Top 10 Players of ALL-Time

[rayjayjohnson]

that's a good list imo

[TD 21]

The one consensus one I don't get is Bird over Duncan and O'Neal. There's nothing accomplishment-wise or statistically to suggest he was better than either.

And I've always had a hard time believing that Russell and Chamberlain are better than Duncan, O'Neal and Olajuwon. I'm not saying definitively they weren't, but I look at the era they played in and the compe ion they played against and it doesn't compare to the past thirty or so years. Give them the advantages of today's players and maybe they're as good now as they were then (not in terms of averages; advanced stats-wise), but I'm not convinced. Russell's lack of anything resembling an elite or even high level offensive game makes him being supposedly better even more questionable.

The only players I can look at and come to the conclusion that they were definitively better than Duncan and O'Neal, are Jordan, Abdul-Jabbar and Johnson. Beyond that, I'm not sure. I have a hard time ranking pre-80s players. So excluding pre-80s players, I'm going to go with . . .

1) Jordan
2) Abdul-Jabbar
3) Johnson
4) Duncan
5) O'Neal
6) Bryant
7) Bird
8) Olajuwon
9) K. Malone
10) James

It may be pre-mature to put James there, but he's like Duncan eight seasons in (minus the championships, of course). He's just too damned dominant statistically to be ignored and it's obvious he's going to go down as the greatest ever at his position. You could make a case for M. Malone, Garnett, Wade and a few others at 9 and 10, but for me, K. Malone's longevity at an elite level gives him the edge.

[Mugen]

As for my list...

1. MJ
2. Kareem
3. Magic
4. Bird
5. Shaq
6. Duncan
7. Dream
8. Wilt
9. Big O
10. Moses Malone

Pretty spot on list. I'd replace Malone with Kobe and switch Timmy with Dream.

Russell would get ridiculously abused by Dwight Howard. I don't even want to think what a prime Shaq/Dream/Duncan would do to him.

[Kyle Orton]

The one consensus one I don't get is Bird over Duncan and O'Neal. There's nothing accomplishment-wise or statistically to suggest he was better than either.

This is personal bias, but I've always considered winning MVP and finals MVP in the same season as more or less the NBA's ultimate achievement. Aside from the other reasons people give, MJ doing that 4 different times is a large reason why I consider him the untouchable G.O.A.T. Bird is the only other player I can think of who has won MVP and finals MVP in the same season more than once (84 and 86), which is why I have him so high.

[JamStone]

bryant ain't being overrated anymore, not on my watch. nuh uh, daddy-O

That's fine wherever you rank Kobe. Everyone has his opinion.

I was laughing at you using the PER stat to discredit Kobe when that exact stat kills your argument as to several players you've specifically listed as better than Kobe. In fact, here's more damning and contradicting evidence from that very stat to your opinion.

Of the 17 players you listed as being better than Kobe...

he ain't gettin ranked above:

chamberlain
bird
russell
mj
magic
kareem
hakeem
shaq
gervin
erving
robertson
duncan
west
pippen
Baylor
rick barry
moses malone

no ing WAY is the chucking fraud better than ANY of those guys

... only 7 of them (the ones bolded) have a better career PER than Kobe.

According to your list of players you initially thought were better than Kobe and your use of the PER stat as evidence, Kobe is the 8th best player in the history of the NBA.

One more time, good stuff.

[Killakobe81]

yeah just like i said, everyone thinks kobe is sooooo good because he has skill with the flashy crossovers, pullups off the dribble, and fadeaways..but as far as having the biggest overall impact on the court for his team, kobe ain't top 10 all timePERIOD

my top 10:

mj
chamberlain
kareem
magic
bird
shaq
hakeem
russell
big ty
pippen

Pip, great player but so overrated. I think he was underrated in the 90's ...MJ casted a long shadow until he went to play baseball ... and when he carried the Bulls i think Pip and PJ benefited from showing they could win and thrive sans MJ.
But no way Pipp makes any top 10 list even if you only go back to early 80's.
I would take:

1. MJ
2A. Magic
2B. Kareem
4. Kobe
5. Duncan
6. Shaq
7. Bird
8. Isiah
9. Wade
10. Lebron
11. Malone
12. KG
13. dirk

Maybe not in this exact order and I maybe forgetting someone ...but all of those players I take over Pippen ... TBH

[DMC]

MJ first

From there it's a toss up on so many positions.

[coachmac87]

Well I guess it's safe to say that Duncan is a Top 10 player. Just by looking at most of the list he is around 5-7. I found it hilarious that he put him at 11. He said he was a NO SHOW against Memphis. We know he isn't the same player, but Shaq has been MIA the last 3-4 years yet he is listed on the list.

It also bothers me when people put Shaq above Duncan.

[JamStone]

I never said per was the end all be all. Just one of many reasons I don't think Kobe is top 10 at all. You would have a point If I said these guys are all better than Kobe, this is why! And posted per.

Lol at the idiot who ranked Kobe above bird

Why bring up PER in the first place? Especially when you rank Pippen in your top 10 and he's 101st???

