Lakers payroll, Spurs payroll

[Koolaid_Man]

Lakers: 91+ million.
Spurs: 66+ million.

Laker s should thank God (as well as the Memphis Grizzlies, but that's another thread), that the Spurs don't spend, and have never spent, like the Lakers. If they did, the first 3 peat never happens, nor does this recent repeat.

How bout Koolaid's payroll vs Midgets...

[midnightpulp]

[QUOTE]

WTF are you talking about them not meshing? Bynum gave us 15/8 on 57% shooting. Pau? 18/11 on 53% shooting. If that is not meshing I don't know what is. Bynum gave us defense and an inside presence during the playoffs on a bum knee. It was just enough to get us through. As far as Bynum getting off minus Pau, who cares? We can outscore anybody and we don't need 20/10 from him to win. Read this carefully: we need him to play defense and rebound. 20/10 is nice, but not a prequisite. Here is the pecking order: Kobe, Pau, Bynum/LO.

That exactly what I was talking about. They don't mesh offensively when they're on the floor together. I've heard many Lakers fans complain that Bynum becomes easily disinterested when he isn't getting a large amount offensive touches, touches that are going to Gasol, and will often drag his feet on defense, either out of discontent or fatigue. The numbers back this up. Bynum is a below average defender for a 7 footer, his defensive rating above 100. Contrast this Duncan who at 34 is at 98, while playing alongside Dejuan Blair.

Furthermore, I think Jerry West even said he likes the offense better when Gasol plays alongside Odom rather than Bynum.

Anyhow, I was simply countering your assertion that having Pau Gasol on the floor would magically make Bynum play better, which is false.

How did TD do against the elite bigs boasted by the Celtics, Magic, or Lakers? TD played the Magic and D12 beasted him 26 to 15 IIRC. D12 still has no post game yet he beasted TD. Nice anchorage there. If D12 can drop 26 on him, Pau will destroy him.

But the Lakers don't have Dwight Howard, so...

And the last game TD and Pau played against each other, they pretty much played to a draw. Gasol outscored TD by 8, but TD shot better and out rebounded him.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...004040LAL.html

I know TD is past his prime and I doubt he could handle our 3rd best big man at this stage (LO)

You don't watch much basketball, do you? Duncan won't be on Odom. Odom is a versatile 4 who plays more on the perimeter and it'd be stupid to take Duncan out of the paint to guard LO on the perimeter. And it would be downright insane to put LO on Duncan on the defensive end. Duncan will crucify him.

I believe the Sp*rs are better this year because is playing better. Well that will cease when Artest gets a hold of his ass. Then he will be subbed for by Barnes. His boyfriend won't see the court so don't expect him to keep his torrid play against us.

Artest can match up with RJ, but RJ isn't the only reason. The Spurs are healthier than they were at this time last year, the addition of Neal was an underrated pick up, and Ginobili is playing at an all-star level. Duncan's defense is also much better this year because he lost some weight and is a step quicker. Pop has also tweaked the offense, centering around the perimeter rather than the post. This Spurs team is much different.

You may be telling the truth there. I'm hardly a frontrunner. I'm just new to ST. And of course since I'm not a Sp*rs fan and boast about my team I'll get flack from posters like you. You sound like you are taking this personal. It's not that serious dude.

Not taking it personal. You should know me by now, and know that I like talking .

[midnightpulp]

If we talking bout playoffs series there is no ing way spurs beat the lakers. First off Kobe s on Manu and spurs in the playoffs always has and always will. Second of all if you gonna rely on Tony parker to beat us, look where that got you last year against the suns. Third, Duncan alone won't be able to handle the three headed monster of pau, drew, and Lamar. Lastly, Phil would out coach pop and get into his head like he has in previous series.

He kinda sucked in '99, '03, and was average in '04. But yeah, he was great in '01 and '02 against the corpses of Steve Smith, Terry Porter, and Sean Elliott.

I will give him props for playing well in '08 against Bruce Bowen, who was about to retire.

[Quit Hatin']

Who your best defender this year ? Hill?

[LkrFan]

That exactly what I was talking about. They don't mesh offensively when they're on the floor together. I've heard many Lakers fans complain that Bynum becomes easily disinterested when he isn't getting a large amount offensive touches, touches that are going to Gasol, and will often drag his feet on defense, either out of discontent or fatigue. The numbers back this up. Bynum is a below average defender for a 7 footer, his defensive rating above 100. Contrast this Duncan who at 34 is at 98, while playing alongside Dejuan Blair.

