Public Option

[CosmicCowboy]

With land is tricky, because it's not a portable asset. It would basically be priced out of whatever market is there. Eventually, though, the price will come down simply because there will be no buyers willing to pay that price, so the realistic value of the property just isn't there anymore.

Now, gold or other currencies... that's a different story.

I didn't do the inflation calculation but I know that we sold a ranch 4 years ago for $5000 an acre that we paid $300 an acre for in the 60's.

[101A]

Simple, I am currently paying $90,000 a year for employee health insurance. I will cancel their health insurance, give them enough of a raise to cover their part of the premiums (cost me about $20,000) under Obamacare and let you guys pick up the tab the rest of their premium. I buy myself a cadillac insurance plan and still put 50K back in my pocket.

Why are you doing this NOW? Prior to Obamacare there was no mandate to purchase healthcare for your employees, or subsidize it whatsoever. You, ostensibly, provided this benefit to help attract/retain good employees. What has changed in that regard? If anything, given the cost benefits associated with group vs. individual insurance plans - and with EVERY person now required to cover themselves and their families. By taking your ball and going home, you could FORCE valuable employees to look for work elsewhere ; in order to find the most affordable coverage for themselves.

[CosmicCowboy]

Why are you doing this NOW? Prior to Obamacare there was no mandate to purchase healthcare for your employees, or subsidize it whatsoever. You, ostensibly, provided this benefit to help attract/retain good employees. What has changed in that regard? If anything, given the cost benefits associated with group vs. individual insurance plans - and with EVERY person now required to cover themselves and their families. By taking your ball and going home, you could FORCE valuable employees to look for work elsewhere ; in order to find the most affordable coverage for themselves.

Are you serious? Yeah, I'm paying for insurance for my employees because it's the right thing to do. It looks like the obamaqcare insurance will be even better than what I can afford and the federal government picks up the bulk of the premium. My employees still get insurance that costs them nothing, it's just the taxpayers that pay for it now instead of me.

[Wild Cobra]

I can't blame you at all CC. This is the type of thing we talked about when this all began. Employers forcing the employees on the option government run healthcare.

I wonder how many employers total will do this, and how much our deficits will increase?

[ElNono]

I didn't do the inflation calculation but I know that we sold a ranch 4 years ago for $5000 an acre that we paid $300 an acre for in the 60's.

You're talking a period of stable, growing economy. We're talking hitting the fan, hyperinflation, etc.

[MannyIsGod]

Are you serious? Yeah, I'm paying for insurance for my employees because it's the right thing to do. It looks like the obamaqcare insurance will be even better than what I can afford and the federal government picks up the bulk of the premium. My employees still get insurance that costs them nothing, it's just the taxpayers that pay for it now instead of me.

I applaud you for what you do for your employees. If more people had your mindset we'd be better off.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I fail to see how the statute does not put undue burden on companies employing less than 50 people is some sort of anathema. Given all the windfall that large businesses have gotten I fail to see other than partisan bull why similar windfall to small entrepreneurs is bad.

If CC wants a cookie because he is currently buying his employees health insurance thats great but the vast majority of small business cannot afford to buy insurance at the current unregulated rates.

If that means that smaller companies such as his get less financial strain then great too. if he turns around and pays himself out from that $50k then he very well likely will fall into the category of those that will be seeing a tax increase and the same will happen if he decides to invest it because capital gains is also seeing a hike.

All I see is a GOP sycophant parroting the litany that this is going to see a tax hike on the middle class. I am just trying to figure out which specific part of the ACA is supposed to do this.

PPACA does not explicitly mandate an employer to offer employees acceptable health insurance. However, certain employers with at least 50 full-time equivalent employees will face penalties, beginning in 2014, if one or more of their full-time employees obtains a premium credit through an exchange.1 As described in greater detail below, an individual may be eligible for a premium credit either because the employer does not offer coverage or the employer offers coverage that is either not “affordable” or does not provide “minimum value.”

Currently the Medicare tax rate is a flat 2.9% on all wage income, with both the employer and the employee paying exactly one-half of this amount. Starting in 2013, the flat 2.9% Medicare tax will continue to apply to wages under $200,000 (or under $250,000 for married couples filing a joint return). There will be an additional 0.9% Medicare tax on wages over $200,000 ($250,000 for joint filers). This additional tax is to be withheld from wages, or if not withheld, it is to be paid directly by the employee. This additional Medicare tax also effects self-employed persons paying the self-employment tax.

HR 4872 modifies the health care act to impose the expanded 3.8% Medicare tax on investment income for people with income over $200,000 (or $250,000 for joint filers). Investment income for the purposes of the Medicare tax base would include interest, dividends, royalties, rent, passive activity income (such as income passed-through from partnerships and S-corporations), and gain from the sale of property. This additional Medicare tax is technically called the unearned income Medicare contribution tax.

and to the contrary:

Businesses employing 25 employees or less may become eligible for tax credits of up to 35% based on employer-paid health insurance premiums. Larger employers who fail to provide health insurance coverage may become liable for tax penalties.

[Nbadan]

You're talking a period of stable, growing economy. We're talking hitting the fan, hyperinflation, etc.

Landholders have taken a bath with this recession too.....I know my holding have and unless CC owns land in the oi/gas boom parts, he probably is too...

[Wild Cobra]

Landholders have taken a bath with this recession too.....I know my holding have and unless CC owns land in the oi/gas boom parts, he probably is too...

I disagree.

I would say many land speculators have taken a bath, but not those who invest in land for the long term.

[Nbadan]

I disagree.

I would say many land speculators have taken a bath, but not those who invest in land for the long term.

I don't speculate and my land value has taken a 30-40% hit....I, like CC, don't plan on selling anytime soon but it is somewhat discomforting to see your land holding depreciate so much....I wonder why speculators aren't picking up on reasonably cheap land...cash is king...

[Wild Cobra]

I don't speculate and my land value has taken a 30-40% hit....I, like CC, don't plan on selling anytime soon but it is somewhat discomforting to see your land holding depreciate so much....I wonder why speculators aren't picking up on reasonably cheap land...cash is king...

Well, if you don't speculate, and were foolish enough to buy during a false rise during a period of speculation, then you deserve what you have.

Last time I checked, average asking prices for land and houses was still 30% greater than the long term trend allowed for. That was some time though, and we are probably close to or at the prices land should be in most areas now.

[TeyshaBlue]

I don't speculate and my land value has taken a 30-40% hit....I, like CC, don't plan on selling anytime soon but it is somewhat discomforting to see your land holding depreciate so much....I wonder why speculators aren't picking up on reasonably cheap land...cash is king...

That's a good damn question. I know I could pick up rental properties for .40 on the dollar right now, but the ones I already own are driving me crazy,