Pop & RC - take note as Mr. Presti gets it

[rascal]

should have traded Parker - I understand loyalty, but as a business it was a bad move to resign him with the miles on his body and his decision to play international basketball in the future. He will not get better - this year would have been a good time to unload him with the regular season success.

Should have got rid of Manu. he will rapidly decline in the next year or two and he can't be relied on staying healthy all year.

Relying on manu to carry the team in the playoffs is failure.

[temujin]

The Spurs are an above average organization at the moment, nothing more than that.
They used to be the very best, off and consequently on the court, before making some inexcusable mistakes.
That was when Presti was on the organization, incidentally.
Mistake #1 Sign Oberto (extension) > Scola. Major.
Mistake #2 Sign Jefferson.
Mistake #3 Re-sign Jefferson (after he opted out!!). Very Major.
Mistake #4 Sign Bonner to an absurd extension.
Mistake #5 Let Centerpiece walk. Anderson hurt. Excusable.
Mistake #6 Sign Splitter AND never really play him. Major.

I can see an accelerating trend of mistakes, even though it is true that Spurs did relatively well with their picks and FA.

There might be an ultimate mistake, and that might be, I hate to say it, keeping Popovich if he is not seriously interested anymore.

The point is that if you are a small market organization you are simply not allowed to make too many mistakes.

I just don't see Presti making all these mistakes at the moment.

[temujin]

Should have got rid of Manu. he will rapidly decline in the next year or two and he can't be relied on staying healthy all year.

Relying on manu to carry the team in the playoffs is failure.

This post could have been written in 2008.

Instead, others decline more rapidly than Mr. Ginobili.

[TJastal]

The difference between Presti and the Spurs front office is that Presti has had a bunch of lottery picks, include no. 2 Kevin Durrant to work with. The Spurs, on the other hand, are limited to late first round picks and second round picks since Tim Duncan (whom we were very fortunate to get).

It's only logical that eventually the Spurs would run their course and deteriorate. Yes, its tough to watch, but no tougher than watch the 80s Celtics and Lakers teams deteriorate and get run by the younger NBA compe ion. Same thing happend with the Bulls, who disbanded before things got ugly, though we have a hint of how bad things would have gone with seeing Pippen in Portland and Houston and Jordan with the Wizards.

Give Pop and RC the same tools Presti had, and they would have done equally well. As is, Spurs front office is the best in the business at putting together contenders on late first round picks and cheap signings. Good thing for us.

As a side, Phil Jackson is leaving the Lakers when it is obvious that they won't contend anymore. But he remains open to coaching a different team (I'd say Miami so he can yet again coach the best players in the league). Good thing Pop and R.C. aren't opportunists like Phil or the Spurs would soon be run by the Kevin McHales and the Isaiah Thomases of the world and everyone here would respect R.C. and Pop a lot more.

So resigning Jefferson & Bonner to long term deals was the coup of the year apparently. Presti eat your heart out.

[LongtimeSpursFan]

Should have got rid of Manu. he will rapidly decline in the next year or two and he can't be relied on staying healthy all year.

Relying on manu to carry the team in the playoffs is failure.

There is absolutely no way the Spurs would get rid of Manu. If the Spurs traded Manu or let him sign somewhere else then i and others would cancel our season tickets. Gervin, Robinson, Duncan, Ginobili and Parker have been the face of the Spurs franchise and should not be traded. Yes, I know Gervin was traded but look what happened to the team after that. Four years of bottom dwelling.

[Horse]

good move, but it probably shocked RC more than it did Spurs fans.

Still doesn't make up for Bonner, Jefferson, Mason, Udoka, Hairston, Hill (that's marginal,) probably throw in Scola, Butler, holding on to Finley too long, etc.

Are you serious throwing Hill in with that group? He's had the ups and downs of any young player, but he's probly been our best player the last 3 years outside of the big 3. He just about beat dallas for us last season in the playoffs.

[LongtimeSpursFan]

So resigning Jefferson & Bonner to long term deals was the coup of the year apparently. Presti eat your heart out.

Didnt Presti trade or sign for Center Byron Mullens? Kevin Ollie? Etan Thomas? These are hardly stellar moves and all recent moves in the past three years. Byron Mullens was taken with the 24th pick. That was a waste.