You heard many Laker fans complain about Bynum. , many Laker fans wanted RuPaul for him. What were they expecting us to do, outscore teams? Defense wins championships, not pretty jumpers. What did RuPaul do against Boston this year? Apparently not enough because they are getting skunked 2-0 so far. If the Lakers had RuPaul and not Bynum, Boston would be on ship #18 right now. No joke. Bynum is a young fella that is still maturing as a player. That is the reason why Pau/LO close qtrs and games. It's all good though - he's improving.

Furthermore, I think Jerry West even said he likes the offense better when Gasol plays alongside Odom rather than Bynum.

JW ate crow two Finals in a row.

Anyhow, I was simply countering your assertion that having Pau Gasol on the floor would magically make Bynum play better, which is false.

By play better, you mean 20/10 right? Well, like I said, we don't need that from him. We need his presence defensively and on the boards. Bynum being on the floor allows Pau to feast on sub 7' PFs the same way TD has done for his HOF career. Again, the pecking order is Kobe/Pau. If we have a mismatch with Bynum, we'll exploit it. Pick your poison if you are a Sp*r fan: have TD check Bynum and have Pau destroy Dice, Bonner, or the fat midget....or Have TD check Pau and watch Bynum do the same damn thing.

But the Lakers don't have Dwight Howard, so...

Pau is better than D12 - no doubt about it. We face D12 in the 2009 Finals. How did that turn out?

And the last game TD and Pau played against each other, they pretty much played to a draw. Gasol outscored TD by 8, but TD shot better and out rebounded him.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...004040LAL.html

But can he do it for a full series? One game is too small of a sample size. The sun can shine on a dog's ass for a day.

You don't watch much basketball, do you? Duncan won't be on Odom. Odom is a versatile 4 who plays more on the perimeter and it'd be stupid to take Duncan out of the paint to guard LO on the perimeter. And it would be downright insane to put LO on Duncan on the defensive end. Duncan will crucify him.

I catch a few games here and there on Armed Forces Network. From what I saw, LO has been in the paint dunking on MFers this year. He is hardly just camping out on the 3pt lane (although he is shooting the 3 at a 40% clip so far). Plus he is giving us a solid 15/10.

Artest can match up with RJ, but RJ isn't the only reason. The Spurs are healthier than they were at this time last year, the addition of Neal was an underrated pick up, and Ginobili is playing at an all-star level. Duncan's defense is also much better this year because he lost some weight and is got a step quicker. Pop has also tweaked the offense, centering around the perimeter rather than the post. This Spurs team is much different.

Don't be fooled. You guys are outscoring teams this year and are hardly playing that hallmark Sp*r defense of yesteryear. It is one thing for TD to anchor like this in December. It's another for him to do the same in May/June. There is a reason why Pop is watching his minutes (yes, the same way PJ is watching Kobe's too). We'll see if he keeps it up all year. Kobe is a perimeter player that can shoot - I'm sure he will be able to. For TD the jury is still out.

Not taking it personal. You should know me by now, and know that I like talking .

I know. I'm just ruffling feathers.

[midnightpulp]

Who your best defender this year ? Hill?

RJ's defensive rating is 106; Artest's, like last year, is 105. Artest is a capable defender, but he is far from lockdown, like he was in Indiana.

[LkrFan]

RJ's defensive rating is 106; Artest's, like last year, is 105. Artest is a capable defender, but he is far from lockdown, like he was in Indiana.

Tell Kevin Durant that and watch his facial expression:

[Quit Hatin']

Nice stat you pulled outta your ass. isn't anywhere close to artest on the defensive end. Ya ask paul pierce who would he rather have guarding him?

[LkrFan]

Nice stat you pulled outta your ass. isn't anywhere close to artest on the defensive end. Ya ask paul pierce who would he rather have guarding him?

Don't forget 2008 Finals MVP* Palina Pierce. How did he do in 2010?

*Denotes being "guarded" by the likes of Luke Walton and defensive stud Vlad Rad.

[midnightpulp]

Tell Kevin Durant that and watch his facial expression:

Please. Durant got any shot he wanted. He simply faded under the pressure of an intense playoff series.

Artest gets burned on the regular, his foot speed is nowhere near it once was. He held opponents to 98 points per 100 possessions in Indy. He's 7 points worse in LA, and that's with Bynum and Gasol behind him.

I'm not knocking him, but you saying Artest is still lockdown is like me saying Tim Duncan in his prime. Both are still capable, but not on the level they once were.

