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  1. #1
    keep asking questions George Gervin's Afro's Avatar
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    FORT WORTH -- The evening of Nov. 8 is being described as infamous by some students in Paul Derengowski's Great Religions of the World class at Tarrant County College's Southeast Campus.

    That's when the second of the professor's two lectures on Islam ended in a headline-grabbing controversy. Two Muslim students questioned Derengowski's source material and objectivity. The students later aired their concerns to the college administration -- a move that resulted in Derengowski's Nov. 15 resignation and prompted other students to file grievances that question the college's handling of the situation.

    Derengowski says the college took the politically correct route by focusing on his lesson rather than disciplining the students, who he said berated him and disrupted his class.

    "My recommendation was expulsion," he said, explaining that the only way he would return to TCC if is the college apologizes, expels the students with failing grades and allows him to resume his lessons without stipulations that he be neutral.

    The Muslim students believed that Derengowski, who on his website lists Islam as a cult, was disparaging their religion. Randa Bedair, one of the students involved, told the Star-Telegram that she was trying to stay out of the limelight and declined to comment. The male student could not be reached for comment.

    The case is an example for some in the Muslim community of how religious history or philosophy classes need to be handled through a neutral and impartial lens. When a professor's objectivity is questioned, it detracts from the lesson, they said.

    "In terms of religion, we need to be religious neutral in terms of giving edicts about what you think religion is," said Mustafaa Carroll, executive of CAIR Texas, an affiliate of the Council on American Islamic Relations.

    The Derengowski case is pending an investigation, said Frank Griffis, TCC spokesman. He said TCC won't provide information while college officials are looking into it.

    Derengowski's course objectives state that after completing the class students will be able to explain and discuss major tenets of major world religions, provide firsthand understanding of two religions not tied to the student's current orientation, and "think critically about the truth, and the truth claims made by some of the major religions around the world, as well as some of the religious aberrations."

    Derengowski has been teaching at TCC's southeast campus for about three and half years. His biggest course was Great World Religions, but he has also taught Bible History I and II and Introduction to Philosophy.

    For several years, he has also operated a website called CAPRO.info, which is part of his Christian Apologetics Project.

    His website includes his interpretation of history and his evaluation of various religious doctrines, including Islam, which he has listed as a cult along with Jehovah's Witnesses, Scientology, Freemasonry and Mormonism. He describes cults as counterfeit religions with dictatorial leaders and aberrant views on sex. He cites the examples of cults using sex to manipulate and says examples can be found "in nearly every other cult which are sometimes seen as respectable, conservative, or peaceful religious ins utions, whether it be Islam, Mormonism, or Roman Catholicism."

    He said his website is a project of more than 20 years that doesn't conflict with his ability to teach his class.

    Derengowski said he lays everything about his work and faith on the table, but doesn't tell his students to follow his personal beliefs.

    But critics said listing Islam as a cult can be interpreted as belittling the religion. "For some reason people feel they have a license to make disparaging remarks about Muslims," Carroll said.

    During the recent class controversy, Derengowski also found himself having to explain images of the World Trade Center towers in flames on 9-11 and a young boy with a gun that are on the Islam section of his website.

    "It's history," he said.

    The Nov. 8 classroom controversy erupted when Derengowski began explaining his source material for events about a Muslim raid during the prophet Muhammad's era. The Muslim students -- Bedair and a male student -- wanted to know the source material. Derengowski said his references included the Quran and a book about the life of Muhammad. That discussion ended with the two students apparently leaving and with the remaining students discussing how fearful they were about the developments.

    Pamela Thomas, a student in the class, said she felt threatened during the incident. She filed a complaint against TCC because of the college's "lack of handling" of the situation.

    "They haven't talked to anybody," Thomas said.

    Another student, Ginger Hart, also filed a complaint, citing similar issues as Thomas.

    "TCC approved the syllabus, so why is it an issue when we get to Islam?" Hart said. "TCC didn't want to deal with a Muslim outcry."

    The class also resulted in Derengowski's filing a campus police report. Derengowski said he was upset about an e-mail circulated that depicts him as a bigot. A few days later, Derengowski met with campus administrative leaders about the issue. He said the meeting revolved around his teaching and his website. He said his syllabus was "nixed" by the administration as they stressed a need for neutrality.



