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  1. #76
    Veteran Isitjustme?'s Avatar
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    CubanSucks is very ty fwiw

  2. #77
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    Also, most of the people in this thread are too stupid to realize this, but Sadam Hussein was good for America. He was a secular dictator who kept all Islamic extremism and terrorism out of Iraq. Before anyone turns this into a strawman argument, yeah, he was a brutal dictator who did disgusting things to Iraqi citizens, but as far as America is concerned, his regime made Iraq a terrorist-free nation. Since America took Hussein down, Al Queda has a presence in Iraq, and now there are tons of Islamic extremists there.

  3. #78
    Knowledge Is Hassle Fpoonsie's Avatar
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    You're government considers them expendable and so do you. Talk aboutunder handed gra ude towards people that don't deserve gra ude to begin with. For the record, again, since your slow, I'm talking about living post Vietnam soldiers, and moSt especially currently active enlisted men.
    Couldn't care less about your politics, but this is mouse-level idiocy, albeit wonderfully ironic.

  4. #79
    Banned CubanSucks's Avatar
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    theyre the only ones dying though that we are commemorating On This Day
    As far as I'm concerned this discussion has moved past this day and purely into the people actually in the military. I haven't even mentioned Memorial Day

  5. #80
    Pop took his brain back. xellos88330's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Kyle Orton;5270263]gr8 essay bro

    Dude...

    Everything is warfare. There are just different kinds of warfare out there. Economic warfare, political warfare, military warfare.

    Terrorism in my eyes is a complete and total act of war. 9/11 was an act of war on all 3 fronts. Economic by bringing down the towers. Military by attacking the Pentagon. Political by inciting the public to question the integrity of our governments ability to protect its people.

    Communism is a completely different animal as most of the things it does to threaten American ideals is extremely subtle and most people (hippies who think they know more about the situation with less information than those in charge) can't see it. The Soviet Union, of course, was the villian in this story. Let me ask you this, can you think of 1 nation that hates the USA that DOESN'T use Soviet weapons? Do you think that all of those countries with those weapons really had the governmental maturity to handle said weapons? If so, then why is the region so unstable?

    In manipulating the middle east through supply in arms, the Communists were effectively attempting to cut off the vast supplies of oil the region held from the Americans. (Terrorists seemed to be mostly from the middle east. Coincidence???) Those who wouldn't be communist were quickly dealt with and most often violently. Korea and Vietnam were waged to prevent Communistic nations from cutting off US interests and influence in the areas. Those two areas were absolutely vital in preventing the US from having bases very near the borders of communist nations like China for example. It is also a major reason why the Chinese military assisted N. Korea and applauded it's attempt to wipe out the democratic S. Korea. Judging from the decisions that communist foreign policy made, attacking democratic nations, selling weapons to gain favor with easily manipulated/underdeveloped nations, attempting to cut off American ability to trade with the middle east, what other logical conclusion could the US government come to? Those were preemptive attacks to hinder Americas ability for global influence of politics, military capacity to wage war, and hurt the largely oil based economic industry of the US.

  6. #81
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    Let me ask you this, can you think of 1 nation that hates the USA that DOESN'T use Soviet weapons?
    Yeah I can. Afghanistan and the Taliban. They used our own weapons against us.

  7. #82
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    Communism is a form of government, just like capitalism. It does absolutely nothing to threaten America. The cold war was nothing more than a measuring contest between America and the USSR, and America did things behind the scenes to win it (like empowering Al Queda and the taliban to make it look like Russia would lose its war in Afghanistan).

  8. #83
    We'll Be Back Spursfan092120's Avatar
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    Yeah I can. Afghanistan and the Taliban. They used our own weapons against us.
    Wrong...the Afghans use Soviet weapons.

  9. #84
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    Wrong...the Afghans use Soviet weapons.
    learn some history you in moron. The Soviets invaded Afghanistan and America supported the Taliban just to side with whoever was fighting the Soviets. Any credible source says so. The Soviets and Afghanistan were enemies, the Soviets didn't give them jack .

