Quick Grades: Spurs vs. 76ers - Nov. 13

[4down]

+1 on Quinn is staying within his role - hes a back up in a blowout game, His only mistake was not mixing in a few entry passes to the post, but given the way the turnover rate increased in garbage time, thats no biggie. conservative was just fine.

I do think Noc should get a B+ for calling out his teammates in the middle of the game. Those guys just totally quit last night. I'm guessing that was mentioned at length in the game thread or chat, but man it was almost disappointing to see.

This game can only be useful in knowing that the Spurs are capable of destroying a team that will fold when things get tough. Super interested to see how things go with the scheduling ahead.

[ohmwrecker]

The Philadelphia 76ers are a very bad basketball team.

[Mavs<Spurs]

Overall, Manu is better than Ray Allen. Ray has many off nights where he is 1 for 10 from three. No doubt, Ray Allen is a future hofer, but he is decidedly not as good an overall player as Manu Ginobili.

LeBron isn't listed as a pg. He does sometimes do the things that a pg normally does, but he also does the things a 3 normally does.

Nash and Richardson is, imo, close to Tony and Manu. Nash is certainly the better shooter and from 3, it is not even close. Nash has won mvp
twice as we all know, though due to his defensive deficiencies I doubt that he merited it twice. Nash has never taken his team to the finals. Tony was judged the best player on a team that actual won the finals when he won the Finals MVP. Tony is a much better player defensively. I believe that Nash's best play is far behind him at this point. JRich was the decider for Phoenix last year; when he was good, Phoenix was very tough to beat. He seemed to become more consistent recently. Still, there are very few, if any, gms or coaches who would take a healthy JRich over a healthy Manu Ginobili.

So, at this point, I would have to give the edge to the Spurs as having the best backcourt in the league.

Thanks for the grades, Timvp.

[TD 21]

Hayes is a 7 year pro. His min salary would be $1,146,337, but the Spurs would only need to pay $854,389 and the league would reimburse the team for the rest. I believe that min salary ($854,389) is what would go against the lux cap. Question is if Hayes wants to sign for that...



The problem is that if some of those contracts become guaranteed, the Spurs might be on the hook for lux tax money. That's why I expect more shuffling as long as the Spurs are able to get away with it.



I would agree with Ray not being as creative as Ginobili, but then everybody has their flaws. Ray is a lot better shooter than Manu. Manu is the better slasher and creator. Tony's penetration has been neutralized many times, and he has struggled at times on defense. Rondo doesn't have a jumper.
But what makes them effective is indeed their respective systems and how well they execute it. And that's what highlights their strengths. You can't hold that against them, IMO.



Conversely, there's nothing wrong with pointing out that other teams/players are playing just as well. It doesn't make you a hater.

I don't know what part of "I like what Tony is doing, and for the most part Manu has been good too" is not giving them credit...

If he plans on playing in the NBA this season, he'll sign for that.

Yeah, you're right, they might hold off on signing Hayes or someone of that ilk for that reason. Or, if they do sign someone like that sooner than later, than they could cut Quinn and then bring him back in a few weeks.

I didn't say creative, I said consistent. I'd rate the Celtics' back court second.

The part where you pretend as if they're just one of the better back courts in the league and not the best one.

[ElNono]

I didn't say creative, I said consistent. I'd rate the Celtics' back court second.

No, you did specifically talk about Allen's creativity and his ability to create his own shot. Consistency can be measured in a plethora of ways. For example, Ray Allen is consistently the better shooter when compared against Ginobili.

The part where you pretend as if they're just one of the better back courts in the league and not the best one.

I'm not ready to proclaim them the best backcourt in the league at this point. Feel free to get your panties in a wad about that.

[TD 21]

No, you did specifically talk about Allen's creativity and his ability to create his own shot. Consistency can be measured in a plethora of ways. For example, Ray Allen is consistently the better shooter when compared against Ginobili.



I'm not ready to proclaim them the best backcourt in the league at this point. Feel free to get your panties in a wad about that.

I also talked about consistency. Overall consistency and impact on the game. You're seriously going to argue that Allen is a better player than Ginobili at this point in their respective careers?

Of course you're not, because they're not a hype machines. What more do they have to do to prove it to you? I got it: Do the same thing they're doing now, but do it in Boston or L.A.? Why would you think I'm angry about this? What a ridiculous assertion.

