After Altercation, Philadelphia Police Say They Won't Look the Other Way on Open-Carry Gun Owners
After Altercation, Philadelphia Police Say They Won't Look the Other Way on Open-Carry Gun Owners
By Stephen Clark
Published May 21, 2011
| FoxNews.com
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Mark Fiorino
Mark Fiorino, a suburban Philadelphia IT worker, is in legal trouble after posting to YouTube an audiotape of his encounter with Philadelphia police over his unconcealed handgun.
With a shocking altercation between Philadelphia police and a 25-year-old IT worker putting the spotlight back on open-carry gun laws, local authorities are warning gun owners that they will be "inconvenienced" if they carry unconcealed handguns in the city.
Lt. Raymond Evers, a spokesman for the city police, told FoxNews.com that gun owners who open carry, which is legal in the city, may be asked to lay on the ground until officers feel safe while they check permits.
"Philadelphia, in certain areas, is very dangerous," he said. "There's a lot of gun violence." Several officers have been killed in the line of duty in the past three years, local authorities say.
The warning comes after Mark Fiorino, a suburban Philadelphia IT worker, posted an audiotape to YouTube of his tense, 45-minute encounter with police in February over his exposed handgun. The video went viral and captured national attention.
After Fiorino released the audiotape, he was charged with disorderly conduct and reckless endangerment. He now faces up to two years in prison.
"The police department and assistant district attorney are coming after me, in my opinion, to make an example of me because I stood up to them and exposed them for their lack of knowledge," Fiorino said, who called the trial "absolutely inappropriate and a waste of taxpayer money."
Fiorino said he did nothing reckless, nor did he endanger anyone's life.
"I had a gun pointed at my chest," he said.
Only seven states ban the practice of openly carrying guns, and Pennsylvania isn't one of them, according to OpenCarry.org, which advocates gun rights. In Philadelphia, a permit is required to carry handguns openly. But on Feb. 13 a police sergeant who was unaware of the law -- which dates back to at least 1996 when the state Supreme Court referenced it in an unrelated ruling -- stopped Fiorino, who was walking to an auto parts shop in Northeast Philadelphia with a gun on his hip.
Sgt. Michael Dougherty can be heard yelling out to Fiorino as "Junior," and asking him to show his hands as Fiorino protests having a gun pointed at his chest, prompting Dougherty to call for backup.
Dougherty grows increasingly agitated as Fiorino offers to show his permit when he is ordered to get on his knees, causing Dougherty to threaten to shoot if he makes a move. Dougherty then unleashed a string of profanities as the two argued over the legality of open carry.
"Do you know you can't openly carry here in Philadelphia?" Dougherty yells.
"Yes, you can, if you have a license to carry firearms," Fiorino responds."It's Directive 137. It's your own internal directive."
When several other officers arrive, Fiorino is forced to the ground as he tries to explain that he's not breaking the law.
"Shut the f---- up!" Dougherty yells.
Police found the recorder while searching Fiorino's pockets. Officers eventually released him after speaking to the department's lawyer and being told that he was within his legal rights.
Police Commissioner Charles Ramsey took issue with Dougherty's language and his lack of knowledge about the law during the altercation, Evers said, but not with the stop itself.
Evers, who has been an officer for nearly 20 years, said "very rarely do people open carry in Philadelphia." But he added he wasn't make excuses.
"We weren't as up on that crime code as we should have been," he said, adding that officers are being re-educated on open carry in response to the incident.
Dougherty is facing disciplinary action pending the outcome of an internal affairs investigation, Evers said.
Fiorino's trial is scheduled to begin in July and the district attorney's office emphasizes that Fiorino's response to the police, not his gun rights, are at issue.
"This office respects and upholds the rights of a citizen to lawfully carry a firearm," Tasha Jamerson, a spokeswoman for the district attorney's office, said in a statement emailed to FoxNews.com. "The permit to carry a concealed weapon, however, does not mean that a permitholder can abuse that right by refusing to cooperate with police."
Jamerson said Fiorino "allegedly became belligerent and hostile" when police officers "were legally attempting to investigate a potential crime."
But Fiorino's attorney, Joseph Valvo, said the case is larger than Fiorino.
"It's my position that this entire prosecution is an effort by Philadelphia authorities to send a message to legitimate gun owners that open carry as a practice is not welcome in Philadelphia despite the fact that it's cons utionally protected behavior and that's offensive to me as a citizen and as a lawyer," Valvo said.
Gun rights advocates say they're are also offended.