[Obstructed_View]

because he plays a different positiion? explain yourself - he put up some pretty good numbers for a rookie.

Stupid because you went back and looked at the draft (among looking back at multiple drafts) and picked the only guy who went lower than Anderson whose name you recognize and act like the Spurs should have picked him at 20. Landry Fields wasn't even expected to be picked in the draft at all, and Anderson is still considered to have lottery talent.

Fields didn't just put up pretty good numbers for a rookie, he put up great numbers for a rookie that nobody expected to be a player. He also put up more minutes per game than any Spur except Tony Parker. Being healthy for all 82 games on a Mike D'Antoni team helps with your stats. Being an injured rookie on a Gregg Popovich team is the kiss of death.

If you said this before the draft, then simply produce the post and I'll apologize. Otherwise, your posts are the ultimate in hindsight bias and completely ignorant of the actual causes of the Spurs' failures this season, and therefore worthy of ridicule.

[cd98]

Should have got rid of Manu. he will rapidly decline in the next year or two and he can't be relied on staying healthy all year.

Relying on manu to carry the team in the playoffs is failure.

You mean we should have traded away our best regular season and playoff performer?

[TJastal]

Didnt Presti trade or sign for Center Byron Mullens? Kevin Ollie? Etan Thomas? These are hardly stellar moves and all recent moves in the past three years. Byron Mullens was taken with the 24th pick. That was a waste.

So a very young athletic 7-footer on a cheap extended contract who was the Big 10's 6th man of the year and set records for FG% is a waste of money?

Score another shrewd move by Presti. Gimme a f'ing break. Great signing, and insurance for Perkins & Mohammed, two oft-injured players.

[ChumpDumper]

We had a similar version, name was Mahinmi IIRC, not sure what happened to him

[cd98]

The Spurs are an above average organization at the moment, nothing more than that.
They used to be the very best, off and consequently on the court, before making some inexcusable mistakes.
That was when Presti was on the organization, incidentally.
Mistake #1 Sign Oberto (extension) > Scola. Major.
Mistake #2 Sign Jefferson.
Mistake #3 Re-sign Jefferson (after he opted out!!). Very Major.
Mistake #4 Sign Bonner to an absurd extension.
Mistake #5 Let Centerpiece walk. Anderson hurt. Excusable.
Mistake #6 Sign Splitter AND never really play him. Major.

I can see an accelerating trend of mistakes, even though it is true that Spurs did relatively well with their picks and FA.

There might be an ultimate mistake, and that might be, I hate to say it, keeping Popovich if he is not seriously interested anymore.

The point is that if you are a small market organization you are simply not allowed to make too many mistakes.

I just don't see Presti making all these mistakes at the moment.

Scola was a mistake, but in fairness to the Spurs, not another GM other than Houston saw value in Scola, so it's hard to fault them for making that move after the fact.

Jefferson trade was also hailed by everybody as a great move, so again, it's easy to criticize after the fact, but at the time the move was made, most thought it was a great move.

Resigning RJ was a no brainer and shouldn't be criticized. (1) we had no small forward; (2) he opted out so we could pay him more money over several years, a move which allowed us to get under the salary cap and have flexibility to make other moves, like signing Splitter and staying under the cap.

Splitter did play and did okay. He still has a long way to go to be reliable in the playoffs. Hopefully next season.

[cd98]

So resigning Jefferson & Bonner to long term deals was the coup of the year apparently. Presti eat your heart out.

Bonner's deal isn't that ridiculous. His play was a big factor in us getting the number one seed. Same wth Jefferson. And while they may be to blame for not playing better in the playoffs, they certainly weren't the only ones and Memphis played really well against the Spurs.

[cd98]

Didnt Presti trade or sign for Center Byron Mullens? Kevin Ollie? Etan Thomas? These are hardly stellar moves and all recent moves in the past three years. Byron Mullens was taken with the 24th pick. That was a waste.

Some would argue that Presti blew it by taking James Harden over Tyreke Evans.

[TJastal]

Oh, hey Chump, nice to see ya roll in this morning with your usual
lol@randomTjastalposting

How'd the rub go? Matty probably needs a little extra after all that ass-pounding he took in the series..

