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He sucks, but tries really really hard. I say we give him a contract.
So essentially Bonner sucked at center but he tried real hard. And would suck almost as much at PF, suck alot more at SF, suck even worse than that at SG, and really ing suck at PG.
Thanks for laying that out for us.
He sucks, but tries really really hard. I say we give him a contract.
This does nothing to support your argument that Penney can adequately check 3s.
Kind of slow, but keeps moving to the right places on D. Decent hands, but no post up game at all. Nice timing on blocks. Frame looks like he could take a few more pounds. Could be on the end of some NBA bench this season.
That's your take on Penney.
Think we should keep him?
C- Duncan, McDyess, Cousins
PF - Blair, Splitter, Bonner
He'd learn a lot from McDyess, and we really need a big that positions correctly on defense, even in garbage time. He does have that slow pull up / odd shake that worked a few times too.
Preseason: Houston Rockets 90, San Antonio Spurs 87
by Andrew A. McNeill
48 Minutes of
TOYOTA CENTER — It wasn’t a packed house and there wasn’t a lot of fanfare, at least not for the silver and black, but the San Antonio Spurs finally tipped-off their season on Thursday night in a 90-87 loss to the Houston Rockets. Spurs head coach Gregg Popovich mixed both veterans and roster hopefuls in his lineups throughout the night.
“I was just trying to give everybody a chance to show what they can do, and get ready for the season at the same time,” Coach Popovich said after the game.
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I'd like to see him stay at least the whole training camp, but he'll probably be waived and picked up by the Toros if not some other team. If the Spurs only keep 13 players initially, they might be able to sign someone like Cooze at a later date. He could conceivably learn some offense in Austin.
pop's lineups in preseason never concern me at all. it's been clear over the years his only concern is to take a look at siutations and players first and foremost. i am sure anderson has his minutes coming to him.
So Neal has "fantastic handles" .... if this is true I think this gets him a spot on the team over Garrett Temple, who seems to be struggling in this area.
Without good handles Temple brings virtually nothing to the table that Hill doesn't already do and do better.
Nah, me either. Last year when Pop had Bonner and Finley starting in preseason I knew it was just Pop being a silly goose.
Cousins looked like Mahinmi with a brain out there. If they don't try to at least stash that guy away to the Toros, I'll be even more confused about the whole Ian fiasco.
Who exactly is a FO cheerleader. No need to get upset that most of vet. ST posters think your Spurs lineup predictions are goofy.
Um, no. Bonner is a role player who had no business playing center for an NBA team, let alone being made to start for most of a season, yet some idiot put him in that position and he was good enough to hold his own against NBA starters while he did.
It's sort of like if Pop had made him the starting point guard and you were in here whining that he sucks because he only got 4.8 assists per game.
Look, you wanna on him because he isn't clutch? Okay. You wanna take shots at him because he's white and runs like a dip , and he's kind of clumsy like a puppy without the cuteness? All right. Don't say that he's a horrible defender when he was able to check the top bigs in the NBA every night and managed to hold his own despite not having any of the physical tools to do it with.
Before halftime I thought he was a sure fire cut after the game. But he just seemed to work harder and harder which led to him improving through-out the game. I'm def. interested to see more (since splitter is out) and see if we can get him on the toros.
From time to time his hands seem to be a suspect but a few times i thought it was Blair ripping down some of the rebounds he did.
I'm sorry, but in my book boxing out and rebounding is an integral part of playing defense in the interior. If you're going to tell me Bonner plays passable man-to-man defense and sucks at everything else, then you're telling me he's a terrible defender for the position he plays at.
That said, Penney is worse, and while he could be a specialist much like Mason, do you really want to have another guy that plays zero defense on the team?
I disagree. He's worthless from the bench too. He's simply not a piece for a team that's aspiring for a championship.
He is a terrible defender. We must have seen different games, because he didn't hold his own at all. Who did he held his own against?
And I absolutely agree he doesn't have the tools to do it, which is why it's baffling he's still around.
Re: Bonner's defense - I agree that he tries hard, knows where to be, and puts a hand in the guy's face and that sort of thing, but I think he's very ineffective in getting results. One of the many reasons he might be a poor rebounder is that his man is often scoring and there isn't a rebound to be had.
