Shaq takes a shot at Mo Williams

[Chieflion]

Disparaging other players because they're not good - is that really necessary?

I would accept your point if Shaq had the balls to say it while he was still on the Heat. But getting traded then badmouthing players you played with the minute you're gone makes you a , no exceptions.

Funny thing is, Shaq went on to wear out his stay on his next two teams.

I am guessing Shaq already showed his discontent while on the Heat, performing like on purpose in the 2007-2008 stay with the Heat, then suddenly playing well on the Suns. Maybe all of his discontent wasn't publicized like while he was on the Lakers but he certainly had some of it. Shaq's story is well do ented, to be the media clown and be in the spotlight. I don't think he is insulting the players as much as he was insulting management for not surrounding Dwyane Wade and him with the supporting cast they deserve to go on another le run instead of preparing for 2010.

Shaq, being on the twilight of his career, definitely felt angry at Heat management trying to throw away the next 2 years of his career just to swoop up the FA market in 2010, which was why he demanded out. He was definitely discontent with Heat management for pulling all this bull . He could have an example of any Heat player that year and it wouldn't have mattered. Remember, this was still when Duncan and Shaq both had 3 rings each. Miami was blatantly tanking, but no one talked about it because they ended up with a pothead, all these reasons for Shaq's negative feelings about Miami. He did get 1 championship with the Heat but people would never learn to be content, especially an icon like Shaq.

In the end, the Heat justified the means by signing both James and Bosh, along with Wade to swoop up all the top 3 prizes in the 2010 FA market.

[Steve Kerr]

Of all the people you can criticize Shaq for taking shots at, Mo ing Williams isn't one of them. With all the talk, dumb shot selection, choking, and iness we've seen from Williams while he's been Lebron's bag boy the last two years, he's easily one of the most hatable players in the NBA.

[Giuseppe]

I am guessing Shaq already showed his discontent while on the Heat, performing like on purpose in the 2007-2008 stay with the Heat, then suddenly playing well on the Suns.

Though D'Antoni shovin' him out to chase the pick-&-roll 20 feet from the basket was choice.

tee, hee.

[Killakobe81]

I don't hate on Shaq to build up Kobe ...
Shaq had all natural gifts to be MDE ...
But he never fully reaized or developed his game.
Was he the driving force for the 3 peat? Yes, he was. But he also was the primary reason, why the Lakers underperformed in teh regular seasons in 2001 -2003. All the late surgeries, out of shape off-seasons, and the media war with Buss and Bryant were ALL initiated by Shaq. Not saying Buss and especially Bryant are blameless ...BUT look at Shaq's track record who else have THEY beefed with? Shaq has burnt more bridges than General Sherman ...

Shaq definitely deserves jersey hanging, but no statue and his place in Lakers lore will be far behind Magic, Kareem, Kobe and West ...

[Steve Kerr]

I don't hate on Shaq to build up Kobe ...
Shaq had all natural gifts to be MDE ...
But he never fully reaized or developed his game.
Was he the driving force for the 3 peat? Yes, he was. But he also was the primary reason, why the Lakers underperformed in teh regular seasons in 2000 -2003. All the late surgeries, out of shape off-seasons, and the media war with Buss and Bryant were ALL initiated by Shaq. Not saying Buss and especially Bryant are blameless ...BUT look at Shaq's track record who else have THEY beefed with? Shaq has burnt more bridges than General Sherman ...

Shaq definitely deserves jersey hanging, but no statue and his place in Lakers lore will be far behind Magic, Kareem, Kobe and West ...

The Lakers underperformed in the 2000 regular season? 67 wins wasn't good enough? It's grasping at straws to say the least when Shaq leads LA to a championship 3 times from 2000-2003, and your response is, "but they coulda been better in the regular season ," while completely neglecting the fact Kobe's selfish play in 2003 and 2004 was what stood in the way of a possible 5-peat. The Lakers stopped winning championships when Kobe took over as the #1 option, Shaq had every right to gripe about being told to become a sidekick after leading a team to a 3-peat.

[Killakobe81]

The Lakers underperformed in the 2000 regular season? 67 wins wasn't good enough? It's grasping at straws to say the least when Shaq leads LA to a championship 3 times from 2000-2003, and your response is, "but they coulda been better in the regular season ," while completely neglecting the fact Kobe's selfish play in 2003 and 2004 was what stood in the way of a possible 5-peat. The Lakers stopped winning championships when Kobe took over as the #1 option, Shaq had every right to gripe about being told to become a sidekick after leading a team to a 3-peat.