And your perimeter defense has been getting toasted this year. I think the Lakers are the one worst teams in keeping teams out of the paint. You can lay the blame on Fish, but can't neglect that Kobe and Artest aren't the defenders they once were.

[ezau]

If we talking bout playoffs series there is no ing way spurs beat the lakers. First off Kobe s on Manu and spurs in the playoffs always has and always will. Second of all if you gonna rely on Tony parker to beat us, look where that got you last year against the suns. Third, Duncan alone won't be able to handle the three headed monster of pau, drew, and Lamar. Lastly, Phil would out coach pop and get into his head like he has in previous series.

Kobe ting on Manu. Mr. 6/24 is left with his pussy jump shots and volume shooting. He doesn't offer any other else at this stage in his career.

[ezau]

Who your best defender this year ? Hill?

Who's gonna guard Manu?

Artest? Kobe? Barnes?

How about TP? Lemme check, you've got Fisher, Blake, and ... Brown?

[Quit Hatin']

Artest is a series changer on the defensive end. He can make a bigger impact on a series and we ain't talking bout locking down pierce, melo, Durant, or lebron vs the spurs it's just weak ass Manu.

[LkrFan]

Please. Durant got any shot he wanted. He simply faded under the pressure of an intense playoff series.

He wilted alright. Artest's defense had nothing to do with his 38% shooting. He got closed to his average due the Stern mandate that he shoots FTs like he friggen 2006 DWhistle. Last year he was KWhistle.

Artest gets burned on the regular, his foot speed is nowhere near it once was. He held opponents to 98 points per 100 possessions in Indy. He's 7 points worse in LA, and that's with Bynum and Gasol behind him.

Stats are a sucker's crutch. When it mattered, I saw Artest lock down Durant and Paul Pierce when it mattered. Now he has Barnes backing him up instead of Luke Walton (who is our victory cigar nowadays). The Lakers got up defensively one time by my count: against the Pacers on the road because they celebrated like they won the Finals when they beat us in Staples for the 1st time in 14 years. How did Granger do you ask? He got locked down by Tru Warrior in a 15 point laugher.

I'm not knocking him, but you saying Artest is still lockdown is like me saying Tim Duncan in his prime. Both are still capable, but not on the level they once were.

True, but we don't need Artest locking down every night. But when has a chance to focus solely on one player (like in a playoff series), I like his chances against anybody.

And your perimeter defense has been getting toasted this year. I think the Lakers are the one worst teams in keeping teams out of the paint. You can lay the blame on Fish, but can't neglect that Kobe and Artest aren't the defenders they once were.

The Lakers are a lightswitch defensive team. We didn't get up for anybody all year. Even when we were tearing teams a new asshole by like 13 ppg, we still were giving up 100+ ppg. Watch as the season progresses how our ppg allowed goes down. Now that Drew is back, we are a more balanced team on both sides of the ball. Just wait until he gets in shape. These first few games are essentially his preseason.

[midnightpulp]

You heard many Laker fans complain about Bynum. , many Laker fans wanted RuPaul for him. What were they expecting us to do, outscore teams? Defense wins championships, not pretty jumpers. What did RuPaul do against Boston this year? Apparently not enough because they are getting skunked 2-0 so far. If the Lakers had RuPaul and not Bynum, Boston would be on ship #18 right now. No joke. Bynum is a young fella that is still maturing as a player. That is the reason why Pau/LO close qtrs and games. It's all good though - he's improving.

Just because Bynum is 7 feet, doesn't mean he's a great defender. He had to play limited minutes against the Suns in last year's WCF because he can't guard the pick-and-roll.

Now, he's a very important piece, I'm not denying that, but he's not the presence you think he is.

JW ate crow two Finals in a row.

No he didn't. He wasn't suggesting that Bynum isn't needed, just that Odom and Gasol play better together. And check out these numbers:

http://www.82games.com/0809/0809LAL2.HTM

By play better, you mean 20/10 right? Well, like I said, we don't need that from him. We need his presence defensively and on the boards. Bynum being on the floor allows Pau to feast on sub 7' PFs the same way TD has done for his HOF career. Again, the pecking order is Kobe/Pau. If we have a mismatch with Bynum, we'll exploit it. Pick your poison if you are a Sp*r fan: have TD check Bynum and have Pau destroy Dice, Bonner, or the fat midget....or Have TD check Pau and watch Bynum do the same damn thing.

Might happen that way, might not.

