Patriots are better without Moss!!!

[stretch]

So since we have gotten to the Super Bowl with Wes as the #1

really? when was that?

[Blake]

You'd think a receiver as complete as they come would be up to the challenge. I'm just glad Brady stopped forcing balls to him and instead targeted the actual best receiver on the team, Gronkowski.

Updated: November 11, 2011, 4:21 PM ET

Patriots quarterback Tom Brady's 2,703 passing yards are a Patriots record through eight games and put him on pace to shatter Dan Marino's single-season record of 5,084. With 20 touchdowns, he's halfway to just the sixth 40-touchdown season in NFL history.

Yet it's hard to escape the feeling that Brady has had a disappointing first half. Perhaps that's a reflection of the high bar he's set.

Uncharacteristically, Brady has had problems with interceptions. His 10 picks are the most by a Patriots quarterback through eight games since 22-year-old Drew Bledsoe in 1994.

Consider that Brady is already four interceptions shy of matching his career high. Last season, he threw just four picks all season. He equaled that total in the Bills game alone.

So what has led to Brady's problem with picks? Some of the most logical explanations are refuted by the numbers.

Given his high-volume reliance on Wes Welker, one might assume that Brady has been caught forcing passes to his favorite target. However, the opposite is true. The turnovers are the product of spreading the ball around. Consider that Brady's 10 interceptions have come while targeting seven different receivers. Deion Branch, Aaron Hernandez and Rob Gronkowski have each been the target for two interceptions.

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story/...ule-their-side

but forcing it to Welker was working so well

[Blake]

really? when was that?

in Mono's crazy ass situation where a fade is somehow required to win a Super Bowl.

[stretch]

in Mono's crazy ass situation where a fade is somehow required to win a Super Bowl.

k, just wanted to make sure you arent re ed enough to actually think Welker > Moss in the 07 campaign

[stretch]

He's #1 across the NFL receiving stat board and you are whining about it.

you mean across 2 categories? granted, they are two of the more important categories (receptions and yards), but its far from being #1 across the board, as others have higher YAC, more TDs, and a better average per reception.

[Blake]

you mean across 2 categories? granted, they are two of the more important categories (receptions and yards), but its far from being #1 across the board, as others have higher YAC, more TDs, and a better average per reception.

for the point made, it was easier to type "across the board" than lay out where he ranks in every single category.

Other than YPR, I'm guessing Welker is at least top 5 in each one.

For Pats fan, that's still not good enough.

[stretch]

for the point made, it was easier to type "across the board" than lay out where he ranks in every single category.

Other than YPR, I'm guessing Welker is at least top 5 in each one.

For Pats fan, that's still not good enough.

I think pretty much every Pats fan loves Welker, they just don't love it when Brady locks on Welker forcing bad passes to him, and doesnt utilize the other weapons at his disposal, such as Gronkowski.

[Blake]

I think pretty much every Pats fan loves Welker, they just don't love it when Brady locks on Welker forcing bad passes to him, and doesnt utilize the other weapons at his disposal, such as Gronkowski.

what bad passes have been thrown to Welker this year?

the crying from Pats fan over misconceptions continues to make me lol

[stretch]

what bad passes have been thrown to Welker this year?

the crying from Pats fan over misconceptions continues to make me lol

So you don't think that Brady has ever had a tendency to lock in and force passes to Welker?

[Blake]

So you don't think that Brady has ever had a tendency to lock in and force passes to Welker?

Not enough for me to notice.

Definitely not enough to cry about it.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

So the only two people in this thread who think Brady doesn't force passes to Welker are Tech fans.

What a coincidence.

[stretch]

So the only two people in this thread who think Brady doesn't force passes to Welker are Tech fans.

What a coincidence.

Definitely a massive coincedence.

[Bill_Brasky]

Really? After all the sucking you do of Gronk because he came out of Arizona, you're gonna try to call people out?

Too funny.

[Bill_Brasky]

Btw the Texans are doing just fine without Andre Johnson on the field.


