so if some parts of the Bible are fallible, which parts are we supposed to believe and why?
Be specific.
The parts of the Bible that have to deal more with the cultural mores of the day (i.e., slavery and the status of women) are definitely fallible, while parts that have to deal with unyielding truth (i.e., don't kill or covet your neighbor's wife) are to be followed regardless of the timeframe in human history.
That's what I was referring to earlier about context with redzero.
LSSP is right. No one would ever interpret what that message from the bible is differently either. Its not like we have a ton of different Christian denominations. Nor should the message of the parts of the bible left out of the King James version be taken into account either.
Nope.
The magic stories involving Jesus are fallible, imo.
Why is "don't covet your neighbor's wife" something to be followed regardless of the timeframe in human history? Do you think it should be illegal to covet a neighbor's wife?
That's your opinion on Jesus' miracles--I'm not going to try and convince you otherwise. Believe what you want to believe.
As far as should coveting your neighbor's wife be illegal? It's not, as long as you don't act on it. According to the Bible, though, it's displeasing to God to have such thoughts.
So, to answer your question, no.
You didn't have to convince me. I already knew that the stories were penned by man and are inherently fallable.
Right. It fits a moral code that was penned by man.As far as should coveting your neighbor's wife be illegal? It's not, as long as you don't act on it. According to the Bible, though, it's displeasing to God to have such thoughts.
So, to answer your question, no.
Whether coveting a neighbor's wife is inherently destructive to society at large or not is open for debate.
I bet I can find some unyielding truths in books like Twilight too if I really looked. Unlike some, I don't believe in Twilight either.
We as human beings can only go on what we find logical. If something seems illogical from a human standpoint, I see no point in giving it a pass.
Perfection is a tricky thing. We human being have never experienced perfection. We have never seen it in action, yet we like to give out the label. Going by the basic definition of perfection, I found God's actions illogical.God (if you believe in Him) is perfect--we are not, therefore it's inherent that we're not gonna understand everything about Him (otherwise we'd all be God).
And you operate under the assumption that God thinks the way we do to some extent, do you not? You think that God wants credit for his creation. You think God wants to be praised, do you not? The Christian God is the epitome of anthropomorphism. To believe in him, one would have to go on many assumptions.You're also working from the assumption that God must gain something from creating us in order to be logical. That is somewhat presumptuous. You're attempting to make sense of the actions of a supernatural being by forcing him to abide by the standards of what we humans (His creations to begin with) deem "logical"?
I am criticizing human being's idea of God. Human beings are the ones who gave him characteristics attributed to human beings. I am trying to take them away because a perfect en y doesn't need emotions are whatever imperfect motives we have.There's really only two ways to believe in God--accept that we can't think and reason on the same plane as Him or presume to explain everything He does to the nth degree (in effect declaring ourselves on par with God by contending we can make logical sense of everything He does).
But the thing is that Christians want to make God as human as possible, but when the inconsistencies come up, they say that it's only illogical because we as humans cannot grasp them.There's no middle ground if you believe there is a God, as far as I'm concerned.
When it really comes down to it, faith in God is illogical. Human beings are inclined to start religions and create deities, and I see no reason why the Christian God is the right one and the others gods are false.
And there are the heresies and the Protestants/Lutherans who take out portions of the Bible.
Hate to be a wet blanket, y'all, but I've got plans for the evening. I'm open to continuing this discussion later, though. I can't help it--I like debates. Just PM me, aight?
Peace.
Manny, what truth do you truly seek?
The Bible is the truth. Every word.
Can you give an atheist or agnostic a reason to believe in God? Can you do it without appealing to emotions?
Just curious.
And how do you know that it's the truth?
23 pages and you s still can't come to terms with the bible being one huge load of smelly poo. I hate you people.
A general consensus hasn't been reached in 2000 years, so what makes you think people on here would reach one after a few days?
Nothing makes me think it. I expected to open the thread read 3 or 4 posts that reflect you morons going back and forth for 20 something pages. Call you stupid and then leave.
Its not my first time in a thread like this. Happens all the time round here. Personally I love it.
God bless.
Zak, I seek the truth that explains to me wtf is wrong inside your head. I'm not even sure your god knows the answer there.
i kinda picture him as a winter caretaker of an isolated hotel.......sitting at a typewriter.
God spelled backwards is doG.
Consider your mind
And what do you call the receipients who vote republican? What an absurd statement.
nothing worse than a drunk who finds jesus
?? hypocrites.
Hypocrites >>>>>>>> slaves.
A statement like this troubles me coming from a person I have always felt was a tad more intelligent than others.
