Grades: Spurs @ Jazz - Apr. 9

[TheSkeptic]

This was a winnable game but the Spurs executed poorly in the last few minutes. Pop made a mistake by sticking with Neal as the PG and didn't put Mills back into the game until there was a minute or two left. Neal was good for most of the game but the offense collapsed in the second half of the 4th. Bonner also had the most minutes of any big...baffling since the Jazz have a good frontline.

You know...the more I think about it the more inclined I am to say that the Spurs need to just make cuts to the roster already.

[Obstructed_View]

I have no idea what the "this" in your question means?

I'm talking about the second unit which was playing well, just like I said. You clearly seem to think that beating up on a ty team a few days ago makes everything okay.

It was Green, Bonner, Splitter, Jack and Neal that were the unit that was working well. Checking back, it looks like Green was actually starting back then. I'd have liked to see that group get some burn when they needed to win. That group played pretty well. Do you disagree?

And do you believe Jack has replaced Kawhi in the SL based upon last night?

Why would anyone think that? That's not just a strawman, that's a strawspaceman.

[callo1]

Neal made critical blunders when the game was on the line. A- is very generous...I think he should get a B.

Bonner's grade may have been higher if he had received the ball when he was open.

Mills should have been running the point down the stretch. If we want to see what the kid has got, give him the opportunity. Neal is not a point guard.

Jack had the opportunity to lead, but failed to do so. I expected more.

Leonard is a stud...the faster Pop and the team realizes this the better. Give him the ball and let him make plays.

Norris is beginning to remind me of Ian the human foul machine.

Had one of the big three played, that would have been a win.

[angelbelow]

@ calling out a 2nd year player for not being a leader on a team with the Big 3/Pop/Jack. It's hard to be considered a leader when Pop relegates you to 4th/5th big status, tbh.

And you really think Tiago should be getting technicals and shoving Al Jefferson around? You really think that would help his case of getting more playing time with Pop? He was one of the few guys battling for defensive boards and you complain about him not being aggressive enough. Like him getting a T or jawing at the officials is really gonna help him get more calls

Tiago was the best player on the team last night BY FAR and you were still dissappointed him. Solid take.

Mugen, I'm calling him out because I have high hopes for him. Watching him play and develop has been one of my favorite storylines this year. I'm critical of his weaknesses, not his strengths.

With that said, I absolutely thought he should have either verbally or physically retaliated against Al Jefferson. There are a lot of ways to take a shot at someone without blatantly pushing them (which is what Big Al did to Splitter) or getting a technical. Btw, watch Jackson on defense, he constantly throws out cheap shots at opponents.. reminds me of Bruce, Massenburg, Willis

How do you think players get calls from referee's on a consistent basis? IMO there are a few ways:

1. Be an Allstar +
2. Flop with the best of them (Ex. Chris Fall)
3. Build a relationship with the refs (this is something Parker, Ginobili have done expertly.)

Tiago has none of these because he doesn't sell his flops and he never talks to the refs. Is anyone really surprised that he doesn't get calls?

Regarding leadership: I believe that a leader takes action regardless of the cir stance and situation. They don't sit around waiting for opportunities to shine - take make their own opportunities.

Tiago has never been a leader and IMO he'll never be one however luckily Spurs don't need him as leader at least atm.

I slightly disagree about the statement game from him. He didn't play bad at all. If you check the grades again you'll see he got the best grade among our players although I thought timvp was quite generous as far as grade for Tiago. Don't you forget he only played 26 minutes and in the 4th quarter his teammates failed to pass the ball to him many times especially in the last minutes of the game. So it is obvious he doesn't get respect from refs as well as some of his teammates.

That is partial on Splitter. He should be demanding the ball because he's clearly our best/most consistent offensive player in a half court setting. This is where I really think he needs to be more assertive. Also, I think his teammates respect his skills, but aren't good play makers themselves. Other than Stephen Jackson executing a pick and roll with Splitter, everyone else just took a bad shot and failed to move the ball.

