?

That Game 6 vs. the Kings in 2002 was so ridiculously controversial the NBA removed all references to that game on youtube?[/QUOTE]

No i wont add here i said my piece but the above that is Excuse, excuse, excuse.
Lebron is great he doesnt need your excuses. But he does need a ring to validate his legacy ...otherwise he is Karl malone or chuck they made it to the Finals too ...

[Cry Havoc]

The sound you heard when this thread was made was dozens of Lakers fans spooging all over their computers.

[Killakobe81]

The sound you heard when this thread was made was dozens of Lakers fans spooging all over their computers.

the other sound you heard is the screech of airjordans, stacy adams crocs and gucci loafers as the haters backpedal because the GOAT agrees with that Kobe is better ...

[Cry Havoc]

the other sound you heard is the screech of airjordans, stacy adams crocs and gucci loafers as the haters backpedal because the GOAT agrees with that Kobe is better ...

He's also the guy that led the team he owned to a championship on the basis of his ability to judge talent.

Oh wait. He sucked and signed a bunch of awful players who had no business being on a team together.

Jordan knows Kobe will never eclipse his legacy. He knows LeBron has a chance, albeit an outside one, to do so. Of course he's going to say Kobe. Jordan doesn't want anyone compared to him, and the next logical step people take after defining LeBron as clearly a better player than Kobe (which he is) is to start comparing him to the GoAT.

[TheManFromAcme]

Not really, it was more that Laker fans, all of a sudden, are saying MJ's opinions are somehow the golden standard to which all basketball fans have to agree to, despite his questionable ability to be a talent evaluator.

answer this:....

What if in the video MJ would have said Bron and it was Laker fan arguing his credibility. What would your justification be.

Just curious.

[Cry Havoc]

answer this:....

What if in the video MJ would have said Bron and it was Laker fan arguing his credibility. What would your justification be.

Just curious.

That's the point. It really does not matter what Jordan thinks. It really doesn't. As far as evaluating other players go, he's just another former player with average to (maybe) slightly above average ability.

[ambchang]

answer this:....

What if in the video MJ would have said Bron and it was Laker fan arguing his credibility. What would your justification be.

Just curious.

Depending on what the Heat group will say. If they take it as some final say on the matter, I would make fun of them just as much.

In my mind, Lebron is a better player than Kobe, and he has been for a few years, but I am not going to use Jordan as some kind of reference, he has proven he cannot judge talent.

[picc84]

Jordans just scared of Kobe. He doesn't want to anger him by saying he's not the best.

Wait, thats wrong. Jordans actually scared of Lebron. He's frightened he'll surpass his legacy and is shaking in his boots thinking about it.

[TheManFromAcme]

Jordans just scared of Kobe. He doesn't want to anger him by saying he's not the best.

Wait, thats wrong. Jordans actually scared of Lebron. He's frightened he'll surpass his legacy and is shaking in his boots thinking about it.

....and his mental notes......

[ambchang]

No i wont add here i said my piece but the above that is Excuse, excuse, excuse.
Lebron is great he doesnt need your excuses. But he does need a ring to validate his legacy ...otherwise he is Karl malone or chuck they made it to the Finals too ...

First, learn to quote.

Second, learn to type, I have no clue what you are sayiing in your first "sentence", and I really mean that.

It's totally fine to have typos and grammatical errors and such, but at least type in a manner where your point could be understood.

Third, read the thread, the thread is about Laker fans going gaga about Jordan naming Kobe as the better of the two, and use that as some kind of argument.

It has NOTHING to do with Lebron's legacy.

And FYI, Malone is a choker, and Barkley can't defend. Lebron is still not where those two are from a career accomplishments standpoint, but Lebron's prime has already surpassed those two.