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Though Nash & Dirk are barren.
i say he isnt, no other top 20 player was a 2nd fiddle for the majority of his career. kobe only 1 mvp in a weak era, lol @ getting beat out by the likes of Nash and Dirk.
Though Nash & Dirk are barren.
Kobe is right around Top 10 IMO. You have the obvious picks from 1-6 and after that, guys like Moses Malone, Duncan, Kobe and Olajuwon can claim the rest of those.
And I wouldn't used an MVP to validate his status among the all time greats. Kobe's career has been nothing short of amazing.
Luckiest of all time
Lucky he shoveled to Artest instead of jacking it up.
To this day I have to q up the DVR and check assholes to make sure there was indeed a shovellin'.
You can make an argument. 5 les as the 2nd most valuable player on the team, 1 mvp award, 2 scoring les.
Comparing to Scottie Pippen, who won 6 les as the 2nd most valuable player on a team.
Kobe has more individual accolades (regular season mvp, scoring les), but Pippen led his team out of the first round as the team most productive player ('94) and has one more le as the 2nd guy.
Depends on what you value more - team achievements (Pippen), or individual ones (Kobe).
If you place Scottie in the top 20, Kobe should be +/- a few spots depending on your perspective.
pippen isnt a top 20 player of all time either, dude was a 2nd fiddle for all but 1 year of his career.
Son that completely sums up Kobe's career ... luck
From the time he was a 18 year old rookie up until now at 31 years old he has been surrounded by stacked teams full of all stars and hall of famers. He has been blessed by the league and rewarded with thousands of bogus, free points at the free throw line. The media and NBA gets very desperate every few years for new superstars to help sell tickets and merchandise. Instead of just allowing stars to create themselves the NBA will step in and help boost certain chosen players to the top and Kobe is the best example of this. He hasn't deserved the majority of awards and honors that he has been handed on a silver platter over the years, but the league needs a trendy name to help sell the game.
Kobe is far from being a top 20 player and anyone who truly believes that he is should really take a step back, look at the facts, put the kool aid down, and educate themselves on the game of basketball. Realistically Kobe is probably somewhere between #45-55 best players of all time. There is no question that he is arguably one of the best ROLE players of all time, but ranking him any higher than maybe 35-40th is just downright stupid and laughable. Don't buy into everything that the NBA and ESPN try to force down your throat. Its all about making money and Kobe is extremely marketable.
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I have made a top 20 list (no order) from the NBA's top 50 players at 50 years, and it wasn't easy. I haven't included any players who deserve consideration after that list was made like Kobe and Duncan. So, top 64 at 64 years, they get in most certainly. Are they top 20 in my opinion yet? I don't know, I need to get back to work and see if they eliminate anyone. I do know I took Bill Russell out of the top 20, he is vastly overrated. When I get back to work on it I'll share, plus show how I got to where I did.
kobe's career is a glaring example of how important it is to play for the right organization.
Kobe's refusal to play for the Hornets, the team that drafted him, was the smartest move he ever made for his career.
Hey numbskull, I handed you your ass on that already. See my profile comments for link.
cliffs:
Wednesday June 26, 1996 Kobe drafted by Charlotte in prearranged trade for Vlade Divac.
Friday June 28, 1996: Divac threatens to retire rather than agree to trade.
Monday July 1, 1996. Divac agrees to trade.
Why on earth would Charlotte draft a player that refused to work out for them unless the pick was made to complete a trade?
Bye .
imo more important players when is all said n done(no particular order):
black jesus
kareem
wilt
shaq
hakeem
wade
pippen
russell
larry
bron
magic
moses malone
john stockton
big o
karl malone
clyde glyde
chuck fatass
ewing
dr j
timmy
yea .. maybe top 20.
Kobe Bryant is more important to the game of basketball than Wade, Ewing, and Drexler. He was second fiddle early in his career, but he's matured into the best player in the game. Top 20, easy.
Troll thread.
A better question is, "Is Kobe a top 10 player?"
He's clearly top 20.
LOL at this troll thread.
There's no way you can believe this. Stats and accomplishments don't lie. He's up there with the all time greats whether some hater likes it or not.
Funny tho.
Lol a lot of troll threads... good thing the NBA season isn't too far from now.
I'll answer the question though. I think Kobe as of today, right now, is probably on the cusp of the top 10. He's certainly top 20 imo. I think what would really help his cause is another League MVP, but it might not be realistic for Kobe to get a League MVP anymore. LeBron going to Miami actually does help for the upcoming season though because LeBron might not put up the crazy numbers next season due to sharing the scoring load and also what might end up being fewer minutes per game. So if Kobe really wants to get one more League MVP (which I'm not sure if it's really that important to him), he could go balls out next season to try and win one more.
Kobe has established his legacy. He's a back-to-back champion and Finals MVP and regardless if you think Gasol was the key to winning, Kobe was still the top dog of the last two Laker le teams. I can accept the argument that Gasol was more important to winning, but Gasol was still the second banana. And Kobe was still the undisputed leader and go-to guy. So for all the critics, even if you don't want to give credit to Kobe for any of the les with Shaq, he still gets credit for the last two championships as the best player on the team. Gasol was critical to them winning. But it's still Kobe's team.
I have Michael, Wilt, Magic, Kareem, and Bird definitely ahead of him. Then you have guys like Hakeem, Duncan, Shaq, Moses Malone, Russell, and Oscar that I'd group Kobe in with and depending what factors you value more, you could argue the order of those guys. So depending how you do that, for me, Kobe is roughly around the top 10 or right on the cusp.
Fixed.
If you don't have Kobe in the top 10 you're re ed. Simple as that.
Why? Kobe beign a top 20 player of all time is definitely arguable.
Yes.
It's about as arguable as Duncan or Shaq being a top 20 player all time. All three are certainly top 20. Only a serious hater would say it's arguable for Kobe.
Now if it's a question of whether Kobe is top 10, that is certainly arguable. Arguing top 20 is a pretty laughable topic.
You just win rings if you are in great teams.
Kobe had this luck. First he got paired up with Shaq and later with Gasol/Artest/Bynum/Odom.
Between this he was piling up stats, missing playoffs, ripping his team mates and demanding a trade.
So of course one of the best players. But also one of the most lucky ones with being in a great deep team with true consistent support through the majority of his career.
Just imagine the Lakers trading Kwame and Bynum for JO. Kobes legacy would be 3 rings as 2nd banana to prime Shaq.
stats and accomplishments? oh you must mean these ...
Funny tho.
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