    Read more: http://www.star-telegram.com/2011/12...#ixzz1gQBqQhiP


    I would have LOVED to have been in that classroom on that day!

  2. #2
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    "cults using sex to manipulate and says examples can be found "in nearly every other cult which are sometimes seen as respectable, conservative, or peaceful religious ins utions, whether it be Islam, Mormonism, or Roman Catholicism." "

    hmm, so the Catholic Church and Mohammedism are "cults", but "Catholic protesting" man-made spinoffs like Baptists, Methodists, Episcopaleans etc are One True Official Religions?

    "TCC approved the syllabus, so why is it an issue when we get to Islam?"

    maybe because the Catholics and Mormons the lecture are gutless and won't protest the professor denigrating their religions as cults?

  3. #3
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    Academia is chocked full of professors, lecturers, and administrators that openly disparage one group or another.

    I found a couple of the paragraphs telling;

    But critics said listing Islam as a cult can be interpreted as belittling the religion. "For some reason people feel they have a license to make disparaging remarks about Muslims," Carroll said.
    That "some reason" is called a long history of violently imposing their religion on others -- that continues to this day. Just today, a group of Islamic terrorists lobbed grenades into a crowd in front of the courthouse in Liege, Belgium -- apparently because that civilized society deigned to hold some Muslim accountable for an "honor killing."

    I think that could be "some reason" for disparaging the Muslim faith.

    The Nov. 8 classroom controversy erupted when Derengowski began explaining his source material for events about a Muslim raid during the prophet Muhammad's era. The Muslim students -- Bedair and a male student -- wanted to know the source material. Derengowski said his references included the Quran and a book about the life of Muhammad. That discussion ended with the two students apparently leaving and with the remaining students discussing how fearful they were about the developments.
    What was the book? Were his references to the Quran and book accurate? Of what developments were they fearful?

    Muslims don't play well with anyone but Muslims -- unless, everyone will do what they want.

    Conversion, Dhimmitude, or Death has been their mantra for a few centuries now.

  4. #4
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    "violently imposing their religion on others"

    you mean like Catholic Conquistadors slaughtering and imposing their religion on the New World natives?

    you mean like Christian missionaries aggressively proselytizing their flavor of Christianity just about everywhere? by providing medical help and food for suckering "natives" away from the traditional worldview into "superior" Christianity.

    Eastern religions (Hinduism, Buddhism) are about the only ones I know that DON'T forcibly proselytize.

    but Yoni selects only ALL Muslims, not just the criminal terrorists, as objects of his disapproval.

    Yoni, read the OT to see some really nasty stuff towards non-Jews.

  5. #5
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    "violently imposing their religion on others"

    you mean like Catholic Conquistadors slaughtering and imposing their religion on the New World natives?
    Exactly like that. So, when was that?

    you mean like Christian missionaries aggressively proselytizing their flavor of Christianity just about everywhere? by providing medical help and food for suckering "natives" away from the traditional worldview into "superior" Christianity.
    Well, that's pretty goddamned violent.

    Eastern religions (Hinduism, Buddhism) are about the only ones I know that DON'T forcibly proselytize.

    but Yoni selects only ALL Muslims, not just the criminal terrorists, as objects of his disapproval.
    What other religion condone VIOLENCE to achieve hegemony?

    Yoni, read the OT to see some really nasty stuff towards non-Jews.
    And, some pretty nasty stuff towards Jews, as well. But, again, when was that? Was it this morning in Belgium?

  6. #6
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Exactly like that. So, when was that?


    Well, that's pretty goddamned violent.


    What other religion condone VIOLENCE to achieve hegemony?


    And, some pretty nasty stuff towards Jews, as well. But, again, when was that? Was it this morning in Belgium?
    Translation:

    "Critiques of Islam: Totally justified and valid observations.

    Critiques of Christianity: Outrageous war on God by evil secularists."






    I see we are attempting to earn our Conservative Scout Hypocrisy Merit Badge.

  7. #7
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    What other religion condone VIOLENCE to achieve hegemony?
    *cough cough* Protestant reformation *cough* *cough*

  8. #8
    I play pretty, no? TeyshaBlue's Avatar
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    I see we are attempting to earn our Conservative Scout Hypocrisy Merit Badge.

