Powell endorses Obama again

[DMC]

Al Gore - 90%

"It's because he's black " is a pretty idiotic argument considering blacks overwhelmingly have supported Dems over the decades. It's even dumber considering 100% of whites from 1776 to 2008 voted for the white candidate and 100% of blacks voted for the white candidate from whenever-they-got-basic-human-rights-in-the-US to 2008.

Abstract thought seems to be a commodity around here.

Let me guide you back onto the ramp of enlightenment, grasshopper.

Black vote is a different topic.

Colin Powell has never represented the black vote. He's represented the GOP and says himself he's always been a republican and still is. That's not someone who follows the black vote. So, you have to take his endorsement (not his vote, but his endorsement) as something other than favoring the Democrat platform since their platform basically hasn't changed in comparison to the GOP. What has changed is that the candidate is now a black man, so it's reasonable to conclude then that were it a white man vs another white man, Powell would not have been emotionally shaken and it's therefore likely he wouldn't have endorsed the candidate then or now. He didn't endorse Bill Clinton and even said he wasn't a good fit for the JCS under that liberal administration. He campaigned for McCain and Bush 43. Hardly a stereotypical black voter (however that goes). However, he did endorse Obama who's arguably more liberal than Bill Clinton. The only difference, and as indicated by his emotional display, was that Obama is a black man and there is historical significance in electing the first black president.

I have not called Powell a racist, however to endorse someone who goes against your long held beliefs simply because he's of the same race would be called racism were it anyone else.

Spin that.

[DMC]

Do you work for Bill O'reilly...The No Spin factor that's actually built on Spin....how do you know that Extra Stout wasn't a real Laker fan troll masquerading as Spur fan to befriend you ....only to turnaround and use the information you shared with him against you...

can get real deep..just ask Donald Trump

I don't care who ES is. You are ES. Beyond that is irrelevant.

BTW, it's "The Factor" and I don't watch political talk shows.

[resistanze]

Abstract thought seems to be a commodity around here.

Let me guide you back onto the ramp of enlightenment, grasshopper.

Black vote is a different topic.

Colin Powell has never represented the black vote. He's represented the GOP and says himself he's always been a republican and still is. That's not someone who follows the black vote. So, you have to take his endorsement (not his vote, but his endorsement) as something other than favoring the Democrat platform since their platform basically hasn't changed in comparison to the GOP. What has changed is that the candidate is now a black man, so it's reasonable to conclude then that were it a white man vs another white man, Powell would not have been emotionally shaken and it's therefore likely he wouldn't have endorsed the candidate then or now. He didn't endorse Bill Clinton and even said he wasn't a good fit for the JCS under that liberal administration. He campaigned for McCain and Bush 43. Hardly a stereotypical black voter (however that goes). However, he did endorse Obama who's arguably more liberal than Bill Clinton. The only difference, and as indicated by his emotional display, was that Obama is a black man and there is historical significance in electing the first black president.

I have not called Powell a racist, however to endorse someone who goes against your long held beliefs simply because he's of the same race would be called racism were it anyone else.

Spin that.

Nothing requires spinning, really. Your position is based on your own conjecture that isn't substantiated by any fact except that you feel it is so.

If you choose not to take Powell's several reasons stated in the article for supporting Obama at face value, that's fine and totally up to you. But you have no evidence Powell is supporting it's because Obama is half-black. You're essentially playing the same race card I'm sure you'd be quick to point out if a black person claimed 'racism' or 'racial bias' against a white person in a situation without any evidence.

[DMC]

Nothing requires spinning, really. Your position is based on your own conjecture that isn't substantiated by any fact except that you feel it is so.

I laid it out clearly. I could get a prosecution in a court case if the jury understood the "beyond a reasonable doubt" concept. If you can tell a scenario where someone might cry tears of joy for the opposition, then come out and endorse them before they've done a single thing to show their abilities, and that opposition isn't racially connected, then I will reconsider.

If you choose not to take Powell's several reasons stated in the article for supporting Obama at face value, that's fine and totally up to you. But you have no evidence Powell is supporting it's because Obama is half-black. You're essentially playing the same race card I'm sure you'd be quick to point out if a black person claimed 'racism' or 'racial bias' against a white person in a situation without any evidence.

You're ignoring the fact that he endorsed Obama before Obama did anything after the first election. He was riding the wave of Nobel Peace Prize for being black. He also cried tears of joy after Obama was elected in 2008. That pretty much takes a on the reasons he continued to endorse him.

In fact, explain briefly why Powell cried when Obama won.

[resistanze]

Yes, you've laid out clearly. You reject Powell's stated reasons for supporting Obama and would rather go with your own conjecture based on your preoccupation with skin color.

Keep playing the race card.

[DMC]

Why did Powell cry when Obama won?

[resistanze]

I'm guessing he was happy. I think white people cried in 2008 too.

[DMC]

I'm guessing he was happy. I think white people cried in 2008 too.

Why was he happy? I didn't cry.

[resistanze]

Good thing no one said you cried. Many people did though.

[DMC]

Good thing no one said you cried. Many people did though.

You're being evasive and dancing around answering the question. Are you afraid to say "because Obama was the first black president"?

btw, I am a white person.

So why was Powell happy that Obama won to the point of crying about it if it wasn't about the historical significance for the black race?

[George Gervin's Afro]

so Powell states his case...and some are calling him a liar.. without any facts just their opinion...

[resistanze]

You're being evasive and dancing around answering the question. Are you afraid to say "because Obama was the first black president"?

btw, I am a white person.

So why was Powell happy that Obama won to the point of crying about it if it wasn't about the historical significance for the black race?