[Solid D]

Stephen Jackson D-
Back in 2003, Stephen Jackson was known to lay eggs from time to time. Tonight, he reminded us that he's still very much capable of having a horrible shooting night. With the Spurs leaning on him to produce, Jackson failed. Nothing was going for him -- be it layups, long two-pointers or open threes. To make things worse, Jackson got sloppy with the basketball and he was oftentimes out of position on the defensive end due to trying to do too much. It would have been foolish to think that Jackson wouldn't have his bad games from time to time, however this was a poorly timed egg-laying. Even a mediocre performance from him tonight would have been enough to get the job done.

D- = F+. Horrible game for Jack. I totally agree that Jack tried to do too much. Spot-on assessment! The best (or worst) example of that on the defensive end was on the Millsap follow-up slam off of Jefferson's missed j. Jefferson was clearly Tiago's man but Tiago didn't come out to defend Al so Jack moved over to contest Al's shot, leaving the rotation to the only weakside player, Danny Green. Green was guarding against the corner three and was left to try to get over to box out Millsap crashing from the right wing. No way.

There is no doubt that Pop has been on a quest to add more firepower ever since the Mavs shut down the lane on the Spurs, neutering TP in the 2009 playoffs. Pop and RC have added that firepower but the new additions still need a good floor leader and that firepower can still get tired legs and miss shots from time to time.

I feel very good about the Spurs' prospects for the playoffs and Pop's shelving of his Big 3 was a mature and wise plan. At least he's trying to learn from the past in some ways.

[Mel_13]

Why would anyone think that? That's not just a strawman, that's a strawspaceman.

It wasn't a strawman at all. I had no idea you were talking about Green. He's been in the SL since Feb 8th. I assumed you were talking about something much more recent. I believe the second unit has remained effective over the past two months.

[TheSkeptic]

Mugen, I'm calling him out because I have high hopes for him. Watching him play and develop has been one of my favorite storylines this year. I'm critical of his weaknesses, not his strengths.

With that said, I absolutely thought he should have either verbally or physically retaliated against Al Jefferson. There are a lot of ways to take a shot at someone without blatantly pushing them (which is what Big Al did to Splitter) or getting a technical. Btw, watch Jackson on defense, he constantly throws out cheap shots at opponents.. reminds me of Bruce, Massenburg, Willis

How do you think players get calls from referee's on a consistent basis? IMO there are a few ways:

1. Be an Allstar +
2. Flop with the best of them (Ex. Chris Fall)
3. Build a relationship with the refs (this is something Parker, Ginobili have done expertly.)

Tiago has none of these because he doesn't sell his flops and he never talks to the refs. Is anyone really surprised that he doesn't get calls?

Regarding leadership: I believe that a leader takes action regardless of the cir stance and situation. They don't sit around waiting for opportunities to shine - take make their own opportunities.



That is partial on Splitter. He should be demanding the ball because he's clearly our best/most consistent offensive player in a half court setting. This is where I really think he needs to be more assertive. Also, I think his teammates respect his skills, but aren't good play makers themselves. Other than Stephen Jackson executing a pick and roll with Splitter, everyone else just took a bad shot and failed to move the ball.

Ok. That makes sense.

I'd wait until year 3 or 4 before pulling the "he's not a leader" card although I do agree that he's not one on this team at the moment.

The way he relates to the refs and his teammates honestly makes it seem to me like he's still adjusting to the NBA on a cultural level since his behaviour out there looks very international to me. Obviously he's more comfortable than last year but he's not fully settled imo. Still kind of tentative and not sure of himself.

Which, I think, is why he'll ask Tony or Manu to give him the ball but not be nearly as demonstrative with some of the others. And also why he would avoid getting into anything with Jefferson.

Having lived in a few different countries it's something I understand very well.

He's still proving himself somewhat and didn't really play last year so I wouldn't expect him to be up to speed on how reffing works here either. Your expectations on this front were just too high in my opinion.

The only solution really is to give it time.

As an aside, I completely believe SJax when he says he'll step it up against the Lakers. Judging by what I've seen on the Laker forums I really want the Spurs to win this game.