I'm just pointing out how you have no problem nitpicking this team to death, but then when it comes time to give them their just due, you'd rather hold back. As if they're two rookie or sop re players and they need to prove it over a longer stretch.

[ElNono]

I also talked about consistency. Overall consistency and impact on the game. You're seriously going to argue that Allen is a better player than Ginobili at this point in their respective careers?

Of course you're not, because they're not a hype machines. What more do they have to do to prove it to you? I got it: Do the same thing they're doing now, but do it in Boston or L.A.? Why would you think I'm angry about this? What a ridiculous assertion.

This is re ed. Because I think there are backcourts just as good, I'm not giving them their due? I simply disagree with your view.

As others have said, it's not that clear cut as you imply. IE: A team that might not have such a great record like Golden State also has a great backcourt. Boston has a great backcourt, IMO, just as good as the Spurs.
If you're going to break it down individually, as you're doing with Manu vs Allen, I'll tell you that both CP3 and DWill are better PG's than Tony (even though Tony has been playing pretty well too).

Ultimately they're all opinions. That's why I won't tell you you're wrong in your proclamation. I'll simply tell you I don't agree with it.

I'm just pointing out how you have no problem nitpicking this team to death, but then when it comes time to give them their just due, you'd rather hold back. As if they're two rookie or sop re players and they need to prove it over a longer stretch.

I love our guys to death, and I've given credit where credit is due, including RJ, Dice, Tony, Manu and even Bonner tonight.
The difference is that you rather project this throughout the entire season, where I rather get a larger sample size. As others have noted, until tonight, we really only played against one, maybe two projected playoff teams.

I'm nitpicky because I think this team can play better, and will need to play better to really go far. I specifically think you can't keep on giving up 30+ quarters and expect a different result than last season.
If you don't think so, that's your call, and I have no problem with it.

[EricB]

The sixers are one of the more under coached under motivated teams I've seen in some time. How Doug Collins keeps getting jobs is beyond me.

[ElNono]

The sixers are one of the more under coached under motivated teams I've seen in some time. How Doug Collins keeps getting jobs is beyond me.

To me it was hilarious to see Elton Brand walk off the court and sit on the bench in the middle of the 3rd, then realize he wasn't getting subbed. He basically completely checked out of the game by himself then.

[TD 21]

This is re ed. Because I think there are backcourts just as good, I'm not giving them their due? I simply disagree with your view.

As others have said, it's not that clear cut as you imply. IE: A team that might not have such a great record like Golden State also has a great backcourt. Boston has a great backcourt, IMO, just as good as the Spurs.
If you're going to break it down individually, as you're doing with Manu vs Allen, I'll tell you that both CP3 and DWill are better PG's than Tony (even though Tony has been playing pretty well too).

Ultimately they're all opinions. That's why I won't tell you you're wrong in your proclamation. I'll simply tell you I don't agree with it.



I love our guys to death, and I've given credit where credit is due, including RJ, Dice, Tony, Manu and even Bonner tonight.
The difference is that you rather project this throughout the entire season, where I rather get a larger sample size. As others have noted, until tonight, we really only played against one, maybe two projected playoff teams.

I'm nitpicky because I think this team can play better, and will need to play better to really go far. I specifically think you can't keep on giving up 30+ quarters and expect a different result than last season.
If you don't think so, that's your call, and I have no problem with it.

The way I see it, some things are less about opinion and more about how much you know...and this is one of those things. I would agree that the Celtics back court is second. Which means, on occasion or in stretches, absolutely, they're fully capable of outplaying the Spurs back court. But I'm talking overall as players. You got three guys who are near elite players and one guy who's just a good player at this point in his career.

The Warriors, are you serious? Parker and Ginobili have to prove it to you, but Curry, the sop re, he doesn't? Unbelievable.

Who cares that Paul and Williams are better than Parker? The gap between Ginobili and Belinelli/Bell is easily wider than the gap between Paul/Williams and Parker.

What larger sample size do you need? They've been at their current level for a while, only injuries slowed them down, so they were never in peak form at the same time the past two seasons. Now they are. The results speak for themselves.

Of course, collectively, they have to improve defensively. But that doesn't diminish the level of play Parker and Ginobili have exhibited thus far.