[ChumpDumper]

I'm going to talk about sexual acts again. It's all I know and all I think about.

[TJastal]

Bonner's deal isn't that ridiculous. His play was a big factor in us getting the number one seed. Same wth Jefferson. And while they may be to blame for not playing better in the playoffs, they certainly weren't the only ones and Memphis played really well against the Spurs.

Let's be real here, if the spurs hadn't resigned Bonner he'd be lucky to have a job right now. Some team might have picked him up for the minimum salary. And Jefferson would be lucky to be making the mid level exception.

And don't mince words, they were the two biggest culprits why Memphis "really played well".

[ChumpDumper]

Bonner would probably make what he makes now.

I still don't understand the Spurs' bidding against themselves with Jefferson.

[cd98]

Bonner would probably make what he makes now.

I still don't understand the Spurs' bidding against themselves with Jefferson.

Backroom dealing. Given the Spurs's history, no way they resign Jefferson to a long-term deal. But what probably happened, but can't be officially said, is that the Spurs asked Jefferson to opt out and they guaranteed they would resign him for a longer deal with more money so they could use the savings to sign Splitter and stay under the cap.

Spurs are hoping to make the same deal with Duncan most likely. Instead of paying him one large payment this year, spread it out over a couple years so you can sign players now and avoid salary cap issues.

Spurs are not Dallas. They can't absorb bad contracts and make due with paying hugh salary cap penalties.

[Vic Petro]

There are rare exceptions, but to win an NBA le you need a top 10 player in the NBA. You can argue about Bonner or Blair or Tiago or other role players, but the sad truth is, at this age, the Duncan-Parker-Ginobili core isn't good enough to win a le. Even if we could go back in time and make all the absolute perfect role player moves and draft picks some people here are suggesting, age has caught up.

Bottom line is that this team, with its current core, will give us compe ive basketball in the regular season and in the playoffs, but they won't win a le. Ginobili on an iso with the clock winding down is no longer automatic. Duncan in the post is no longer automatic.

The point about picking in the top 5 is a good one. The team needs another great, core player to reach championship level.

[TJastal]

Bonner would probably make what he makes now.

I still don't understand the Spurs' bidding against themselves with Jefferson.

Name one team that would have given Bonner a 4 year/13m type contract.

[ChumpDumper]

Name one team that would have given Bonner a 4 year/13m type contract.

Quite a few of them, actually.

You're acting like it's a maximum contract.

[ChumpDumper]

Backroom dealing. Given the Spurs's history, no way they resign Jefferson to a long-term deal. But what probably happened, but can't be officially said, is that the Spurs asked Jefferson to opt out and they guaranteed they would resign him for a longer deal with more money so they could use the savings to sign Splitter and stay under the cap.

Spurs are hoping to make the same deal with Duncan most likely. Instead of paying him one large payment this year, spread it out over a couple years so you can sign players now and avoid salary cap issues.

Spurs are not Dallas. They can't absorb bad contracts and make due with paying hugh salary cap penalties.

Were it not for so many years, that would be easier to understand.

[dbestpro]

Quite a few of them, actually.

You're acting like it's a maximum contract.

I agree, playoff conteders like Minnesota, Toronto, New Jersey, and Golden State would have all paid him considerably more.

[Obstructed_View]

Resigning RJ was a no brainer and shouldn't be criticized. (1) we had no small forward; (2) he opted out so we could pay him more money over several years, a move which allowed us to get under the salary cap and have flexibility to make other moves, like signing Splitter and staying under the cap.

Splitter did play and did okay. He still has a long way to go to be reliable in the playoffs. Hopefully next season.

Fail, fail, fail. Trading for RJ was a great move, but resigning him was stupid, both before and after the fact. The Spurs drafted a small forward, have a glut of swingmen on a team where the coach loves three guard lineups, and could have traded RJ's expiring for just about anything they wanted, particularly since RJ was playing out of his mind at the beginning of the season.

Also, hasn't the whole RJ-helping-to-sign Splitter myth been debunked? It's been so long since someone tried to use it that I've forgotten.

Splitter was statistically the second best player on the Spurs in the playoffs. If that's not reliable, then I'm not sure what you folks call it.