ObamaJobs: The Speech

[hater]

Obama's speech should have save Europe

[scott]

So the loudest complaints we have so far are:

1) He waited 961 days to "care about jobs" and
2) He should have sent the bill to congress before his press conference (which goes against precedent for pretty much any President)

In other words, SnakeBoy is the only poster of decidedly conservative leaning to give the proposal any real thought before criticizing it, while (not surprisingly) we have the Darrins, CosmicCowboys and Chookshanks of the forum playing the Ying to boutons idiotic Yang, spewing out whatever nonsense they can to basically say "my team is always right your team is always wrong nanananananana".

Par for the course.

[Winehole23]

wait a minute.. I thought this drop was attributed to Obama's speech...

Inferred it, more like. He's shifty like that.

[scott]

After the speech yesterday, I did flip on FoxNews radio to listen to reaction and these are the main themes I heard:

"He says he wants to end the political circus, but he is the ringleader!"
"If he would just get out of the way of small businesses, we'd be fine!"

Neither of these address the issue at hand, they are more of the same "Obama said it so it must be wrong" mentality. Now, before boutons posts some stupid blog about how this is the Republican mentality, let us remind everyone that this was exactly the thinking of Democrats for eight years under GWB.

Both sides have the blood of politics on their hands. As my college history professor told us years ago: "A politician's job is to win an election. A statesman's job is to serve the cons uency that elected him. We don't have enough (or even any) statesmen."

[SnakeBoy]

"He says he wants to end the political circus, but he is the ringleader!"

Obama's first action after presenting his plan is to hop on a plane and deliver a political speech in Eric Cantor's district. I'd say the ringleader comment is pretty accurate.

[boutons_deux]

"thinking of Democrats for eight years under GWB"

I didn't have that impression of the anti-dubyas.

But nobody here can list anything positive that occurred in the Repugs' Reign of Error (at least not enough to begin offset the negatives), so if the anybody thought "it's dubya, so it must be wrong", they would have been right.

[scott]

Obama's first action after presenting his plan is to hop on a plane and deliver a political speech in Eric Cantor's district. I'd say the ringleader comment is pretty accurate.

Whether or not that statement is true, it actually has nothing to do with an analysis of the proposal at hand - and that is my point. It fits in quite perfectly with the thread about the NYT article on Palin: it doesn't matter if his proposal is good, non-sequitous arguments against it are immediately thrown forth because the opposition can't accept the possibility of the other side ever having a good idea.

[scott]

"thinking of Democrats for eight years under GWB"

I didn't have that impression of the anti-dubyas.

But nobody here can list anything positive that occurred in the Repugs' Reign of Error (at least not enough to begin offset the negatives), so if the anybody thought "it's dubya, so it must be wrong", they would have been right.

Point proven. Thanks stupid!

[boutons_deux]

list all the net positives for Human-Americans by dubya's gang, or GFY.

[DarrinS]

Deja vu

[CosmicCowboy]

So the loudest complaints we have so far are:

1) He waited 961 days to "care about jobs" and
2) He should have sent the bill to congress before his press conference (which goes against precedent for pretty much any President)

In other words, SnakeBoy is the only poster of decidedly conservative leaning to give the proposal any real thought before criticizing it, while (not surprisingly) we have the Darrins, CosmicCowboys and Chookshanks of the forum playing the Ying to boutons idiotic Yang, spewing out whatever nonsense they can to basically say "my team is always right your team is always wrong nanananananana".

Par for the course.

BTW Scott, I'm fine with extending and increasing the SS witholding tax cuts for another year.

I don't think it will do for creating jobs but it's certainly popular.

[vy65]

The markets certainly weren't impressed by the Teleprompter in Chief. Dow already down 300+ points.

You do realize the ECB head stepped down today, right?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44449392...s-white_house/

Whoops

[CosmicCowboy]

You do realize the ECB head stepped down today, right?

I didn't say it was the teleprompters fault. And yes, I follow world economic events.

[vy65]

Whether or not that statement is true, it actually has nothing to do with an analysis of the proposal at hand - and that is my point. It fits in quite perfectly with the thread about the NYT article on Palin: it doesn't matter if his proposal is good, non-sequitous arguments against it are immediately thrown forth because the opposition can't accept the possibility of the other side ever having a good idea.

Honest question: do you think that part of an "analysis of the proposal at hand" should include the viability of its passage through the congress?

I'm not trying to be cute - I thought the plan sounds pretty good. But given the current political climate, how likely will its passage be?

[vy65]

I didn't say it was the teleprompters fault. And yes, I follow world economic events.

The markets certainly weren't impressed by the Teleprompter in Chief. Dow already down 300+ points.

lol then you're an idiot.

[DarrinS]

What is Congress supposed to pass? They can't pass a speech.

[CosmicCowboy]

lol then you're an idiot.

I said they weren't impressed. I didn't say the speech was the only cause of the drop. off asswipe.

[JohnnyMarzetti]

Cosmiccowboy is just like rush limpballs and the late OBL and Mcconnell.

[vy65]

I said they weren't impressed. I didn't say the speech was the only cause of the drop. off asswipe.

lol your right - a 30 minute speech didn't offset the market-disturbance caused by the European Bernanke stepping down. Good point

[Spurminator]

What is Congress supposed to pass? They can't pass a speech.

You already said that, Crookshanks.

[CosmicCowboy]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44449392...s-white_house/

Whoops

Pretty funny when even MSNBC calls it bull .

[scott]

Honest question: do you think that part of an "analysis of the proposal at hand" should include the viability of its passage through the congress?

I'm not trying to be cute - I thought the plan sounds pretty good. But given the current political climate, how likely will its passage be?

Absolutely.

I'd say... 10%

[Spurminator]

Honest question: do you think that part of an "analysis of the proposal at hand" should include the viability of its passage through the congress?

I'm not trying to be cute - I thought the plan sounds pretty good. But given the current political climate, how likely will its passage be?

I think we should set our standards higher than what the current political climate would allow for. If it's a good plan, it's a good plan regardless of what the opposition is likely to do with it.

If the public disregards ideas that are politically nonviable, how can we ever expect policy to be shaped by anything but politics?

[vy65]

Absolutely.

I'd say... 10%

I thought Obama did a good job coopting a certain amount of the GOP's position by indicating which parts of the AJA had republican support. If the GOP prevents this from going forward, you'd have to think that some people would hold them accountable for flip-flopping. If they balk, it'd seem like they'd be doing exactly what Obama chided them for: putting political interests above the national interest.