[BackHome]

First time I have not agreed with grades:

Neal - D
Green - D
Mills - D

[Obstructed_View]

It wasn't a strawman at all. I had no idea you were talking about Green. He's been in the SL since Feb 8th. I assumed you were talking about something much more recent. I believe the second unit has remained effective over the past two months.

Yeah, I shouldn't have called it a "second unit" since Green was in it, but now that we're all speaking the same language, I'd like to have seen that group get some burn last night at the end of the game, and I'd like to see them going forward at least when the team needs a spark.

[angelbelow]

Ok. That makes sense.

I'd wait until year 3 or 4 before pulling the "he's not a leader" card although I do agree that he's not one on this team at the moment.

The way he relates to the refs and his teammates honestly makes it seem to me like he's still adjusting to the NBA on a cultural level since his behaviour out there looks very international to me. Obviously he's more comfortable than last year but he's not fully settled imo. Still kind of tentative and not sure of himself.

Which, I think, is why he'll ask Tony or Manu to give him the ball but not be nearly as demonstrative with some of the others. And also why he would avoid getting into anything with Jefferson.

Having lived in a few different countries it's something I understand very well.

He's still proving himself somewhat and didn't really play last year so I wouldn't expect him to be up to speed on how reffing works here either. Your expectations on this front were just too high in my opinion.

The only solution really is to give it time.

As an aside, I completely believe SJax when he says he'll step it up against the Lakers. Judging by what I've seen on the Laker forums I really want the Spurs to win this game.

Sure, that's a fair take. Giving him a few more years to see if he develops some strong leadership habits is fine. But given his basketball background overseas, his lack of demonstrative body language, his preference to not speak up.. I just don't see a leader in the making. Remember, Tiago isn't your typical 2nd year - hes been a professional since the age of 15.

And again, this isn't a bad thing for the Spurs. We have plenty of guys who can fill the void, plus not everyone can be leaders. From a team perspective, he still fits wonderfully and is arguably our 4th best player. From an individual standpoint though, imagine how much higher his value would be if he played the political game as well.

[Mel_13]

Yeah, I shouldn't have called it a "second unit" since Green was in it, but now that we're all speaking the same language, I'd like to have seen that group get some burn last night at the end of the game, and I'd like to see them going forward at least when the team needs a spark.

Yeah, early on we saw units centered around Splitter, Bonner, and Green that were extremely effective. Not so much since Danny moved to the SL. It's something to look forward to when Pop inevitably moves Manu back to the SL.

[Mel_13]

Having lived in a few different countries it's something I understand very well.

Military related?

[therealtruth]

Sure, that's a fair take. Giving him a few more years to see if he develops some strong leadership habits is fine. But given his basketball background overseas, his lack of demonstrative body language, his preference to not speak up.. I just don't see a leader in the making. Remember, Tiago isn't your typical 2nd year - hes been a professional since the age of 15.

And again, this isn't a bad thing for the Spurs. We have plenty of guys who can fill the void, plus not everyone can be leaders. From a team perspective, he still fits wonderfully and is arguably our 4th best player. From an individual standpoint though, imagine how much higher his value would be if he played the political game as well.

You would think a Spanish League MVP would have some leadership skills. It's ridiculous the way the Spurs have treated him giving his winning credentials. They would have been better off making the starting spot his to lose. I mean if T. Chandler comes to this team does Pop bring him off the bench as slowly as he's brought Splitter along?

[Obstructed_View]

Yeah, early on we saw units centered around Splitter, Bonner, and Green that were extremely effective. Not so much since Danny moved to the SL. It's something to look forward to when Pop inevitably moves Manu back to the SL.

Fingers crossed on that.

[TheSkeptic]

Sure, that's a fair take. Giving him a few more years to see if he develops some strong leadership habits is fine. But given his basketball background overseas, his lack of demonstrative body language, his preference to not speak up.. I just don't see a leader in the making. Remember, Tiago isn't your typical 2nd year - hes been a professional since the age of 15.

