The avante is preaching just doesn't work, I tried it once only because I had a massive crush on the chick since i was 17 and she was a 23 year old virgin so I thought she was "different." Needless to say, after a while things changed after being the best bf a girl could ask for for over a year, she got all en led and changed. hit the fan and I'll never go that route ever again, I mean I knew better but now there are no exceptions. Anyone saying you have to be an asshole or purposely hurt anyones feelings is putting on a false bravado front but you had better be alpha and not bend or break for anyone, be a man and take charge of that and if she doesn't like it well there's the door.