I meant 2001- 2003 typo ...
And as far as Kobe being selfish I am not ignoring that part only pointing out why some Laker fans have a problem with Shaq. Was not that what the post I was quoting talking about? Why the need to interject Kobe here? there is a kobe thread for that. Isn't that the #1 complaint about NBA forum fans that Laker fans always bring up Kobe? Read my post again smart guy.

As for Kobe I blame him for 2004 ...I blame both for 2003 FTR ...

[Killakobe81]

The Lakers underperformed in the 2000 regular season? 67 wins wasn't good enough? It's grasping at straws to say the least when Shaq leads LA to a championship 3 times from 2000-2003, and your response is, "but they coulda been better in the regular season ," while completely neglecting the fact Kobe's selfish play in 2003 and 2004 was what stood in the way of a possible 5-peat. The Lakers stopped winning championships when Kobe took over as the #1 option, Shaq had every right to gripe about being told to become a sidekick after leading a team to a 3-peat.

Learn to read son, I thought the University of Arizona was a ins ution of higher learning ...I said ESPECIALLY BRYANT was not blameles ...

[Steve Kerr]

Learn to read son, I thought the University of Arizona was a ins ution of higher learning ...I said ESPECIALLY BRYANT was not blameles ...

You of all people is telling someone learn to read? The person on this site who doesn't know how to properly end a sentence is telling someone else learn to read . Maybe next you can tell me I shouldn't confuse the 13th and 16th overall picks.

Oh and I'm just confirming but in this post you're admitting Kobe is the party to be blamed for the Lakers underachieving in 2003 and 2004?

[Steve Kerr]

I meant 2001- 2003 typo ...

Sure you did. In the future you should hit up basketball-reference before attempting to talk about the Lakers prior to 02-01-08

[Killakobe81]

You of all people is telling someone learn to read? The person on this site who doesn't know how to properly end a sentence is telling someone else learn to read . Maybe next you can tell me I shouldn't confuse the 13th and 16th overall picks.

Oh and I'm just confirming but in this post you're admitting Kobe is the party to be blamed for the Lakers underachieving in 2003 and 2004?

What does reading comprehension have to do with punctuation? Two seperate things. And yes, I blame Kobe for 2004 and Both Shaq and Kobe for 2003 (primarily shaq for his off-season stuff, I thought I SAID THAT already) again, reading comprehension.

[Steve Kerr]

And yes I blame Kobe for 2004 and Both Shaq and Kobe for 2003, again reading comprehension.

OK, so Kobe is more to blame for the post 3-peat storm than Shaq. I find it odd you never criticize him for it, but anyway.

Thanks for playing.

[Killakobe81]

OK, so Kobe is more to blame for the post 3-peat storm than Shaq. I find it odd you never criticize him for it, but anyway.

Thanks for playing.

I have. Plenty of times. Just because you aren't privy to it or choose to ignore it. In the thread about your franchise worst moments, (a month back or so) I said that I hated 2003 EVEN more than 2004. Because of the back-fighting that team went through. Winning that le was more relief than excitement for me. And I was ready for the team to be dismantled from THAT off-season. But I did not post here then. So how would you know? As for me not bringing it up more often, why would I? I don't create threads saying Kobe is the GOAT or crap like that. I am no blind Kobe homer, he is not even my all-time favorite Laker so I could care less if I didn't know his draft slot. Many assume he is my favorite, but I chose the name for the "haters" on here. Magic is my favorite Laker. He was drafted #1 BTW ...LOL but who cares?

[Killakobe81]

Sure you did. In the future you should hit up basketball-reference before attempting to talk about the Lakers prior to 02-01-08

Is this my response to my join date so should I look up this "troll account" join date and judge you posts by that as well? Real, smart.

[Steve Kerr]

In the thread about your franchise worst moments, (a month back or so) I said that I hated 2003 EVEN more than 2004. Because of the back-fighting that team went through. Winning that le was more relief than excitement for me.

The Lakers didn't win a le in 2003. Again, here's a link if you wanna talk about the pre 02-01-08 Lakers

http://www.basketball-reference.com/

[Killakobe81]

The Lakers didn't win a le in 2003. Again, here's a link if you wanna talk about the pre 02-01-08 Lakers

http://www.basketball-reference.com/

What year was the 2002 NBA FINALS played in? The 2000 Season was played in 2001 the 2001 season in 2002 and the 2002 season in 2003.
So I look at the year the Finals was won, you use the year that season started.