I never saw bonner as a really bad defender, he is not that bad. Sometimes he is actually pretty good but I don't know why every guy coming at him is shooting tough shots, being hot etc etc... Bonner must be a victim of his bad reputation...
So when Chris Paul rotates to Dirk Nowitzki on a pick and roll and Dirk just shoots a jumper over him, does that mean Chris Paul is a terrible defender?
When you have short arms and you can't jump, the best you can do when defending someone in the post is to move him out the best you can, Don't let him by you and to have a hand up when he shoots. Go back and look at how many starting bigs shot their average or below when Bonner was the primary defender on them. That's how often he held his own. There were far more times that season that Finley would be put on a guy and that guy would instantly torch the Spurs for a huge amount of points in a short span. THAT is terrible defense.
If you're baffled why he's still around, take it up with the guy who keeps bringing him back, but don't go after him for doing the best he can whenever he's on the floor.
There's a reason some of us have been calling for the Spurs to play Mahinmi or Ratliff all this time.
You're comparing apples to oranges. Chris Paul is a guard. Matt Bonner is not. Just look at the huge difference of Dice guarding Dirk vs Bonner guarding him. And it's not just the man to man. Look at second-chances, a big problem this team has had in the last few seasons because of the combination of TD's decline and the fact that Matty can't box out or rebound for .
You're just setting the bar way, way low. You tell me Bonner is a good defender because he's better than Finley? Did you want Finley playing defense at PF to begin with?
Sure, it wasn't Finley's fault he played there or Bonner's fault that he plays where he plays, but the reality is that they did and do, and they suck at it.
You can pin the blame on whoever you want, but the reality is that the one that suffers is the team in general, and in the case of Bonner, Tim in particular, because he has to work twice as hard on defense.
Well, I'm sorry I wasn't specific in that particular post, but in the one above I did specify that he's terrible 'for the position he plays at'. Feel free to blame Pop, Matt, the mother theresa, or whatever. Just don't tell me he's 'average' doing what he does, because he's not.
This team is looking for a championship. The whole, 'for being non-mobile, can't jump, can move quick enough, he does a good job' and still give the guy a lot of burn is really being complacent (not you obviously).
it really is mother theresa's fault.
Matt Bonner isn't a guard, but he's not a center. He's not really even a power forward, truth be told. From a body type standpoint he's the anti-Blair. The Spurs have pretty much put Duncan out on an island defensively since the '06 playoffs, and it's been, for the most part, a disaster.
The bottom line, though, is that results count, and the results tend to support the conclusion that he's a terrible defender. I'm on record saying he does his best, and I'll just leave it at that. I certainly don't want the mother er starting, and I'd be pleased if he were somewhere else. Whoever decided to give him that big contract needs a kick in the nuts.
The US system of traditionally rating and assessing players (draft, college experience, combine etc) is not the be all and end all of what makes a quality player or find. Last I heard basketball is still a 5 man team game decided on the court. What people forget is that some of these players who have been undrafted or didn’t standout in US college, but eventually made a career in Europe , have heaps of big game experience.
Between a player like Gist or Gee who have great athletic potential and players like Penny or Neal who are limited athletically , but have heaps of big game experience and are fundamentally superior.
I would always go for the latter ( actual big game experience internationally) especially if the purpose is to of provide quality back-up minutes. People assume that good fundamental team basketball, and basketball IQ can easily be picked up by getting an individually talented player to learn the system. (note: there not going to learn it playing limited or no minutes in the NBA) Now remember these other guys who have played in europe, have lived and breathed big game team oriented basketball , that is a skill that seperates them from a player inexpereinced to quality level leagues
Just because Bonner tries hard doesn't mean he doesn't fail.
I've posted it before about Bonner and I'll post it again, the old Wooden saying:
"Don't mistake activity for achievement."
Yes, Bonner is active. But unless your idea of achievement is playoff bricks mixed in with getting pancaked by Dampier while getting some big time dollars, Bonner does not achieve for the Spurs.
Thank you. I'll file this under Mother Theresa and we'll review it once we figure out he didn't turn out to be the 5th big on this team.
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