You can say what you want about God, Catholics,different religions, cults,and evil and good spirits all you want, those subjects are all fare game in making cheesy insults and are always up to debates.
But the bible is more than a book of meaningless scriptures and fairy tales. Its a recorded history that needs to be used and studied like you would use any other book that is older than 200 years. Scientist have agreed the time of the flood in the bible is dead on with their calculations of when the earth was flooded.
For example we may all disagree on how we got here and if there is a God or not but one thing we must agree on is there is a huge ball of heat and light in space called the Sun.
No matter if you believe we came from a Monkey, a creator,God, or alien beings, one thing we can't argue is the Sun.
The sun is there in your face its hot and it gives off light. Well to me a book that is older than 1000 years deserves to be taken serious no matter how absurd it looks. If you found an old joke book that is over 200 years old and it was written by George Washington you would find it to be part of history no matter if it brings anything good.
The bible may have stories that are hard to comprehend and it may be 75% lies and worthless drivel but it still contains events that took place over 1000s of years and to me that is worthy enough to not be calling it a book of poo.
It can't be any worst than a book written by Dr. Laura or Larry flint and those two have been on the top ten sellers list at one time or another.
So the next time you want to refer the bible as a book of worthless poo ask yourself what have you read lately that is really any more significant?
Noting worse than a bartender who enables the drunk.
Very interesting points here.
I'd like to throw in another perspective to ponder on.
If the Bible was looked upon as a history reference or as a very interesting historical artifact---and that is all, then I don't think many people would really be arguing over meanings and facts and/or perceived facts found in the bible.
But this book (and I said this on page 1) is only a book written by human beings. Human beings have agendas---like trying to control other human beings and that is what the bible was used for throughout history.
This book has been at the core of wars throughout history and has been used to justify the murders of millions throughout history also.
If the bible was taken for what it is (an excellent book with wonderful material)
and left alone-except as a nice reference book of ancient history, then it can arguably be said that the entire world would be better off.
The problem is...is that the world is run by insane human beings who have crazily elevated this book to ---THE word of god himself.
And you want to confirm how insane human beings really are?
Billions of these insane human beings have actually swallowed this fantasy and have subscribed to this lunacy and have killed and waged wars upon other human beings who , maybe, didn't want to subscribe to whatever version was being spinned at the time.
If this in not proof of insane people running this asylum, then I don't know what is.
The bible is used as a tool to control, oppress and dictate laws to millions upon millions of lives on the planet, yet the ONE thing that should have been taken and applied from the bible---is forgotten.
LOVE.
That is it. Love.
Not worship.
Not god.
Not prayer,punishment,heaven, .
The mystics have been saying this for centuries...yet no-one listens...no-one wants to hear the truth.
Forget worship and punishment and a supreme being---it is about love.
So, trying to convince others about scriptures and passages and punishing them when they DON'T subscribe....you lost your way---it is not love--to punish and kill.
Trying to sell heaven to others---or threaten them with ....you lost your way---it is not love to bribe and punish....
Prayer.....bartering with some force to grant you your wishes....you lost your way....not love....
Trying to live your life by some rules that are supposed to guarantee your passage to a heaven, an eternity, a reward....you lost your way...IF you had to pass a test to be allowed into a reward like heaven---you lost your way...IF you were good for NO reason whatsoever---you were just intrinsically good---THAT might be a bit purer---and CLOSER to love ---than being good FOR A REWARD....not love....
this goes on and on...
as soon as you start talking about god----you have lost your way because NO-HUMAN-BEING has EVER -ever-EVER-ever-EVER....personally seen god...and the IDEA you have formed about god---is a barrier to seeing god---
then you have lost your way again....
this is not brain surgery...this is self-evident to anyone who is open to truth...but if you have already formed a picture of what god is...if you have already subscribe to a book which is bigger than life itself...if you are already trying to brainwash other people on things that you yourself have been brainwashed with....then you are also closed to truth...you think you already know...
again....you have lost your way....
as I said in page 1....
nothing that I have said here is untrue....you can examine it with a microscope and will not find any falseness...
but people don't want to see truth....
it is not new....
oh...and one more thing....regarding your analogy of THE SUN...
if people were to suddenly say....
THE SUN is GOD himself....and from now on we HAVE to live by these rules that were BURNED on a mountain ---BY THE SUN HIMSELF...and if you don't follow these rules to the letter---you will be punished...by these leaders we will call----SUN PRIESTS....
and your punishment will be an eternity of a place called...THE FREEZER...that's right you will freeze forever....an eternity of ICE....
wouldn't we then have the appropriate analogy of the SUN=THE BIBLE?
and wouldn't we think those people were INSANE?
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