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  1. #801
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    How funny! Here's a CBS Poll that refutes Dan's CBS Poll

    Poll: Most Americans Feel Rhetoric, Tucson Shooting Unrelated


    Not even a majority of Democrats are buying it, Dan.

    Hey, Dan! Maybe your oranges aren't shriveled enough -- better get some more candles for that alter.
    Last edited by Yonivore; 01-11-2011 at 09:40 PM.

  2. #802
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    How funny! Here's a CBS Poll that refutes Dan's CBS Poll

    Poll: Most Americans Feel Rhetoric, Tucson Shooting Unrelated


    Not even a majority of Democrats are buying it, Dan.

    Hey, Dan! Maybe your oranges aren't shriveled enough -- better get some more candles for that alter.

    Reading is fundamental.....my poll says that most Americans think Lougner's political views influenced the shooting, not the right's political rhetoric...although I would question how any American not in Arizona, like the Sheriff, would know crap about the 'political rhetoric' in Arizona...but details have never been on Yoni's side politically...

  3. #803
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    I wonder when Katie Couric is going to get around to asking Sheriff Dupnik what he knew and when he knew it?

    The Dupnik Cover-Up -- He Knew About Loughner?


    Fitting editorial:

    Pima County sheriff should remember duty

    Dupnik needs to recall that he is elected to be a lawman. With each additional comment, the Democratic sheriff of Pima County is revealing his agenda as partisan, and, as such, every bit as recklessly antagonistic as the talk-show hosts and politicians he chooses to decry.
    He's also compromising the criminal case.

  4. #804
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    This application of a poll is unquestionably the stupidest post you've ever made. Its so absurd its actually a thing of wonder. Congrats.
    I wonder where you get your facts in every post....

  5. #805
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    So, Nbadan, have you found anything yet that proves violent rhetoric motivated Loughner to shoot several people, or are you content with making baseless accusations and calling those who want evidence trolls?


    this has to be Darrin


  6. #806
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    this has to be Darrin

    In any case, to the question; do you have any evidence Loughner's acts were motivated by rancorous vitriolic right-wing political rhetoric?

  7. #807
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    Reading is fundamental.....my poll says that most Americans think Lougner's political views influenced the shooting,...
    I know what your poll said, that was kind of the point. Where have his political views been made known?

    ...not the right's political rhetoric...
    But, that's the assertion being made, that the right's political rhetoric is what animated this guy.

    ...although I would question how any American not in Arizona, like the Sheriff, would know crap about the 'political rhetoric' in Arizona...
    The political questions being debated in Arizona have been national news for quite some time now, Dan.

    but details have never been on Yoni's side politically...
    Again, what evidence do you have that right-wing rhetoric -- and specifically, the SarahPAC ad, had absolutely anything to do with why Loughner attempted to assassinate Congresswoman Giffords?

  8. #808
    Long, Dark Blues redzero's Avatar
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    this has to be Darrin



    Dodging the question because he knows that he has no answer.

    Is this mouse?

  9. #809
    I play pretty, no? TeyshaBlue's Avatar
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    I wonder where you get your facts in every post....
    Well, admittedly its harder when chained by logic. I envy your unfettered approach to "facts".

  10. #810
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    In any case, to the question; do you have any evidence Loughner's acts were motivated by rancorous vitriolic right-wing political rhetoric?
    Do you have proof it wasn't? Do you have proof he never listened to vitriolic political hate speech 24-7 from his local WOAI?

  11. #811
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    Well, admittedly its harder when chained by logic. I envy your unfettered approach to "facts".
    Logic usually stands up to time, like most of my posts....well see about yours...

  12. #812
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    Do you have proof it wasn't?
    Yeah, he's hated Giffords since before SarahPAC and the 2010 midterms. Several witnesses have attested to his insanity without once mentioning saying he mentioned the Tea Party, Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck, or Rush Limbaugh. Nor did they allude to any "right-wing vitriolic hateful rhetoric" he may have been spouting, prior to or during the attack.

