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Why does everyone want to trade the Spurs' best player?
TP is not going to any team
Why does everyone want to trade the Spurs' best player?
Unless it's a TP, RJ, DB for Harris, Favors, Evans; Nope.
This is absolutely true. Parker isn't going anywhere now. I believe our rotation looks like this:
Parker/Manu/Neal/at some point Joseph
Anderson/Neal/Manu/
RJ/Leonard
Tim/Dice/Blair
Splitter/Bonner/Blair
With the possibility that Lorbek or Richards get into the mix. I think if Leonard plays like we all hope that he gets more and more of RJ's minutes. However, for all the wailing and gnashing of teeth on this board RJ's numbers make him an average starting SF in the NBA.
I think the first sub is Manu for Anderson at the 2, then Neal comes in for Parker and Manu moves to the 1. I think Manu gets over half of his minutes at the 1 this year.
Parker/Manu/Neal/at some point Joseph
Anderson/Neal/Manu/
RJ/Leonard
Tim/Dice/Blair
Splitter/Bonner/Blair
If the spurs go into the season with that team they will not win a championship. They need more size at the 5 and need to get rid of RJ but we know that's not going to happen.
If Tony Parker is the spurs best player there in trouble. Manu is there best player.
Probably not, but if the following occurred they would have a chance: key players all healthy, Leonard plays to expectations including rebounding at twice the rate of RJ and Splitter is at least an average big. If these things happen I believe they can complete again.Parker/Manu/Neal/at some point Joseph
Anderson/Neal/Manu/
RJ/Leonard
Tim/Dice/Blair
Splitter/Bonner/Blair
If the spurs go into the season with that team they will not win a championship. They need more size at the 5 and need to get rid of RJ but we know that's not going to happen.
I doubt Manu will go back to the bench as a 6th man. He did that for years already, without any qualms I might add (unlike a certain french poodle). And certainly not for a 2nd year inexperienced fatboy like Anderson.
Anderson (if he's even on the team next year) will most likely be behind Manu, Neal & Green in the rotation. Which means essentially he'll most likely be playing on the toros.
Some of you guys can't be serious. Devin Harris loves to drive into 7 footers, the problem is he always gets hurt right after. That guy is so injury-prone and yet he won't change his style of play. No complaints about Millsap though, he's a solid player. But if I'm the SA FO I wouldn't make this trade.
Like most analysis streams (ESPN, FoxSports, SI, etc.), typically, a numerical value is placed on players to evaluate their abilities. In that same manner, I would think TP should garner something like an 87/88 grade (out of 100 obviously) as a player in the NBA (not just a PG). That's taking into account his age and abilities today (I would've had him at 93 about 4-5 years ago). Devin Harris is about an 82. McDyess is about a 78. Millsap is about an 83. Average talent score leaving the Spurs in trade = 83. Average talent acquired in the trade is about the same.
However, there is a "factor" that isn't being considered w/ the assignment of grades - the stronger or ELITE player factor. Whenever a team has the opportunity to acquire and/or keep a player who's great to ELITE talent (90+ grade) and another solid player (80-85 score), that should take precedence over a two good players (high 80s) even though the average is the same.
In other words, keeping TP and McDyess is better than trading for Millsap and DH.
I love this trade. Blow it up.
What if said ELITE stronger player (score 90+) has issues like lusting after teammates' wives and getting outplayed by said GOOD solid player Conley (score 80-85) in playoffs? Does that trump the standard rule of keeping said ELITE player in the event of their mean average being the same?
Fascinating stuff otherwise, as usual coach Jenkins.
You bring up a good point as there is the element of at ude, off the court issues, etc. I don't think TPs extra-curricular activities were that much of a distraction last year although I personally think what he did was pretty ty. If what he does continues, that's a different story.
On the court and getting outplayed in a game or even a series doesn't mean TPs isn't a better player. Playoffs are about matchups - some players match up to others better. TP was bested, no doubt about it, but you don't trade him because of that reason alone or if you combine that reason w/ his off the court stuff.
Who do you think is better - honestly: Parker or Conley?
Conley clearly outplayed Parker
Conley - 14ppg / 6.1 ast shooting 39% from the field
Parker 19.7ppg / 5.2 ast 46% from the field
Even though Parker was supposed to kill Conley because he is the better player, he was not the reason we lost that series. Our front-court was destroyed, plain and simple.