It was foolish to bring PER up at all considering where Bryant ranks among the greatest players YOU yourself listed.

[TheMACHINE]

Why bring up PER in the first place? Especially when you rank Pippen in your top 10 and he's 101st???

It was foolish to bring PER up at all considering where Bryant ranks among the greatest players YOU yourself listed.

[DPG21920]

Killa is literally the only person that puts Kobe above Duncan. He does it to rile people up.

[Isitjustme?]

Pip, great player but so overrated. I think he was underrated in the 90's ...MJ casted a long shadow until he went to play baseball ... and when he carried the Bulls i think Pip and PJ benefited from showing they could win and thrive sans MJ.
But no way Pipp makes any top 10 list even if you only go back to early 80's.
I would take:

1. MJ
2A. Magic
2B. Kareem
4. Kobe
5. Duncan
6. Shaq
7. Bird
8. Isiah
9. Wade
10. Lebron
11. Malone
12. KG
13. dirk

Maybe not in this exact order and I maybe forgetting someone ...but all of those players I take over Pippen ... TBH

[Kyle Orton]

Killa is literally the only person that puts Kobe above Duncan. He does it to rile people up.

This kind of behavior from Lakers fans is what leads to skunkers.

[Isitjustme?]

Hakeem (who's also better than Kobe) is missing from that list.

[Isitjustme?]

Forget Duncan, does anyone think Kobe would have done anything but get skunked in the first round with that 1994 Rockets team?

100% serious question.

[DPG21920]

Has nothing to do with being skunked. While this loss is a mark on Kobe's career, it's not a bad one. It's only a bad one to Kobe fan boi's who try to argue Kobe is better than Mike.

In the long haul, Kobe is cemented in his legacy IMO. It's not really moving up or down.

[Kyle Orton]

No, the stupidity and mentally weak behavior from Lakers fans DOES have to do with being skunked. Lakers fans can't have it both ways. They claim to contribute to victories, they also contribute to defeat.

That's it, and that's all.

[TheMACHINE]

Has nothing to do with being skunked. While this loss is a mark on Kobe's career, it's not a bad one. It's only a bad one to Kobe fan boi's who try to argue Kobe is better than Mike.

In the long haul, Kobe is cemented in his legacy IMO. It's not really moving up or down.

i think it can only move up.

[JamStone]

kobe ain't top 10, that's all i know. per or not, having watched enough of him to see that he doesn't have the impact that a truly "great" player normally has. none of those guys on my list got embarrassed, or needed something huge like another top 10 all time player to win. Kobe without the best frontcourt in the league = not making playoffs, out in the first round, etc. kobe with a disgruntled big = swept in the 2nd. jordan never got swept. jordan doesn't get swept by the mavs. sorry but these are the facts.

Lmao Scottie Pippen is in your top 10 greatest NBA players. Nuff said.

[DPG21920]

i think it can only move up.

I probably agree with that, but I don't really see how. If you are playing worse than you ever have, just because you have a stacked team around you with a lesser role doesn't mean you get vaulted up.

By that logic IMO, he should move backwards for getting skunked then.

[TheMACHINE]

Thats was exactly my point in the other thread. He claims Pippen is better then Kobe, then compared Jordan to Kobe saying "Kobe needed another big man to win"... Logic just doesnt make sense eh.

[DPG21920]

Tyson be trollin Jam. No one thinks Pippen>Kobe in real life.

[TheMACHINE]

I probably agree with that, but I don't really see how. If you are playing worse than you ever have, just because you have a stacked team around you with a lesser role doesn't mean you get vaulted up.

By that logic IMO, he should move backwards for getting skunked then.

well everyone in the league gets skunked....and 29 other teams dont win a championship in a given year. To be great, you have to have longevity so you can get those les. If you fail, you fail...but if you achieve, thats saying alot.

ie, Duncan cant go down just cuz he didnt win the past 4 years, he already did his part when he got his rings. You're right, maybe if your in a stacked team you wont get much credit, but it sure wont make you go down.

[TheMACHINE]

pippen ain't a big. it's a lot different when that guy is a big, you need a big man to win championships, ask kobe. jordan did it with help, but no great big, which says something. kobe without a big? ha, ha.

ahh so Magic aint part of your Top 10 right?

[JamStone]

pippen ain't a big. it's a lot different when that guy is a big, you need a big man to win championships, ask kobe. jordan did it with help, but no great big, which says something. kobe without a big? ha, ha.

Jordan is the GOAT. Kobe's nowhere near in the discussion of being GOAT. The only players in the conversation are Jordan, Wilt, and Kareem. Has nothing to do with Jordan.

You have Scottie Pippen in your top 10 of greatest NBA players. You criticize Kobe, but every criticism you have of Kobe applies to Pippen but even more so. Pippen never did as the best player on the team. , he was only the best player on his team for about a season and a half in his entire career.

There is no argument at all to put Scottie Pippen anywhere near a top 10 list. , it's debatable whether he's a top 50 player. Unique player, very versatile. One of the great defenders the league has seen. Not a top 10 player in the history of the league. At this point, it's beyond laughable that you continue to maintain that he is.