I know you are trying to be a smart ass ... but you are being more the former than the latter.

[Steve Kerr]

What year was the 2002 NBA FINALS played in? The 2000 Season was played in 2001 the 2001 season in 2002 and the 2002 season in 2003.
So I look at the year the Finals was won, you use the year that season started.

The 2002 finals were played in 2002. The "XXXX season" always ends in the year XXXX.

The 2000 season started in 1999 and played in 2000. It was never played in 2001.

again, when you're trying to talk pre 02-01-08, consult

http://www.basketball-reference.com/

[Steve Kerr]

Here's a link to the last game of the last finals the Kobe-Shaq lakers won.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...206120NJN.html

Let the record show the top of the page has the date "June 12, 2002"

[MavDynasty]

DoK with the ing goods

[Killakobe81]

Here's a link to the last game of the last finals the Kobe-Shaq lakers won.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...206120NJN.html

Let the record show the top of the page has the date "June 12, 2002"

If i made a mistake by a year I will be man enough to admit it. You don't have to post all of this ...I was wrong. Look you asked me who I blamed for the end of the 3peat? I answered it. I blame Kobe almost solely for 2004. While I blame Shaq and Kobe for the end of the 3peat I put more weight on shaq for it. He gets the primary credit for the les why does he not get the blame for the struggles too?

Look I want to apologize (not for my mistake of year) but for the learn to read post. It was immature, even if I was responding to a smartass remark. If you want to talk about ball, cool I enjoy a healthy debate. I freely admit grammar, draft slots and stats mean little to me. But les do. This thread was about Shaq and now we are way off track. You want to discuss Shaq or anything basketball related ...cool. If you want to get in a basketball, fact finding measuring contest ...you won, OK? But I am still waiting for you to repond to what I actually said (or meant) than focusing on the year. You asked me why do I not criticize Kobe for his role and I told you where I did. Instead of researching or discussing that, you went to bball reff, to point out a mistake i made on the year ...

[Basketballgirl25]

I was thinking while reading this, if I got a buck for all the stupid things NBA players have said this summer I'd be rich

[MavDynasty]

Then you could go on more cruises tbh

[Steve Kerr]

He gets the primary credit for the les why does he not get the blame for the struggles too?

Um, because he wasn't the one taking 40 shots at 30% shooting in vital playoff games or doing like letting Bruce ing Bowen score 27 points (lol letting Bruce Bowen score 27 points) in a playoff game. Kobe decided to get y and take a my way or the highway approach after watching Shaq win his 3rd finals MVP, and the Lakers immediately stopped winning les once Kobe became the 1st option. They 3-peated when they were Shaq's team, they lost to inferior team's when they became Kobe's team.

[Steve Kerr]

Then you could go on more cruises tbh

[Killakobe81]

Um, because he wasn't the one taking 40 shots at 30% shooting in vital playoff games or doing like letting Bruce ing Bowen score 27 points (lol letting Bruce Bowen score 27 points) in a playoff game. Kobe decided to get y and take a my way or the highway approach after watching Shaq win his 3rd finals MVP, and the Lakers immediately stopped winning les once Kobe became the 1st option. They 3-peated when they were Shaq's team, they lost to inferior team's when they became Kobe's team.

If you feel this way, I repect that. Cherry picking a particular game is kind of silly to me though TBH. I followed the team closely, using stats as an indicator of what was going on within and around the team is lacking in perespective.

Kobe as good as he is ...I never had a problem with the number of shots he takes, just his shot selection. So yes he has shot poorly in some playoff games. But to me, that is a lessor crime than not being in shape to start the season for an elite team or improving your FT shooting so you can be counted on late in games.

I was sick of BOTH players after the back to back les. But if I had to choose I would of done what Buss did and choose Kobe. Can anyone seriously say he made the wrong choice?

[Steve Kerr]

No he didn't make the wrong choice Kobe was the younger player who was entering his prime while Shaq was leaving his prime.

I've always thought coasting through the regular season was smart, IMO taking dumb shots in the playoffs (as in games you can't lose) is way worse than being out of shape for November games that mean jack . Shaq was always ready to go for the playoffs and stepped up when he needed to. Kobe seemed more concerned with winning as the alpha dog than winning.