We got spoiled with Duncan carrying this team with mediocre help in the front-court. He cannot do it anymore.
Indeed. I think people are expecting way too much of a point guard when complaining about Tony Parker not carrying the Spurs. Derrick Rose was the league MVP and we see how he did carrying his team: no championship. A point guard carrying a team to a championship is not a common occurance - save a certain 6 ft 9" point guard that could play the power forward position. Despite this, that same 6 ft 9" point guard played for a franchise that can afford and constantly spends money for trophies, the Lakers.Conley clearly outplayed Parker
Conley - 14ppg / 6.1 ast shooting 39% from the field
Parker 19.7ppg / 5.2 ast 46% from the field
Even though Parker was supposed to kill Conley because he is the better player, he was not the reason we lost that series. Our front-court was destroyed, plain and simple.
We got spoiled with Duncan carrying this team with mediocre help in the front-court. He cannot do it anymore.
How many other point guards led a team to multiple championships or even one? The great Oscar Robertson only won one. People need to give Parker a break.
Also, I miss giggling at your old avatar Elemento.
COMPLETELY agree. PGs rarely are the reason for Championships (PFs and slashing SG/SFs are) but that's another thread.
But TP is the best player on the team. Let me reiterate - Tony Parker is the BEST player on the Spurs. I don't even think it's close to be honest as the PG position is much more difficult than the SG position (again, another thread). And if TP is the best player, than if he's traded, then the team needs to recoup either a comporable PG, which is unlikely, or a PF who's just as good.
Since that isn't going to happen, my original point was the TP remain a Spur.
Conley might not exactly have outplayed TP, but this was supposed to be one of the few matchups in the Spurs' favour in this series, and it didn't work out that way because Tony was having a subpar outing.
Isiah Thomas, a small, scoring PG, hall of famer. He did it, TWICE, as the leader of the team. But Tony isn't him and the current Spurs team is also nowhere near the zenith of those badboys.
Otherwise, i agree of your notion. Even if Tony was playing at par in that series, the Spurs was flawed enough that championship aspiration was just a fatamorgana last season.
The killer numbers in the match-up were Parker's 31 assists to 20 turnovers. Thats not running the offense and getting the team involved well. Whereas Conley was more PG-like with 37 assists and 13 turnovers. Parker's PER also dropped from his regular season avg of 20.4 to 17.6 in the playoffs. Sure its a small sample size but you expect the youngest and healthiest member of the Big 3 to be more of a factor than that and the Spurs really needed it in the first game without Manu.Conley clearly outplayed Parker
Conley - 14ppg / 6.1 ast shooting 39% from the field
Parker 19.7ppg / 5.2 ast 46% from the field
Even though Parker was supposed to kill Conley because he is the better player, he was not the reason we lost that series. Our front-court was destroyed, plain and simple.
We got spoiled with Duncan carrying this team with mediocre help in the front-court. He cannot do it anymore.
But the Spurs weren't going to contend anyway especially with the injuries and matchup issues they had and still have. If the Spurs are serious about improving defensively to even a top 5-7 team then it'll take some serious upgrades in the frontcourt and the backcourt doesn't exactly have defensive stoppers either.
Imo the Spurs will be trading players to reach that defensive goal but I'm not sure if Parker is that valuable to a team other than a potential contender which the Jazz aren't. Parker is also still a great player to have versus the Lakers and Mavs PGs
Last edited by Cane; 07-28-2011 at 02:19 AM.
Bull .
I think our man Manu takes the crown of best player. The only player on the Jazz that I really like is Al Jefferson who reminds of another player that wiped the floor with us in the playoffs, Zach Randolph. Al has a lot to his game and many post moves down low and would be a considerable upgrade at PF. Devin is not the same caliber of player as Parker on the offense end but he is considerably better on the defensive end, which should be our number one priority. Not sure if Utah would consider trading Jefferson but we should explore it.
D. Harris
M. Ginobili
K. Leonard
Duncan
Al Jefferson
al jefferson is the only player on the jazz i would want to get back for parker. if hes not included then no trade. i would take milsap if RJ was the centerpiece of the spurs offer. but we all know that will never happen.
would keep tony over harris anyday and i havent seen enough of milsap to say hes the real deal yet
Utah is not giving up 2 of their best 3 players for Tony Parker, who's going to turn 30.
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