And again, this isn't a bad thing for the Spurs. We have plenty of guys who can fill the void, plus not everyone can be leaders. From a team perspective, he still fits wonderfully and is arguably our 4th best player. From an individual standpoint though, imagine how much higher his value would be if he played the political game as well.

Oh I do know he's not your typical 2nd year. It's just that having watched the Raptors quite a bit (we had Calderon, Bargnani, Garbajosa, etc. Backgrounds not so different from Tiago's imo), most of them acted the same way until they were 1. Comfortable with the league 2. Comfortable with their teammates 3. Felt like they'd earned a spot as part of the team and that they had the support of the coach. The first two, today, are leaders on that team.

You didn't see them leading and rocking the boat all that much before that point. They took their cues from the coaching staff, they were careful to avoid showing emotion, and except when they played with each other you didn't usually see them asking for the ball or shouldering responsibilities to the extent that Tiago has at times.

All things considered, Tiago's probably ahead of them a little bit because at least in a normal game with Tony or Manu he gets the ball when he's calling for it despite playing less. And I thought a few guys like Leonard tried to get it to him last game as well so other than the Coach and his minute distribution he's about where I'd expect him to be respect and team-wise.

Right now I want him to show that he wants to win and he's done that so I'm mostly fine with where he is. And besides, you don't become MVP without *some* leadership skills.

I agree. On this team he really doesn't need to be and I think he admires Tim to the point where he's not going to be playing the politics until he's more acclimated to the NBA and even then he might not lead to a full extent. Just my opinion.

Military related?

No. Tagging along with my parents. I'm only 20.

[Mel_13]

No. Tagging along with my parents. I'm only 20.

Never would have guessed. You're younger than my daughter.

Feeling my age now.

[Mugen]

Mel...

[Mel_13]

Mel...

[Reck]

Mel...

I doubt both parties are unwilling though....











Kidding.

[Mugen]

Mugen, I'm calling him out because I have high hopes for him. Watching him play and develop has been one of my favorite storylines this year. I'm critical of his weaknesses, not his strengths.

With that said, I absolutely thought he should have either verbally or physically retaliated against Al Jefferson. There are a lot of ways to take a shot at someone without blatantly pushing them (which is what Big Al did to Splitter) or getting a technical. Btw, watch Jackson on defense, he constantly throws out cheap shots at opponents.. reminds me of Bruce, Massenburg, Willis

How do you think players get calls from referee's on a consistent basis? IMO there are a few ways:

1. Be an Allstar +
2. Flop with the best of them (Ex. Chris Fall)
3. Build a relationship with the refs (this is something Parker, Ginobili have done expertly.)

Tiago has none of these because he doesn't sell his flops and he never talks to the refs. Is anyone really surprised that he doesn't get calls?

Regarding leadership: I believe that a leader takes action regardless of the cir stance and situation. They don't sit around waiting for opportunities to shine - take make their own opportunities.



That is partial on Splitter. He should be demanding the ball because he's clearly our best/most consistent offensive player in a half court setting. This is where I really think he needs to be more assertive. Also, I think his teammates respect his skills, but aren't good play makers themselves. Other than Stephen Jackson executing a pick and roll with Splitter, everyone else just took a bad shot and failed to move the ball.

Fair enough. I don't think Tiago will ever be the kind of guy that throws cheap shots or retaliates. I think he's a lot like Manu in that regard who just brushes off the hits and then uses it as motivation.

I actually think Tiago sells his flops pretty well. Last year, he flopped too often in his limited time and i think that's partly why the officials don't respect him as much. I think the more time he gets, the more he progresses, the more calls he'll be able to get.

I don't see a "leader" in Tiago as well. i don't think it's in his personality and there's nothing wrong with that, especially with this team. But there have been times where he's demanded the ball. i think TP had a quote earlier in the season about Tiago demanding the ball so I dont think you have to wonder whether he is engaged or compe ive in that regard.

[TheSkeptic]

Fair enough. I don't think Tiago will ever be the kind of guy that throws cheap shots or retaliates. I think he's a lot like Manu in that regard who just brushes off the hits and then uses it as motivation.