    Do you have proof he never listened to vitriolic political hate speech 24-7 from his local WOAI?
    Do you have proof he didn't read boyBlue's post on DailyKos on the 6th and declare, "That's ing it, that is dead!"

  13. #813
    Long, Dark Blues redzero's Avatar
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    Do you have proof it wasn't?
    Goddamn, are you trolling or are you actually serious?

  14. #814
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    Goddamn, are you trolling or are you actually serious?
    No, he's serious.

  15. #815
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    Yeah, he's hated Giffords since before SarahPAC and the 2010 midterms. Several witnesses have attested to his insanity without once mentioning saying he mentioned the Tea Party, Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck, or Rush Limbaugh. Nor did they allude to any "right-wing vitriolic hateful rhetoric" he may have been spouting, prior to or during the attack.
    You keep moving the goal posts...you wanted me to show you evidence of wing-nut hate inspired terrorists attacks in the U.S.....I think the TNT video did that...now you want absolute proof that this guy listened to and was inspired by wing-nut hate speech....I showed last night that this guy was associated with an anti-immigrant group, many of which have latched onto common goals with the tea party.....I've shown you evidence that some tea party members openly advocate shooting liberals and immigrants...I've shown you proof that some wing-nut politicians have called for a revolution against their own government.....but mainly liberals..

  16. #816
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    Logic usually stands up to time, like most of my posts....well see about yours...
    You mean like this pinnacle of logic?
    Do you have proof it wasn't? Do you have proof he never listened to vitriolic political hate speech 24-7 from his local WOAI?

  17. #817
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    Okay, let's recap since this has gone so far afield that even the bat crazies, like Nbadan, are lost in their narrative...

    First, and most important, there is absolutely no evidence to show Loughner was motivated by inflammatory, vitriolic, partisan, political rhetoric. None. Zilch. Zero.

    What we do know is that Arizona has a law, in place, by which Loughner could have been subjected to psychiatric evaluation long before he snapped. In fact, the Sheriff that continues to rail against the Right, has had several opportunities to intervene since he said, himself, he was aware of Loughner and that he had made death threats in the past.

    So, I say the blame starts with Loughner, moves through the many people who contacted him over the last few years and failed to use the tools their legislature provided to deal with the mentally ill, on to the law enforcement agency that knew he was dangerous and failed to act.

    Now, about that SarahPAC ad that seems to be the focus of everyone's derision and scorn.


    Who in here thinks Sarah Palin personally sat down and designed that ad? And if, as you say, she is so fond of martial imagery, where are the references to "target" or "bullseye" or "lock and load" or any other violent euphemism? There not there.

    In fact, in that context and on that image, surveyor marks make more sense. Districts are geography. The marks are placed on geographic locations, not people.

    Chances are a marketing intern or aide came up with bright idea on their own. Even in the 2010 mid-term elections, there are similar examples of such imagery from the other side of the political spectrum.

    The Democratic Leadership Committee put out this "Targeting Strategy" graphic:


    The Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee issued this one (each bulls eye represents a Republican Congressman):


    And, in the realm of what might have motivated someone to "target" Congresswoman Giffords, specifically? I think The DailyKos takes the blue ribbon on that one...

    Two days before she was shot, Some unbalanced frequent contributor to DailyKos posted this:


    And Moulitas himself, back in 2008, "targeted" and put a "bullseye" on Giffords, along with other Democrats because they didn't tow the party line the way he thought they should.


    Particularly since Kos's vitriol is more contemporaneous to Loughner's first contact with Giffords (2007), when his friends became aware he didn't like her very much, wouldn't it make more sense to put the blame there and be excoriating him? Oh wait, he's a friendly.