  10. #85
    Pop took his brain back. xellos88330's Avatar
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    <<<<<<<< waaaaaaay too smart to be in the military. it's for lazy dumb s who cant do anything better witht their life. It's an easy out... go get a job where someone tells you when to eat, sleep, piss, and , (and anything else they want you to do )
    LOL!!!! Military is only for dumb folks.

    If you truly were too smart to be in the military, then you wouldn't be so dumb and naive. The modern world whether you like it or not was shaped by military force. Rome, created the modern highway system, sewage, running water, architecture, to the world through military conquest. Napoleonic Wars brought about the birth of the US. England couldn't bring their full force of arms against us due to the acts of Napoleon in Europe. WWI reshaped the public ideals of war and also brought aircraft development to include abilities to carry heavier weights fly longer, faster, farther, higher. WWII brought Rockets and the possibility of space flight, nuclear power.

    Yea, everybody in the military is dumb, lazy, and can't do anything for themselves. How have you impacted the world?

  11. #86
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_in_Afghanistan

    The Afghans were supported by a number of other countries, with the US and Saudi Arabia offering the greatest financial support.
    The United States began training insurgents in, and directing propaganda broadcasts into Afghanistan from Pakistan in 1978.[79] Then, in early 1979, U.S. foreign service officers began meeting insurgent leaders to determine their needs.[80] One month after the Soviet invasion, US National Security Advisor Zbigniew Brzezinski actually flew to Pakistan where on the Afghan border near the Khyber pass, he motivated the local muhajhideen: “We know of their deep belief in God, and we are confident their struggle will succeed. That land over there is yours, you’ll go back to it one day because your fight will prevail, and you’ll have your homes and your mosques back again. Because your cause is right and God is on your side.” [81] According to Brzezinski, CIA financial aid to the insurgents within Afghanistan was approved in July 1979, six months before the Soviet invasion, though after the Soviets were already covertly engaged there. Arms were sent after the formal invasion.[82][83]
    United States President Jimmy Carter insisted that what he termed "Soviet aggression" could not be viewed as an isolated event of limited geographical importance but had to be contested as a potential threat to US influence in the Persian Gulf region. The US was also worried about the USSR gaining access to the Indian Ocean by coming to an arrangement with Pakistan.
    After the Soviet deployment, Pakistan's military ruler General Muhammad Zia-ul-Haq started accepting financial aid from the Western powers to aid the mujahideen.[84] In 1981, following the election of US President Ronald Reagan, aid for the mujahideen through Zia's Pakistan significantly increased, mostly due to the efforts of Texas Congressman Charlie Wilson and CIA officer Gust Avrakotos.
    US "Paramilitary Officers" from the CIA's Special Activities Division were instrumental in training, equipping and sometimes leading Mujihadeen forces against the Soviet Army. Although the CIA in general and Charlie Wilson, a Texas Congressman, have received most of the attention, the key architect of this strategy was Michael G. Vickers, a young Paramilitary Officer.[85] Michael Pillsbury, a senior Pentagon official overcame bureaucratic resisistance in 1985-1986 and persuaded President Reagan to provide hundreds of Stinger missiles.[86][87]
    The United States, the United Kingdom, and Saudi Arabia became major financial contributors, the United States donating "$600 million in aid per year, with a matching amount coming from the Persian Gulf states."[88] The People's Republic of China also sold Type 59 tanks, Type 68 assault rifles, Type 56 assault rifles, Type 69 RPGs, and much more to mujahideen in co-operation with the CIA, as did Egypt with assault rifles. Of particular significance was the donation of US-made FIM-92 Stinger anti-aircraft missile systems, which caused a notable increase in aircraft losses of the Soviet Air Force.[89] The main impact that it made, however, was the change it led to in Soviet tactics – helicopters increasingly stayed over friendly forces and limited daytime flights, jetcraft were forced to fly much higher, and other contingency measures were put in place.[90]

    An Afghan mujahideen fighter demonstrates the use of a hand-held SA-7 surface-to-air missile.