Pau is better than D12 - no doubt about it. We face D12 in the 2009 Finals. How did that turn out?

But can he do it for a full series? One game is too small of a sample size. The sun can shine on a dog's ass for a day.

It could just the same have shone on Pau's ass that day. Pau is more complete than D12, but D12 presents a different set of matchup problems for Duncan. He can't deal with D12's athleticism at this stage of his career. Gasol is an easier cover for Duncan, despite Gasol being a better offensive player than Dwight.

I catch a few games here and there on Armed Forces Network. From what I saw, LO has been in the paint dunking on MFers this year. He is hardly just camping out on the 3pt lane (although he is shooting the 3 at a 40% clip so far). Plus he is giving us a solid 15/10.

You realize that you can drive or cut to the basket from the perimeter, right?

Don't be fooled. You guys are outscoring teams this year and are hardly playing that hallmark Sp*r defense of yesteryear. It is one thing for TD to anchor like this in December. It's another for him to do the same in May/June. There is a reason why Pop is watching his minutes (yes, the same way PJ is watching Kobe's too). We'll see if he keeps it up all year. Kobe is a perimeter player that can shoot - I'm sure he will be able to. For TD the jury is still out.

Thanks for telling me something I already know. But yes, one of my concerns is if Duncan, or Ginobili for that matter, will be healthy come playoff time. If the Spurs are healthy, they could make a run. To deny they have no shot is just being a homer. Lakers are far from invincible.

[LkrFan]

Kobe ting on Manu. Mr. 6/24 is left with his pussy jump shots and volume shooting. He doesn't offer any other else at this stage in his career.

He outrebounded KG and Sheed with his 15 rebs in the clincher. He played great defense. 6/24 was just what haters like you want to focus on.

[midnightpulp]

Artest is a series changer on the defensive end. He can make a bigger impact on a series and we ain't talking bout locking down pierce, melo, Durant, or lebron vs the spurs it's just weak ass Manu.

lol. Ron Artest's defensive rating in last year's playoffs was in Steve Nash territory. 110.

You Laker s seriously overrate that dumb who can't even understand the triangle. You selectively memorize his good moments, but forget his bad ones, where he's getting blown by and burnt.

[LkrFan]

Who's gonna guard Manu?

Artest? Kobe? Barnes?

How about TP? Lemme check, you've got Fisher, Blake, and ... Brown?

Yes. We'll send a wave of defenders against them. But that sword cuts both ways. How is the post defense of Manu and TP? Kobe has the best non-bigman post moves in the game. Artest can post up and so can Barnes. Think about that before you laugh. , ask Ray Allen about why he was in foul trouble in the Finals. Hint - Kobe's post game is sick.

[ezau]

Artest is a series changer on the defensive end. He can make a bigger impact on a series and we ain't talking bout locking down pierce, melo, Durant, or lebron vs the spurs it's just weak ass Manu.

LOL Artest lockdown

Last I checked, Manu destroyed Artest in the 2006 first round playoffs. That was the Artest that still had the capability to guard quicker players. You think Manu is scared of Artest?

Manu has owned that mental midget since day one.

[Quit Hatin']

Again with the bs stat you pull outta your ass. You better hope Manu doesn't have to guard Kobe cause Kobe will work him on one end of the floor and on the other end he gotta wrestle with artest.

[ezau]

He outrebounded KG and Sheed with his 15 rebs in the clincher. He played great defense. 6/24 was just what haters like you want to focus on.

LOL celebrating 15 rebounds. Kobe's career average of 5.3 RPG is well umm, average. tee, hee.

[ezau]

Again with the bs stat you pull outta your ass. You better hope Manu doesn't have to guard Kobe cause Kobe will work him on one end of the floor and on the other end he gotta wrestle with artest.

I can't wait to see Manu use those crazy legs against the arthritic knees of Kobe. Kobe will end up chucking like a mad dog in order to compensate for the humiliation that he's about to get from Manu.

[Quit Hatin']

I can't wait to see Manu use those crazy legs against the arthritic knees of Kobe. Kobe will end up chucking like a mad dog in order to compensate for the humiliation that he's about to get from Manu.

2008 ring a bell?

[ezau]

2008 ring a bell?

does an injured Manu ring a bell?

[midnightpulp]

Again with the bs stat you pull outta your ass. You better hope Manu doesn't have to guard Kobe cause Kobe will work him on one end of the floor and on the other end he gotta wrestle with artest.

How is he gonna wrestle with someone he'll just be able to drive by?