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  1. #1
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    Proposed: We should tax lobbying expenditures at a 100% rate. Meaning, for every dollar spent lobbying, you pay $1 federal tax. Open to suggestions on how this works at the state level as well.

    Thoughts?

  2. #2
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    Most likely would rein in more little fish than big ones, who can better afford it.

  3. #3
    i hunt fenced animals clambake's Avatar
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    the increase would be passed to us.

  4. #4
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    they would invent a practice akin to lobbying, but with a subtly different scheme of incorporation and funding not covered by lobbying laws, and try to pass lobbying off as some other activity. they could even call it "the history department"

  5. #5
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    For a few $M in lobbbying expenses, the payback can be in the $Bs and forever, so taxing lobbying a 100% wouldn't even slow it down.

  6. #6
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    what would the money raised by such a tax be for?

  7. #7
    i hunt fenced animals clambake's Avatar
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    what would the money raised by such a tax be for?
    victory celebrations!

  8. #8
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    Most likely would rein in more little fish than big ones, who can better afford it.
    Good point. Maybe a tiered system. First $xxx tax free, then dollar for dollar after xxx, then 300% after xxxx, etc.

    what would the money raised by such a tax be for?
    An offset to tax breaks for small businesses and companies hiring American workers would be a nice start.

  9. #9
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    thing is, incentives are useless if the prospects are sh!tty. if businesses don't expect demand to grow, it doesn't make sense to hire regardless of tax breaks.

  10. #10
    $200 cash 4>0rings's Avatar
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    "corporations are people my friend"

  11. #11
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    ^^^ apparent non sequitur

  12. #12
    Believe.
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    The solution to that is simple. Make it a corporate tax. If the Koch duo wants to withdraw funds to their person to do so then thats fine by me. Makes it easier to tax as its not deductible.

    The recent SCOTUS ruling would not impact because SCOTUS just said that because the press got freedom of speech then because 'persons' get equal protection then so do the others by virtue of not being able to delineate between them. The press does a horrible job of explaining it so people misunderstand what SCOTUS actually said.

    SCOTUS does have a long history of delineating between the rights granted to people vs persons vs person. A corporate tax should pass muster unless they say it impinges their freedom of speech but all manner of transmissions are taxed so it would have a shot if nothing else.

  13. #13
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    SCOTUS just said that because the press got freedom of speech then because 'persons' get equal protection then so do the others by virtue of not being able to delineate between them. The press does a horrible job of explaining it so people misunderstand what SCOTUS actually said.
    Where, please? Are you talking about Citizen's United?

    If so, a quote would be nice; if not, do please share your implicit theme...

  14. #14
    Believe.
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    Where, please? Are you talking about Citizen's United?

    If so, a quote would be nice; if not, do please share your implicit theme...
    Its the Supreme Court Decision from two winters ago.

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/08-205.ZS.html

    There is Kennedy's opinion.

    He specifically references

    The Court has recognized that the First Amendment applies to corporations, e.g., First Nat. Bank of Boston v. Bellotti , 435 U. S. 765
    to justify his extension of first amendment rights to but by to extension point out he is not starting a new precedent and he continues

    All speakers, including individuals and the media, use money amassed from the economic marketplace to fund their speech, and the First Amendment protects the resulting speech. Under the antidistortion rationale, Congress could also ban political speech of media corporations. Although currently exempt from §441b, they ac ulate wealth with the help of their corporate form, may have aggregations of wealth, and may express views “hav[ing] little or no correlation to the public’s support” for those views. Differential treatment of media corporations and other corporations cannot be squared with the First Amendment , and there is no support for the view that the Amendment’s original meaning would permit suppressing media corporations’ political speech.
    I happen to agree with his position. The problem is the press and the public attempt to distort this particular ruling into some new ground breaking application of corporate freedom. For example wikipedia fixates on the comment

    If the First Amendment has any force, it prohibits Congress from fining or jailing citizens, or associations of citizens, for simply engaging in political speech
    You understand the notion of context. The insinuation in every narrative it seems to be about how they equated citizens rights to corporate rights.

    Read the opinion, its short and to the point.

  15. #15
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Wouldn't it be discriminatory? Shouldn't all "persons", at least in theory, have the same access to elected officials?

  16. #16
    Believe.
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    Wouldn't it be discriminatory? Shouldn't all "persons", at least in theory, have the same access to elected officials?
    Thus the choice of the word person over the plural. You can discriminate between a person and persons but not between individual person or persons. Person is not the same thing as persons is not the same thing as people.

  17. #17
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    Read the opinion, its short and to the point.
    Already have.

    A long previous discussion about Citizen's United can be found here.

    I'm in basic agreement with you about personhood. The SC didn't rule on that.

  18. #18
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    That they did is mildly prevalent misconception.

  19. #19
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    the law overturned was frankly a POS, but if issue advertising was a firehose, now it's more like Niagara Falls

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