    In March 1985, the US government adopted National Security Decision Directive (NSDD) 166, which set a goal of military victory for the mujahideen. After 1985 the CIA and Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) placed greater pressure on the mujahideen to attack government strongholds. Under direct instructions from Director of Central Intelligence William Casey, the CIA initiated programs for training Afghans in techniques such as car bombs and assassinations and in engaging in cross-border raids into the USSR.[91]

    The mujahideen are what later became the Taliban. I can't wait for you to backpedal and say you didn't really mean Afghans use Soviet weapons.

  12. #87
    Pop took his brain back. xellos88330's Avatar
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    learn some history you in moron. The Soviets invaded Afghanistan and America supported the Taliban just to side with whoever was fighting the Soviets. Any credible source says so. The Soviets and Afghanistan were enemies, the Soviets didn't give them jack .
    Communism, responded against them with force. US helps them out. What is your point? Afghanistan was a clear ally at that point in time. They didn't use US weapons against US troops did they?

  13. #88
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    Yeah they did. You think the stinger missiles they used when the military invaded post 9/11 were weapons they developed on their own?

    Helping the Mujahideen directly led to 9/11, you'd have to be pretty in stupid to say the US was right in doing so. The US military supports evil regimes just as much as other countries whenever it's convenient for them.

  14. #89
    Veteran Sisk's Avatar
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    i'll tell you this to your face, where do you live?
    College Station, TX. Come say that here. Or better yet - go to the airport and say it to a group of Marines returning from Afghanistan.

    There's been several times I've been around an Iraqi war veteran as he got on his soap box about all the "great things" we're doing in Iraq, and I didn't hold back at all telling him the stuff I'm saying in this thread.
    Yeah, I'm sure you did. Were you saying "lol Iraq" while you were doing this? Bull . You've got no backbone.

  15. #90
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    Yeah, I'm sure you did. Were you saying "lol Iraq" while you were doing this? Bull . You've got no backbone.
    You're acting like some 5'6" billy badass got who joined the military because he's been picked on his entire life is someone to be scared of.

  16. #91
    Veteran Sisk's Avatar
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    You're acting like some 5'6" billy badass got who joined the military because he's been picked on his entire life is someone to be scared of.
    I'm not acting like . You're the one saying you talked to some Iraq vet which we both know is totally fallacious. I'm not in the military.

    I'd put money on a 5'6 woman in the Coast Guard to whoop your ass.

  17. #92
    silverblk mystix
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    It is very easy to sit and criticize people who have sacrificed their lives and it is easy to call them dumb for being manipulated into serving their country-while you sit in safety here at your computer and spout from books because you NEVER had the balls to actually risk your life.

    The OP started a thread to honor and/or pay respect to fallen soldiers...pretty simple...but pussies like Kyle Orton and his ilk think that they are above this and are smarter...maybe they are book smart but know nothing of human sacrifice and servitude.

    Some soldiers realized before dying that they might have been used as pawns, some dying and/or injured, paralyzed, mentally damaged or seriously hurt veterans also have realized that war and the people who run governments have also betrayed them. This however did not stop them from serving and/or risking their lives, their safety, their comfort, their own ass---

    because deep down inside when they were in the trenches and had fellow soldiers next to them --they decided to at least keep fighting until the end....

    EVEN IF THEY HAD FIGURED OUT THAT THINGS WERE NOT ALWAYS AS IT SEEMED---THEY DECIDED TO FOLLOW THROUGH ON THEIR COMMITMENT---RIGHT OR WRONG.


    The Kyle Ortons of this world will never have the balls to be men...they will read about life and judge from afar because that is as much of a sacrifice as they are capable of...

    Spare me the, "I am smarter" bull ...you just haven't been tested in this life because when you have been tested and have persevered...you will shut the up and at least show some respect---EVEN WHEN YOUR POLITICAL BELIEFS DON'T AGREE WITH OTHERS BELIEFS.