I actually think Tiago sells his flops pretty well. Last year, he flopped too often in his limited time and i think that's partly why the officials don't respect him as much. I think the more time he gets, the more he progresses, the more calls he'll be able to get.

I don't see a "leader" in Tiago as well. i don't think it's in his personality and there's nothing wrong with that, especially with this team. But there have been times where he's demanded the ball. i think TP had a quote earlier in the season about Tiago demanding the ball so I dont think you have to wonder whether he is engaged or compe ive in that regard.

It's been a day later and your avatar is still killing me.

I see where you're coming from in the sense that he does seem to be more good-natured and unassuming but I just don't believe you can be a Regular Season & Finals MVP while having no leadership abilities at all. The Spurs just have an established power structure that Tiago's closer to the bottom of and I think that's what it comes down to.

Unless you put him in charge of the second unit and eventually start him sometime in the future I don't think he'll show/develop that side while on this team either though.

Send him somewhere like the 76ers or the Rockets (oh the bitterness if that happened), let him adjust, and give him regular minutes as well as the ball, and I think he'd surprise us with his abilities. Nothing concrete but having watched a few players come in from Europe and go through this that's my feeling on Tiago.

[angelbelow]

Fair enough. I don't think Tiago will ever be the kind of guy that throws cheap shots or retaliates. I think he's a lot like Manu in that regard who just brushes off the hits and then uses it as motivation.

I actually think Tiago sells his flops pretty well. Last year, he flopped too often in his limited time and i think that's partly why the officials don't respect him as much. I think the more time he gets, the more he progresses, the more calls he'll be able to get.

I don't see a "leader" in Tiago as well. i don't think it's in his personality and there's nothing wrong with that, especially with this team. But there have been times where he's demanded the ball. i think TP had a quote earlier in the season about Tiago demanding the ball so I dont think you have to wonder whether he is engaged or compe ive in that regard.

Agreed on Manu not resorting to cheap shots. But that's because he plays a different game, one that's psychological. Additionally, Manu put in his time and built respectable relationships with most of the referees. Which contributes to his mind games and flopping.

The quote that you're referring to regarding Tiago demanding the ball was pretty celebrated around here. I for one was really happy to see him talking about being more assertive. But he's inconsistent and I thought it was noticeable in the 4th. With his b-ball IQ, he should be more vocal when hes on the court. Directing traffic, calling for the ball, keeping players focused, correcting in game mistakes etc, etc.

Oh I do know he's not your typical 2nd year. It's just that having watched the Raptors quite a bit (we had Calderon, Bargnani, Garbajosa, etc. Backgrounds not so different from Tiago's imo), most of them acted the same way until they were 1. Comfortable with the league 2. Comfortable with their teammates 3. Felt like they'd earned a spot as part of the team and that they had the support of the coach. The first two, today, are leaders on that team.

Personally don't like any of the players you mentioned because I think they're all soft. Calderon gave up after he got his contract, Garbajosa gave up and went back to Spain.

The Raptors have lacked leadership for years. From the ownership, to the management, to the coaching all the way down to the players.

You didn't see them leading and rocking the boat all that much before that point. They took their cues from the coaching staff, they were careful to avoid showing emotion, and except when they played with each other you didn't usually see them asking for the ball or shouldering responsibilities to the extent that Tiago has at times.

How about guys like Marc Gasol, Luis Scola, Anderson Varejao, Danilo Gallinari, Nikola Pekovic? Their backgrounds are also similar to Tiago's. Granted, a few of them went to weak teams and had minutes available to them asap, but the point is that they were all able to carve an immediately niche. I thought that Tiago had such an opportunity against the Jazz with the big 3 out. IMO, given the cir stances, he was more passive than I would have liked to see.

I agree. On this team he really doesn't need to be and I think he admires Tim to the point where he's not going to be playing the politics until he's more acclimated to the NBA and even then he might not lead to a full extent. Just my opinion.

Politics in terms of building respectful relationships with the referees, not within the team (that would be risky ).

No. Tagging along with my parents. I'm only 20.