Look what happens when the Texans don't force balls to Andre

[Blake]

So the only two people in this thread who think Brady doesn't force passes to Welker are Tech fans.

What a coincidence.

Given his high-volume reliance on Wes Welker, one might assume that Brady has been caught forcing passes to his favorite target. However, the opposite is true. The turnovers are the product of spreading the ball around. Consider that Brady's 10 interceptions have come while targeting seven different receivers. Deion Branch, Aaron Hernandez and Rob Gronkowski have each been the target for two interceptions.

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story/...ule-their-side

I count three people that don't, one of them not a Tech fan.

[Blake]

Btw the Texans are doing just fine without Andre Johnson on the field.


Look what happens when the Texans don't force balls to Andre

but but but but but but who will catch the game winning fade in the Super Bowl? Kevin Walter?

[Monostradamus]

That just says Brady doesnt throw picks when he targets Welker. How bout you find out how many times Welker is targeted on failed 3rd down conversions because thats where i constantly see Beady forcing it to Welker.

[Blake]

That just says Brady doesnt throw picks when he targets Welker. How bout you find out how many times Welker is targeted on failed 3rd down conversions because thats where i constantly see Beady forcing it to Welker.

you are the one sobbing about this not me.

How bout you prove that you have a real reason to sob

[Bill_Brasky]

That just says Brady doesnt throw picks when he targets Welker. How bout you find out how many times Welker is targeted on failed 3rd down conversions because thats where i constantly see Beady forcing it to Welker.

BTW how is that even Welker's fault? Brady is the one throwing the passes.

[Blake]

BTW how is that even Welker's fault? Brady is the one throwing the passes.

If the Pats are killing it on offense, how is it even a fault?

[Monostradamus]

nobody is blaming Welker. He can't help it that Brady forces passes that he isn't physically capable or talented enough to make a play on. Nobody is against Welker. We just pointed out the simple fact that Welker isn't a complete receiver or good enough to be the #1 guy on this Pats team if they want to win a le. Tech fans interpreted that ass some attack on their ass buddy. Nobody hates Welker or blames him, we just arent re ed enough to turn a blind eye to his limitations.

[Bill_Brasky]

nobody is blaming Welker. He can't help it that Brady forces passes that he isn't physically capable or talented enough to make a play on. Nobody is against Welker. We just pointed out the simple fact that Welker isn't a complete receiver or good enough to be the #1 guy on this Pats team if they want to win a le. Tech fans interpreted that ass some attack on their ass buddy. Nobody hates Welker or blames him, we just arent re ed enough to turn a blind eye to his limitations.

"catching a bunch of useless 5 yard passes"


Yup, you love Welker so much!

moving the goal posts when your re ed takes get owned.

[stretch]

Looks like both sides are exaggerating the argument, tbh.

Brady definitely does have his moments where he locks into Welker, forces a tough pass, and completely misses wide open guys downfield. But I'm not sure it happens as often as Mono and DoK suggest.

At the same time, anyone who thinks Welker is a #1 on the level of guys like Andre Johnson or Fitzgerald or someone like that, is crazy. He certainly can be a #1 reciever in the right system, which the Pats have a system where he can be just that, but he definitely won't work as a true #1 in a system that relies on stretching the field, although he can be a perfect compliment to a #1 in such a system, as shown in the 2007 season.

[stretch]

We just pointed out the simple fact that Welker isn't a complete receiver or good enough to be the #1 guy on this Pats team if they want to win a le.

He isn't good enough to be a #1 guy on an all-offense no-defense team hoping to win a championship (which exactly is what this Patriots team is), but then again, not many receivers are. But after seeing the Pats win 3 championships with mediocre talent at receiver such as Troy Brown and Deion Branch, I'd say he certainly is capable of being a #1 guy in the right situation, as Welker on a bad day is >>> Brown and Branch on their best days.

[Bill_Brasky]

Stretch, with the rare "everybody calm the down" goods.


Tbh I'm just having fun in this thread and interpret it as Patfan placing blame early in the season for the inevitable playoff flameout.