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  1. #426
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Speaking of gay...

  2. #427
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Speaking of buzzed:

    http://www.viddler.com/explore/failblog/videos/1974/

    (actually has some basketball footage)

  3. #428
    Moss is Da Sauce! mouse's Avatar
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    (note: pina coladas are generally not served with salt on the rim)
    I am so glad to not know that.

  4. #429
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    Number of dead from ratiation: 0

    Number of dead from water: 10,000+
    So what you're saying is that everyone should start absorbing radiation in stead of drinking water? Thanks!

  5. #430
    selbstverständlich Agloco's Avatar
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    Is this what the topic is about, My liver, my lungs? I thought it was about a "meltdown"

    The problem with radiation is not what the wall mart meters detect on your shoes it's the in your lungs that gets past the radio shack devices that will give you Cancer.

    You people just don't get it. Maybe 30 years from now when they are removing one of your testicles you will.
    Apparently so mouse........

    Accordingly to you they're intimately linked.

  6. #431
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    So what you're saying is that everyone should start absorbing radiation in stead of drinking water? Thanks!

    No, I'm saying it's obscene to be obsessing about this nuclear plant when thousands of dead bodies at a time are washing ashore and thousands more are missing, probably buried under mountains of debris.

  7. #432
    selbstverständlich Agloco's Avatar
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    I don't doubt for a second that newer=safer

    What I highly doubt is:
    newer=economically viable

    For that matter, NIMBY is not known to be all that subject to no matter what data on safety one might have.

    Nuclear energy is, after all is said and done, simply one alternative of many when it comes to energy, and its main drawback, i.e. the consequences of catastrophic failure, is not something that will ever be fully remedied in my mind.

    You make a good argument here. Unfortunately I'm not versed enough about the economics of nuclear power to make a good counter argument so I'll have to leave it alone. I am interested in the numbers though.

    The reactors of tomorrow will continue a trend of being much safer than those of today. This will come about primarily as a result of the development of less toxic fuels, better disposal methods and more sophisticated disposal methods. Know that, I have a hard time simply walking away from this technology all together.

    How long will it take to implement those technologies, and how much risk we assume in the meantime is something that will continue to be a contentious point IMO.

  8. #433
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    No, I'm saying it's obscene to be obsessing about this nuclear plant when thousands of dead bodies at a time are washing ashore and thousands more are missing, probably buried under mountains of debris.
    Uhmm who shouldn't care about this? Us? The Japanese people?

    A lot of people died; it's tragic. But they don't have time to grieve, enough time for that AFTER they solve this meltdown problem.

    That's what people do Darrin. They do what needs to be done, and think about it after.

  9. #434
    selbstverständlich Agloco's Avatar
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    No, I'm saying it's obscene to be obsessing about this nuclear plant when thousands of dead bodies at a time are washing ashore and thousands more are missing, probably buried under mountains of debris.
    It's pretty clear from this statement that you don't understand the consequences of a full meltdown.

  10. #435
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    And also, it's not like everyone in Japan is working on the reactor. They do have people going on searches for the missing.

    But the tsunami/quake is over. What's done is done. The meltdown, that's something the Japanese can do something about.

  11. #436
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    It's pretty clear from this statement that you don't understand the consequences of a full meltdown.
    Has that happened?

  12. #437
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    Has that happened?
    Not yet, due to the actions of the workers. But if they had not worried about it, good chance it might have.

  13. #438
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Has that happened?
    Yes, your not understanding has happened.

  14. #439
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    Not yet, due to the actions of the workers. But if they had not worried about it, good chance it might have.

    Of course they should be worried about it. I'm just saying that the media attention on the nuclear part of this trajedy is disproportionate.

  15. #440
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    Of course they should be worried about it. I'm just saying that the media attention on the nuclear part of this trajedy is disproportionate.
    Why?

  16. #441
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    Of course they should be worried about it. I'm just saying that the media attention on the nuclear part of this trajedy is disproportionate.
    According to you? You would rather they be showing the destruction over and over? That happened. This is happening. Its not hard to see whats going to get coverage.

  17. #442
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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  18. #443
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    So one expert thinks it might not be bad, and you're willing to take his word for it? Not only that, but think that the media should take his word for it too?

    What about the opinions of other experts? Do those not matter?

  19. #444
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    Dr. Henry Royal is a professor of radiation at Washington University. He studied the after-effects of radiation in the Chernobyl disaster. He says even in that case, the only significant radiation exposure was to those employees and workers at the plant. He says even in the closest town to the plant, the radiation levels were equal to what you would experience by having 5 CT scans. And this case in Japan, it's significantly less.
    He curiously fails to mention the thousands who received ill effects after drinking/eating local food and water that was contaminated. And the heightened incidence rate of cancer in that area.

  20. #445
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    Note: I'm not saying the guy is a quack, but it's strange that he left that part out.

  21. #446
    selbstverständlich Agloco's Avatar
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    Dr. Henry Royal is a professor of radiation at Washington University. He studied the after-effects of radiation in the Chernobyl disaster. He says even in that case, the only significant radiation exposure was to those employees and workers at the plant. He says even in the closest town to the plant, the radiation levels were equal to what you would experience by having 5 CT scans. And this case in Japan, it's significantly less.

    He curiously fails to mention the thousands who received ill effects after drinking/eating local food and water that was contaminated. And the heightened incidence rate of cancer in that area.

    Note: I'm not saying the guy is a quack, but it's strange that he left that part out.
    Significant in this context means those people who experienced a dose sufficient to cause either hematopoietic or gastrointestinal syndromes. More generally, he's referring to the onset of non-stochastic syndromes early on in the crisis which proved to be fatal.

    Yes, I know the term "significant" can have very different meanings and one might think that it should include cases of foodborne radiation sickness and induced cancers. I'm just clarifying how he used the term in his paper.

    This is simply a case of what cutoff you use to define the term "significant".

  22. #447
    selbstverständlich Agloco's Avatar
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    It's pretty clear from this statement that you don't understand the consequences of a full meltdown.
    Has that happened?
    Doesn't really need to in order to be newsworthy. Millions more stand a good chance of being affected for generations to come due to the nuclear crisis. that should prompt a lot of discussion and coverage IMO.

  23. #448
    Cogito Ergo Sum LnGrrrR's Avatar
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    Significant in this context means those people who experienced a dose sufficient to cause either hematopoietic or gastrointestinal syndromes. More generally, he's referring to the onset of non-stochastic syndromes early on in the crisis which proved to be fatal.

    Yes, I know the term "significant" can have very different meanings and one might think that it should include cases of foodborne radiation sickness and induced cancers. I'm just clarifying how he used the term in his paper.

    This is simply a case of what cutoff you use to define the term "significant".
    I assumed it might be something along those lines. While deaths due purely to radiation might be low, that doesn't mean that everything is hunky-dory.

  24. #449
    9mm nkdlunch's Avatar
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    I'll give you a hint. The stuff that has happened before in Japan released more to date than this and I'm not talking about Hiroshima or Nagasaki. This has the potential to be far worse but it is so far not.

    Three Mile Island is another.

    But all of these radiation levels pale in comparison to the amount of radioactive material in the air during the time when the US and Russia were setting off bombs on a regular basis for "tests".
    yes, radiation from those "tests" made it's way to the food supply and tap water 100 miles away

  25. #450
    9mm nkdlunch's Avatar
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    Better question:

    Had there been no evacuation orders would they have been abandoned?
    Even better question:

    Had there been no radiation would there have been evacuation orders?

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