    You will at least respect because someone sacrificed so you wouldn't have to.

  18. #93
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    I'm not acting like . You're the one saying you talked to some Iraq vet which we both know is totally fallacious. I'm not in the military.
    OK sure if you think it's so far fetched for someone to openly say he opposes the War in Iraq.

  19. #94
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    lol the cop loving double spacer would be a military knob slobber

  20. #95
    We'll Be Back Spursfan092120's Avatar
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    The mujahideen are what later became the Taliban. I can't wait for you to backpedal and say you didn't really mean Afghans use Soviet weapons.
    Soviet-Era Weapons Handy for Taliban
    By Tahir Qadiry

    MAZAR-E-SHARIF, Jun 26, 2007 (IPS) - While United States officials accuse Iran of arming a resurgent Taliban, officials here say the weapons are actually part of vast caches left behind by the Soviet army that fought a nine-year war in Afghanistan before withdrawing in 1988.

    Ustad Basir Arifi, secretary for the Disarmament of Illegal Armed Groups (DIAG) programme in northern Afghanistan, told IPS that weapons abandoned by the Soviet Union there are now being moved by professional smugglers to the southern provinces where the Taliban Islamist movement has its stronghold.

    "Huge caches of weapons remained with the people from the Soviet Union period. These are now being smuggled to the south of Afghanistan. These weapons are bought in the north of Afghanistan and smuggled to the south to be used against government and foreign forces," Arifi said.

    According to Arifi, security officials have on several occasions intercepted weapons being smuggled to the south. He said the DIAG has urged the government to take firm measures to avoid all this.

    Abdul Aziz Ahmad Zai, the chief of DIAG, said his group was "very concerned over the issue. It shows that the Taliban are being fortified."

    Zai did not rule out the possibility of weapons originating from outside Afghanistan. "Smugglers could be bringing weapons from Uzbekistan and Tajikistan to the north. A good transit point could be Badakhshan province," he said without mentioning Iran.

    Zai said powerful syndicates were carrying out the smuggling. "However, our security officials and the Interior Ministry are working very actively in this regard," he added.

    According to Zai, the recent riots in northern Jowzjan province were an indicator of the fact that weapons were freely available to people. He also said that there still were armed groups in the north of Afghanistan. "It is a very great concern for us that there are lots of illegal armed groups in the north," he said.

    Gen. Abdul Manan, representative of the defence ministry in the DIAG programme, said the government has been able to collect 70,000 heavy and light weapons from the whole country under the DDR and DIAG programmes. But he believes that at least a million more pieces were in the hands of armed groups in the north.

    A gun smuggler operating from the Balkh province district told IPS that he has been in the business for the last two years. The Pashto-speaking, bearded man who spoke on condition of anonymity said he regularly comes to the north to buy different kinds of weapons. "I have employed people to collect weapons from people who have them and these are ferried to the south."

    "I have my customers in Kandahar. When the weapons reach there, they come and receive it. I make good profit. I can buy an AK47 for 200 dollars in the north and sell it for 400 dollars in the south," he added. Occasionally he smuggles explosives as well.

    Ahmad Shah, 45, a resident of Chemtal district in the Balkh province freely admitted to supplying the smugglers with guns. "I earn my living through running this business," he told IPS.

    Atta Mohammad Nur, the governor of Balkh province, neither accepts nor rejects the fact that the weapons are being smuggled to the south. "It could be right. Insurgents are doing their utmost to disrupt life in the country. They could be smuggling weapons from north to the south," he said.

    Rohullah Samun, spokesman for the Jowzjan governor, accepts that vast amount of weapons still exist in the province. "People do have weapons. There are lots of illegal armed militias in Jowzjan and its neighbouring provinces. Some of the warlords are regrouping," he said.