John Pierce, a co-founder of OpenCarry.org said, Philadelphia police have sent a clear message to gun owners that will chill their rights to openly carry.
"Even if it's legal, we can punish you financially and by disruptions in your life," he said.
But the district attorney's office dismissed as "ludicrous" claims it is seeking retaliation or trying to send a message.
"This office only charges people with offenses that we think we can prosecute," Jamerson said in an interview with FoxNews.com. "We just don't willy-nilly charge a person with a crime as retaliation for an incident."
The February incident wasn't the first time Philadelphia police officers have confronted Fiorino about his unconcealed gun. Since July, he has been stopped twice and he has had an audio recorder on him each time in case a cop is having a bad day or doesn't understand the law, he said.
His handgun was confiscated once for five months, but neither occasion escalated like the third encounter.
Fiorino said he studied Pennsylvania law for a year before he started openly carrying a gun. He said he carries the gun openly because some of his friends have been held up at gunpoint and he's not willing to allow himself to be helpless.
Police spokesman Evers said Fiorino appears to be inviting trouble from the law by "surrep iously" recording his encounters with police.
"If you put everything together, it was more than him walking down the street to go to an auto parts store -- without a jacket in the middle of winter," Evers said.
But Fiorino denies that he was looking for trouble.
"How many times does a convenience store need to be robbed to be justified in putting up a security system?" he said.
he wasn't looking for a confrontation with police..he made sure to prove that by secretly taping the incident....
Who cares if he was looking for an incident? Did he do anything against the law? Was he violent? Confrontational?he wasn't looking for a confrontation with police..he made sure to prove that by secretly taping the incident....
This cop is an idiot, plain and simple. People in positions of power will try everything they can to skirt the law if there's no one in place to check them.
Hmm maybe this is why he records the events...
The February incident wasn't the first time Philadelphia police officers have confronted Fiorino about his unconcealed gun. Since July, he has been stopped twice and he has had an audio recorder on him each time in case a cop is having a bad day or doesn't understand the law, he said.
The unconcealed gun is a source of power for the cop so of course they don't want other people to have it
What the is he going to trail for? Thats such a crock of .
Ignorant cop on a power-trip... worst combination ever...
He has been harassed by the police before, and you assume he was looking for trouble when he has the foresight to use a recorded?he wasn't looking for a confrontation with police..he made sure to prove that by secretly taping the incident....
Bad cops need to be exposed.
Ignorant cop, but had Dirty Harry just cooperated he wouldn't have these charges against him.
Cooperate for what?
Understanding the 2nd amendment?
"Papers please."
Are you suggesting that probable cause includes anything the police don't like?
A paper is required to open carry.
Which he had. And offered to show the officer.
Dougherty grows increasingly agitated as Fiorino offers to show his permit when he is ordered to get on his knees,
No it isn't. It's only required to hide one rather than bear it.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but there are few exceptions to this that the courts agree with.
Not only are you agreeing with "papers please," but you wish to throw away parts of our cons ution. Simply showing you have a weapon is not threatening.
Great. He shouldn't have done anything to merit any charge then.
Haven't heard any of the audio, but I'm going to venture a guess that both were probably being s about it. I'm never going to be a to a cop who is pointing a gun at my chest. That's just the way I am.
Search his name on YouTube.
I did.
You are wrong and I already corrected you.
You didn't for Gingrich and his support of health insurance mandates, asshole.
Yes I did, there was simply too much out there to find what I was looking for.
Stop changing the subject asshole.
I found it in about a minute.
You suck at the internet.
Maybe I don't use the internet as much as you do, like you do in your aunt's basement all day long.
Why do you want to implement "papers please" here in the USA?
That's your idea of an insult?
You simply aren't as smart as you think you are. Don't get angry.
A permit is required in Philadelphia.Why do you want to implement "papers please" here in the USA?
A permit may be required, but doesn't mean you can thwart the cons ution. It amounts to a 4th amendment violation to require such "papers please" be searched unless there is probable cause to check.
Are you also unaware of the 4th amendment?
I believe openly carrying a gun could be construed as probable cause for su ion of unlawfully openly carrying a gun.
Besides, is showing a government permit the same as being searched?
Are you a cons utional legal scholar, WC?
I'm not.
That's a stretch, and you know it. It compares to stopping someone because they are black, just because statistically, blacks commit more crimes. It's an improper way to profile.
So I assume you agree with police slowing down the movement of citizens for any reason they can rationalize?
The cons ution is plain enough to interpret in most cases.
Black men =/= guns.
guns =/= criminal.
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