    The Democrats have failed again. Yes, again. From JFK to Loughner, Democrats first assertion, whenever something like this occurs, is that right-wing extremism and vitrolic rhetoric caused it. Not only has that never been the case, more times than not it's turned out to be either an insane person or left-wing idiot.
    The geographic locations represented the people, thats why she included the names. She should not have any names on there. She would be aware of the add since her name is on it. It was done in bad taste and has enough violent references from the cross hairs to the words Lets Take Back and 17 more to Go.

    If it wasn't done in bad taste why was it pulled quickly after the shootings?

    And yes the right has riled up their base with violent angry references continuously on conservative talk radio 24/7. I can't even find a left leaning radio station where I live. Its constant Conservative propaganda and the weak minded like yourself cannot see through it. You fall right into their trap.


    I know enough hateful republicans, it never used to be this bad before conservative talk radio has become a media force.

  18. #818
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    You mean like this pinnacle of logic?
    ...logic defies you...

    Wing-nut reasons why Gifford was shot....

    ..he shot a popular Democrat Arizona politician because he....

    1. blamed her for his breakup with his girlfriend
    2. blamed her for ignoring his stupid question a few years ago
    3. smoked pot out of a skull
    4. bad timing
    5. no particular reason

    it wasn't political....

  19. #819
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    There also could be a coverup not to rile the left into angry retaliation. So they don't disclose every detail of his motives. You may never know all the truth.

  20. #820
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    There also could be a coverup not to rile the left into angry retaliation. So they don't disclose every detail of his motives. You may never know all the truth.
    Not to mention that the corrupt, compromised M$M will bury any evidence that wing-nut rhetoric was related....just as they always do...

  21. #821
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    ...logic defies you...

    Wing-nut reasons why Gifford was shot....

    ..he shot a popular Democrat Arizona politician because he....

    1. blamed her for his breakup with his girlfriend
    2. blamed her for ignoring his stupid question a few years ago
    3. smoked pot out of a skull
    4. bad timing
    5. no particular reason

    it wasn't political....
    He shot her just because he is crazy with no motives. That is the rights reasoning.

  22. #822
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    You keep moving the goal posts...you wanted me to show you evidence of wing-nut hate inspired terrorists attacks in the U.S.
    I don't recall asking you for that. I want to know what right-wing rhetoric cause Loughner to act.

    ....I think the TNT video did that...
    I don't recall the video, you must have posted in response to someone else or, I wasn't inclined to watch.

    now you want absolute proof that this guy listened to and was inspired by wing-nut hate speech....
    , I'll take ANY proof.

    I showed last night that this guy was associated with an anti-immigrant group,
    That nut that took hostages at Discovery was an anti-immigrant nut. That, alone doesn't make either one of them right-wing.

    many of which have latched onto common goals with the tea party.....
    Okay, did Loughner latch on? There's nothing to indicate he did.

    I've shown you evidence that some tea party members openly advocate shooting liberals and immigrants..
    Have you seen the movie portraying the assassination of President Bush? Or have you ever read the DailyKos, DemocraticUnderground, or watch just about anybody on MSNBC?

    And, again, where is the proof Loughner acted in response to any of that?

    .I've shown you proof that some wing-nut politicians have called for a revolution against their own government.....but mainly liberals..
    And that has exactly what to do with Loughner?

    I can show you gigabytes of left-wing hatred and vitriol -- directed at President Bush alone. Don't even mention Cheney or Donald Rumsfeld.

  23. #823
    Long, Dark Blues redzero's Avatar
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    There also could be a coverup not to rile the left into angry retaliation. So they don't disclose every detail of his motives. You may never know all the truth.
    So even if no evidence is found that connects Loughner to Palin, you can fall back on "They aren't telling the truth."

    A win-win situation for you, right?

  24. #824
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  25. #825
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    He shot her just because he is crazy with no motives. That is the rights reasoning.
    ...it gets better...

    6. He was bat- crazy

    ..the very definition of being a wing-nut!

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