Then how much could you've possibly seen or observe? I'm young too (25) so I don't mean to target your age but its hard to pick up on cultural habits in limited amount of time. I don't really buy the cultural difference being the reason why Tiago is passive. Leaders, especially the good ones, have a knack for it and do it spontaneously. So if Tiago already had strong leadership skills, they would be oozing out of him. He probably won't change much in 2 or 3 years but that's okay.

[skin]

I was talking about the two Utah games. One big was rested in each game. Diaw took the place of the missing big in each game allowing the other three bigs to remain in their normal rotation spots.

I understand your point, respect it but I disagree. Diaw is 6-8 (2.03). He can't play as 5 when you've got a skilled 6-11 (2.11) to play with.

Tiago is struggling with confidence issues?

Did you watch FIBA Americas Championship? I did manage to watch few games and I can tell you. Tiago was terrible. Awful. If you think harder you'll remember this Championship was a couple of months after his first year in the league.

How do you think players get calls from referee's on a consistent basis? IMO there are a few ways:

Tiago has none of these because he doesn't sell his flops and he never talks to the refs. Is anyone really surprised that he doesn't get calls?

That is partial on Splitter. He should be demanding the ball because he's clearly our best/most consistent offensive player in a half court setting. This is where I really think he needs to be more assertive. Also, I think his teammates respect his skills, but aren't good play makers themselves. Other than Stephen Jackson executing a pick and roll with Splitter, everyone else just took a bad shot and failed to move the ball.

Have you ever heard his interviews in Spanish or Portuguese? He sounds genuinely humble and shy. I don't think he's gonna sell his flops and talk to the refs unless someone talks to him and explain it. It should've been done by one of the big 3 but I do think Sjax may be this person.

Outside of the Big 3 the only teammate that seems aware of his PNR skills is Sjax.

For a shy person being assertive/agressive isn't easy at all. That's where he needs Pop pushing him to the limit as well as giving him confidence. I've got a theory which I know will make some people laugh at me but anyway, pay attention a couple of games before laughing. He is giving us 5.2 rebounds per game which isn't a great mark for a center at all. If he were more agressive/selfish he could've been giving us around 9 RPG. Maybe even more than that. How? Pay attention when he jumps for a defensive rebound. If there's a teammate disputing the same ball he won't contest it even though he's taller, stronger and that's his job. On the other hand top rebounders have no mercy on teammates. D12 runs over teammates. Love, Varejao and others do exactly the same.

[TheSkeptic]

Personally don't like any of the players you mentioned because I think they're all soft. Calderon gave up after he got his contract, Garbajosa gave up and went back to Spain.

The Raptors have lacked leadership for years. From the ownership, to the management, to the coaching all the way down to the players.

They're not tough like Oakley but you've got both of those situations wrong. Calderon's been playing pretty well lately he just tore his hammy after getting the contract.

Garbajosa didn't give up he broke his leg and then refused to not play for his national team. That in turn pissed off Colangelo and that's why he wasn't allowed back.

Agreed on the organization's leadership (that has been hard to watch). I'm just saying that those are examples of guys who started off passive and eventually grew into themselves.

The level of leadership you see from those guys is about what I'd be expecting from Tiago. Which granted, isn't what you'd be used to watching the Spurs, but it's not quite worth giving up over.

How about guys like Marc Gasol, Luis Scola, Anderson Varejao, Danilo Gallinari, Nikola Pekovic? Their backgrounds are also similar to Tiago's. Granted, a few of them went to weak teams and had minutes available to them asap, but the point is that they were all able to carve an immediately niche. I thought that Tiago had such an opportunity against the Jazz with the big 3 out. IMO, given the cir stances, he was more passive than I would have liked to see.

Great examples (can't believe I forgot Marc Gasol).
Thing is, they also went through similar things in that they had to get comfortable with the league, comfortable with their teammates, and feel like they were a part of the team before they started getting vocal. At that I still wouldn't consider a guy like Gallo to be a leader in the sense you're describing.

Politics in terms of building respectful relationships with the referees, not within the team (that would be risky ).

Gotcha.

