Porn for Bonner Fans - Spurs vs. Nuggets Pregame Thoughts

[DPG21920]

[Kori Ellis]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/glossary.html

"Defensive Rating (available since the 1977-78 season in the NBA); for players and teams it is points allowed per 100 posessions. This rating was developed by Dean Oliver, author of Basketball on Paper. I will point you to Dean's book for complete details."


You're welcome.

It's an ESTIMATE of points allowed per 100 possessions, based on his formula. His formula gives you bonuses for things like blocks, steals, etc. and it takes away from you for things like fouls, etc.

The stat on 82games.com is just a straight up stat -- how many points were allowed per 100 possessions while the guy was on the floor. The stat on basketball-reference.com is an ESTIMATE of points allowed per 100 possessions created by Oliver's formula (which accounts for things like blocks, steals, fouls, etc.)

Seriously, I'm not trying to be a b1tch, just read around the internet (or pick up that book) and you'll see it's a formula based on a lot of factors.

[itzsoweezee]

As you can see at 82games.com, Bonner allows 93.9 points per 100 possessions. That's not an estimate; that's a fact.

Lol, you're not even right about this "fact."

It says right on the page you cited: "Many stats are shown on a 'per 48 minute' basis"

[DPG21920]

Lol, you're not even right about this "fact."

It says right on the page you cited: "Many stats are shown on a 'per 48 minute' basis"

[itzsoweezee]

It's an ESTIMATE of points allowed per 100 possessions, based on his formula. His formula gives you bonuses for things like blocks, steals, etc. and it takes away from you for things like fouls, etc.

The stat on 82games.com is just a straight up stat -- how many points were allowed per 100 possessions while the guy was on the floor. The stat on basketball-reference.com is an ESTIMATE of points allowed per 100 possessions created by Oliver's formula (which accounts for things like blocks, steals, fouls, etc.)

Defensive Rating= Points allowed*100/possessions

That's a quote from Oliver's own article. http://www.powerbasketball.com/theywin2.html

[timvp]

Lol, you are a moron. I even connected the ing dots for you.

What don't you understand? WTF?

Click the link I gave you. Scroll down and look at Matt Bonner's "Defense: Pts per 100 Poss."

If you don't believe that, go here:

http://www.nba.com/statistics/plusmi...t=9&team=Spurs

Then divide Bonner's points allowed by his minutes, multiply by 48 minutes and then adjust for pace to get it to 100 possessions. Hint: you'll come up with the same number available at 82games.com.

Again, the number on basketball-reference.com is calculated with rebounds, blocks, steals, fouls, etc. and is an ESTIMATE of how many points he's allowing per 100 possessions. But there's no reason to use an estimate when the actual stat is available.





I know Bonner haters are rabid but damn this is amazing

[timvp]

Lol, you're not even right about this "fact."

It says right on the page you cited: "Many stats are shown on a 'per 48 minute' basis"

Do you not see words such as "many" and "estimate"? The stats below that in the table are per 48 minutes. That one specifically says per 100 possessions.

[timvp]

Do you not see words such as "many" and "estimate"? The stats below that in the table are per 48 minutes. That one specifically says per 100 possessions.

[jeebus]

EDIT: oh , MSpaint has been unleashed. It just got serious.

[Kori Ellis]

Defensive Rating= Points allowed*100/possessions

That's a quote from Oliver's own article. http://www.powerbasketball.com/theywin2.html

Correct. And to him "Points allowed" is the result of his formula.

[itzsoweezee]

That's not the basketball-reference version of defensive rating. Read where it says "estimate" based on stats.

Got damn hilarious.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/glossary.html

"Defensive Rating (available since the 1977-78 season in the NBA); for players and teams it is points allowed per 100 posessions. This rating was developed by Dean Oliver, author of Basketball on Paper. I will point you to Dean's book for complete details."

[WeNeedLength]

Bonner doesn't suck at defense, Bonner does suck at defense. Which one do you think Spurstalk will argue for? That's what I thought. Complete fluke of stats except for only one reason I can think of. We have not seen nearly as much Turd Towers as we did last season so whoever Bonner is paired up with doesn't suck nearly as bad as Blair does on defense.

[Kori Ellis]

You aren't getting it. The guy made up a formula to determine what "Points allowed" is.

His formula takes into account, blocks, steals, fouls, etc.
His formula is an estimate (in his mind) of points allowed.

It's not necessarily a bad stat... it's just not = actual points allowed.

[DeadlyDynasty]

[DPG21920]

Timvp being trolled. Message from Itzso

itzsoweezee 5:35 p.m. 01/07/2012

Hey dpg, watch the Timvp pre-game thread. I'm going to mess with him lol

[DPG21920]

Strong case for top 20 AP poll imo

[itzsoweezee]

Correct. And to him "Points allowed" is the result of his formula.

"Points divided by possessions times 100. Also called simply "Rating", "Offensive Rating" for points scored per 100 possessions, or "Defensive Rating" for points allowed per 100 possessions."

[WeNeedLength]

Timvp being trolled. Message from Itzso

[Kori Ellis]

According to Oliver's formula:

DRtg=TMDRtg+.2*[100*DPtsPerScPoss*(1-Stop%)-TMDRtg]
where
TMDRtg=(Points allowed*100)/Possessions

DPtsPerScPoss=Points scored per opponents' scoring possessions

Stop%=Individual defensive stops/stops+defensive scoring possessions (this is the stat that accounts for blocks, steals, etc.)

[Kori Ellis]

Any other questions?

[DPG21920]

Kori, not you too

[timvp]

Defensive Rating= Points allowed*100/possessions

Okay, bro, then let's do that exercise.

http://www.nba.com/statistics/plusmi...t=9&team=Spurs

Bonner has given up 225 points in 131.5 minutes.

225 divided by 131.5 = 1.71 points per minute Bonner is giving up

1.71 multiplied by 48 minutes = 82.1 points Bonner is giving up per game

http://espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/tea...ort/paceFactor

In that link, you can see the Spurs average 93.5 possessions per 48 minutes.

82.1 divided by 93.5 multiplied by 100 = 87.8 points per 100 possessions

Adjust that 87.8 to account for the slower pace that the team plays at with Bonner on the court and you get the original number from 82games.com.

Apology, once again, accepted.

If you think the Spurs give up 104 points per 100 possessions with Bonner on the court ... I have no idea what to tell you at this point.

[timvp]

According to Oliver's formula:

DRtg=TMDRtg+.2*[100*DPtsPerScPoss*(1-Stop%)-TMDRtg]
where
TMDRtg=(Points allowed*100)/Possessions

DPtsPerScPoss=Points scored per opponents' scoring possessions

Stop%=Individual defensive stops/stops+defensive scoring possessions (this is the stat that accounts for blocks, steals, etc.)

Ah shyt, game over.

[DPG21920]

itzso bursting onto the scene son.

[Bruno]

Bonner is playing against bench players who aren't, most of the time, as good offensive players as starters.