  9. #9
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    Translation:

    "Critiques of Islam: Totally justified and valid observations.

    Critiques of Christianity: Outrageous war on God by evil secularists."
    Poor translation. Academia is full of Christian critics, as well.




    I see we are attempting to earn our Conservative Scout Hypocrisy Merit Badge.
    Well, at least you're funny.

  10. #10
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    *cough cough* Protestant reformation *cough* *cough*
    And, that occurred when? This morning in Belgium?

  11. #11
    Veteran cantthinkofanything's Avatar
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    Academia is chocked full of professors, lecturers, and administrators that openly disparage one group or another.
    LOL. Tarrant County College...Academia.

  12. #12
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Derengowski's course objectives state that after completing the class students will be able to explain and discuss major tenets of major world religions, provide firsthand understanding of two religions not tied to the student's current orientation, and "think critically about the truth, and the truth claims made by some of the major religions around the world, as well as some of the religious aberrations."
    Since when does religion have anything to do with truth?

  13. #13
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    It's not cool to make fun of Islam.


    That reminds me, is that Seattle cartoonist behind 'Everybody Draw Mohammed Day' still living underground?

  14. #14
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Did you draw Mohammed, Darrin?

  15. #15
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    Did you draw Mohammed, Darrin?
    Are you crazy?

  16. #16
    Displaced 101A's Avatar
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    What an idiot. From an academic standpoint, in a class like that, either all religions are, or are not, "cults".

    In the article, students who defend him simply illustrate how malleable, impressionable and naive the young adult mind is (an intentional shot across the bow toward all of you young adults in here).

  17. #17
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Why didn't you?

  18. #18
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    It's not cool to make fun of Islam.


    That reminds me, is that Seattle cartoonist behind 'Everybody Draw Mohammed Day' still living underground?
    I think it is the height of funny that you and Yoni are both using the secular tradition of the West's tolerance for critiques of its own faith as a contrast to that of Islam, and then turning around and complaining about that secular criticism of that faith.

    Funny in an ironic sort of way.

  19. #19
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    What an idiot. From an academic standpoint, in a class like that, either all religions are, or are not, "cults".
    I don't think he calls them a cult in his class material or syllabus.

    From the article:

    He said his website is a project of more than 20 years that doesn't conflict with his ability to teach his class.
    Implying to me, at least, the website isn't a part of his teaching.

    The Nov. 8 classroom controversy erupted when Derengowski began explaining his source material for events about a Muslim raid during the prophet Muhammad's era. The Muslim students -- Bedair and a male student -- wanted to know the source material. Derengowski said his references included the Quran and a book about the life of Muhammad. That discussion ended with the two students apparently leaving and with the remaining students discussing how fearful they were about the developments.
    The controversy didn't seem to originate from his calling Islam a cult on his website but from some disagreement over his sources for some other statement about Islam...one of which is the Quran and, another, some book the reporter fails to identify.

    That would have been a more relevant fact than what he is saying on his personal website.

  20. #20
    Displaced 101A's Avatar
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    I don't think he calls them a cult in his class material or syllabus.

    From the article:


    Implying to me, at least, the website isn't a part of his teaching.


    The controversy didn't seem to originate from his calling Islam a cult on his website but from some disagreement over his sources for some other statement about Islam...one of which is the Quran and, another, some book the reporter fails to identify.

    That would have been a more relevant fact than what he is saying on his personal website.
    I re-read the article. I believe I stand corrected.

  21. #21
    Veteran scott's Avatar
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    This is a good time to remind everyone that its the Atheists who are s.

  22. #22
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    Seriously, what did he say in a classroom setting -- sourced, by him, from the Quran and some unidentified book -- the article claims started the controversy that caused them to report on it?

    Seem to me to be a fundamental point that should be addressed in the article.

    On what grounds did the Muslim students disagree and what caused students, remaining after the Muslim students left, to be "fearful" of the developments?

  23. #23
    Veteran scott's Avatar
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    One thing is for certain, and that is that this article really doesn't tell us .

  24. #24
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    One thing is for certain, and that is that this article really doesn't tell us .
    Nope.

  25. #25
    above average height mavs>spurs's Avatar
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    When I went to TCC I had an afghan professor who loved George Bush. Go figure.

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