Then how much could you've possibly seen or observe? I'm young too (25) so I don't mean to target your age but its hard to pick up on cultural habits in limited amount of time. I don't really buy the cultural difference being the reason why Tiago is passive. Leaders, especially the good ones, have a knack for it and do it spontaneously. So if Tiago already had strong leadership skills, they would be oozing out of him. He probably won't change much in 2 or 3 years but that's okay.

Part of it is just that I'm really quick at picking up patterns. I'm also mentally old for my age so I tend to just catch things that people aren't always able to see. The rest of it is through experience.

Quick summary:

I've lived in 3 different countries (2 continents), was born in sub-Saharan Africa, and have grown up interacting with Egyptians, Koreans, Chinese, Thais, people from the Philippines, East Indians, North Americans, South Americans, Brits, Germans, Australians, First Nations people, Africans from other countries, and people from like Trinidad and Jamaica on a regular basis. That's without taking the whole first generation - second generation issue into account and I have a lot of experience with that too.

Put simply, I've learned how to pick up on different cultures and blend in as much as possible. I've been doing it since grade school and it's easy for me to recognize when someone's still working to get comfortable.

That said, I'm not talking leadership in the Tim Duncan sense of the term. In that respect, definitely not.

But what you're talking about with just directing people, demanding the ball, showing teammates where to be, etc. That's all within range once Tiago gets more comfortable. At this point he's just not there yet and I don't know that he'll ever be while on this team unless he's explicitly given more responsibility.

He's definitely a quieter/more passive personality but he's compe ive and he's a soldier. If the coach (or Duncan) tells him to be more assertive he'll do it. He just seems like a shy and non-confrontational individual.

I'd be giving up completely on it, but if you see him on the court with teammates he's more comfortable with he relaxes some and is fine asking for the ball and telling people what to do. See: Manu's cut or playing with Tony.

He's shown himself to be a guy that needs time to adjust to things and I'm not sure why that wouldn't apply to dealing with officials and the sorting out more of the nuances associated with his teammates and playing in the NBA. This is essentially his rookie season and I don't think he looks fully settled in although he's definitely better than last time. I'll say it again: your expectations were too high.

Whoops: Pay special attention to what Skin is saying.

[angelbelow]

Have you ever heard his interviews in Spanish or Portuguese? He sounds genuinely humble and shy. I don't think he's gonna sell his flops and talk to the refs unless someone talks to him and explain it. It should've been done by one of the big 3 but I do think Sjax may be this person.

No I haven't. But I don't get the impression that hes shy from his recent interviews. And those are done in English, which is a 2nd or 3rd language of his too, therefore I would imagine that he would seem shy or nervous. But I didn't get that at from him. Somethings to watch for in interviews: eye contract with the interviewer, using your body language to acknowledge the question, pausing before answering the question, keeping answers short/concise and to the point, smiling and joking are great ways to evaluate an interviewee's confidence. Tiago does the majority of those things well. So, I've never gotten the impression that he wasn't confident - just that hes content to be passive on court.

Outside of the Big 3 the only teammate that seems aware of his PNR skills is Sjax.

Neal is improving but still misses him quite a few times. TJ Ford was pretty beastly too; showed off some beautiful pick and rolls with Tiago.

For a shy person being assertive/agressive isn't easy at all. That's where he needs Pop pushing him to the limit as well as giving him confidence. I've got a theory which I know will make some people laugh at me but anyway, pay attention a couple of games before laughing. He is giving us 5.2 rebounds per game which isn't a great mark for a center at all. If he were more agressive/selfish he could've been giving us around 9 RPG. Maybe even more than that. How? Pay attention when he jumps for a defensive rebound. If there's a teammate disputing the same ball he won't contest it even though he's taller, stronger and that's his job. On the other hand top rebounders have no mercy on teammates. D12 runs over teammates. Love, Varejao and others do exactly the same.

I don't have any complaints about his rebounding. He's much tougher on the boards than I expected tbh. Statistically hes the 2nd best rebounder on the team, and I do believe the games reflect that when I watch him. He's certainly not a ferocious rebounder but I like what I see from him.