    The reference was to Abdorrashid Dostum, one of Afghanistan's most formidable warlords. Dostum, who once supported the Soviets, has had a hand in the many regime changes that this war-torn country has seen over the last three decades and retains enormous influence in Jowzjan.

    Dostum was among leaders who helped the U.S.-led forces to overthrow the Taliban government in 2001. Until recently he was regarded as the strongman of the north but his role has been reduced to that of being a military adviser to Afghanistan's President Hamid Karzai.

    On Jun. 13, U.S. Undersecretary of State Nicholas Burns told CNN television in Paris that there was "irrefutable evidence" that Iran was supplying weapons to the Taliban.

    Ironically, the Taliban owes its origins largely to Mujahideen (freedom) fighters that were once armed and backed by the U.S. against communist rule in Afghanistan and the Soviet occupation. (END)
    http://ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=38323

    Didn't say Soviets gave weapons to them..said they used them.

  21. #96
    Veteran Sisk's Avatar
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    OK sure if you think it's so far fetched for someone to openly say he opposes the War in Iraq.
    Saying you "oppose the war" and saying you were saying the same stuff you've said in this thread is completely different. Glad you clarified that.

  22. #97
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    You said I was wrong the U.S. supplied the Taliban with weapons when I clearly wasn't.

  23. #98
    Abe Lincoln, NlGGA Kyle Orton's Avatar
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    Saying you "oppose the war" and saying you were saying the same stuff you've said in this thread is completely different. Glad you clarified that.
    Well, I also said the War in Iraq has accomplished absolutely nothing and there's nothing about killing innocent Iraqis that's honorable.

  24. #99
    We'll Be Back Spursfan092120's Avatar
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    It is very easy to sit and criticize people who have sacrificed their lives and it is easy to call them dumb for being manipulated into serving their country-while you sit in safety here at your computer and spout from books because you NEVER had the balls to actually risk your life.

    The OP started a thread to honor and/or pay respect to fallen soldiers...pretty simple...but pussies like Kyle Orton and his ilk think that they are above this and are smarter...maybe they are book smart but know nothing of human sacrifice and servitude.

    Some soldiers realized before dying that they might have been used as pawns, some dying and/or injured, paralyzed, mentally damaged or seriously hurt veterans also have realized that war and the people who run governments have also betrayed them. This however did not stop them from serving and/or risking their lives, their safety, their comfort, their own ass---

    because deep down inside when they were in the trenches and had fellow soldiers next to them --they decided to at least keep fighting until the end....

    EVEN IF THEY HAD FIGURED OUT THAT THINGS WERE NOT ALWAYS AS IT SEEMED---THEY DECIDED TO FOLLOW THROUGH ON THEIR COMMITMENT---RIGHT OR WRONG.


    The Kyle Ortons of this world will never have the balls to be men...they will read about life and judge from afar because that is as much of a sacrifice as they are capable of...

    Spare me the, "I am smarter" bull ...you just haven't been tested in this life because when you have been tested and have persevered...you will shut the up and at least show some respect---EVEN WHEN YOUR POLITICAL BELIEFS DON'T AGREE WITH OTHERS BELIEFS.

    You will at least respect because someone sacrificed so you wouldn't have to.
    The guy is basically a complete and total loser who bases his entire life by trying to be an internet tough guy. He has such a ty life that he has to pose as a professional athlete to get any glory out of anything, and actually think it makes him cool that he can talk in front of his computer to people as a person that he'll never be. Never seen such a worthless person in my life..oh well...it's his life, not mine.

  25. #100
    Veteran Sisk's Avatar
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    Well, I also said the War in Iraq has accomplished absolutely nothing and there's nothing about killing innocent Iraqis that's honorable.
    Well if you're being literal, it has accomplished many things, but I don't want to have to put any more effort into this than is necessary. Do you realize that innocent civilians have died in every single war... ever. That's a fact of war. When your enemy is dressed up in civilian clothes it makes this situation even worse. Maybe before you judge people for killing civilians you should put yourself in their shoes. You think they want to kill innocent people? Think about it.

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