Not really, you're off on a tangent. Powell says he's voting Obama for the reasons stated in the OP. You reject his reasons stated above and have come up with your own based on race, something you cannot prove. You're playing the race card.

Why Powell or anyone else was crying in 2008 is irrelevant to your argument. One can even be emotional about Obama being the first black president and also vote for him due to policy reasons - the two are not mutually exclusive. So really, what is your point?

[DMC]

Not really, you're off on a tangent. Powell says he's voting Obama for the reasons stated in the OP. You reject his reasons stated above and have come up with your own based on race, something you cannot prove. You're playing the race card.

That's a cop out. I haven't played any race card and you're not even using that term correctly. Powell showed he was ready to endorse a guy who had done nothing as president, so why does it matter why he continues to endorse the same guy? Once a standard has been set, all else is just words on paper.

Why Powell or anyone else was crying in 2008 is irrelevant to your argument. One can even be emotional about Obama being the first black president and also vote for him due to policy reasons - the two are not mutually exclusive. So really, what is your point?

Now you're just floundering on the issue. I don't have the desire to find creative words to force you to admit that Powell cried because finally a black man was voted to be the POTUS. It had nothing to do with his policy. Generals don't cry because of the policy of a president-elect. It was because of the color of his skin. To argue otherwise is dishonest, and though you might attach a caveat of "the historical significance for the nation, not just the black people" that does not explain endorsement without a single act as president.

Once we've established that Powell will (did) endorse someone of the opposite party without them having done anything as POTUS, we can totally dismiss his reasons for continuing to endorse even if they are true. He did not need those reasons in 2008 yet endorsement was given so there was already a standard that Obama met for endorsement according to Colin Powell. Can you tell me what that standard was if it wasn't the color of his skin?

Sure you can say Obama had policies that Powell agreed with, but then why did Powell wait until Obama won before he endorsed him? Was he unaware of the policies? You can say that McCain's policies were too aggressive but then why did Powell campaign for McCain before? Why did Powell campaign for GWB who's policies were much more aggressive than McCain's?

You're running out of room here.

[DMC]

so Powell states his case...and some are calling him a liar.. without any facts just their opinion...

You haven't read the thread obviously. Why did Powell endorse Obama in 2008?

[George Gervin's Afro]

You haven't read the thread obviously. Why did Powell endorse Obama in 2008?

I will go on a limb and sya it wasn't because he was black. I will give Colin Powell the benefit of the doubt.

[DMC]

I will go on a limb and sya it wasn't because he was black. I will give Colin Powell the benefit of the doubt.

You didn't didn't answer the question. Why did Powell endorse Obama. Both of you have skirted answering that.

Are you saying that Powell's endorsement and the fact he cried when Obama won are unrelated? Do you honestly believe that? Because if you do, what you're saying is that Powell wanted Obama to win but didn't want him to win.

[resistanze]

It's not a cop out just because you say so. I'm sorry, that's just the facts of what's being arguing. I'm taking Powell's comments at face value you're not, but your position is conjecture.

I would check your facts regarding Powell endorsing Obama in 2008. He came out well before Obama won and gave several reasons why he was supporting Obama and not McCain (similarly like how he did in this article).

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Only reason anyone could endorse Obama is cause he's black!

Colin Powell's dissatisfaction with the GOP has been evident dating back to him bouncing himself from the Bush administration. He'd be endorsing the candidate who's the least like Bush regardless of the candidate's skin color.

[DMC]

It's not a cop out just because you say so. I'm sorry, that's just the facts of what's being arguing. I'm taking Powell's comments at face value you're not, but your position is conjecture.

You've totally gone s up on this issue. You have no intention of honestly answering my questions. I see no reason to even discuss this with you since you just keep arguing ad naueum.

Well before? Middle of October.

The former SoS was not required to endorse either candidate. He switched sides once he saw that Obama was probably going to win. He didn't want to be crying tears of joy without publicly showing support before hand. He's a tactician after all.

It's amazing how any of you take a politician (which he is) at face value when it suits your argument. What you haven't even begun to address is why he cried. That actually tilts the scales.

[DMC]

Only reason anyone could endorse Obama is cause he's black!

Colin Powell's dissatisfaction with the GOP has been evident dating back to him bouncing himself from the Bush administration. He'd be endorsing the candidate who's the least like Bush regardless of the candidate's skin color.

Then why did he donate the maximum amount to senator McCain's campaign in 2007?

If you cried when he won the first time, you likely did so because he's the 1st black president. He also won the peace prize for basically be elected as a black man so the wave wasn't solely isolated to Powell.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Then why did he donate the maximum amount to senator McCain's campaign in 2007?

Probably cause he thought he was getting the moderate McCain who ran in 2000, then McCain suddenly became a neo-conservative bible thumper who picked Sarah Palin as his VP.

Why do you think he left the Bush administration?

[DMC]

Probably cause he thought he was getting the moderate McCain who ran in 2000, then McCain suddenly became a neo-conservative bible thumper who picked Sarah Palin as his VP.

Why do you think he left the Bush administration?

Because Andy Card asked him to resign.

[resistanze]

Is Mid-October after the election like you stated? Did he not give reasons why he was voting for Obama in 2008, contrary to what you said?

I can believe that politicians are often dishonest without accepting your position based on conjecture. I don't have to accept Powell voted for Obama because he's black, just because politicians lie. I'm taking what he said at face value because there is no acceptable evidence that would cause me to reject his personal stated reasons for voting for a particular candidate. But you're right, this is getting silly.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Because Andy Card asked him to resign.

[DMC]

Is Mid-October after the election like you stated? Did he not give reasons why he was voting for Obama in 2008, contrary to what you said?

When you answer my question as to why he cried, we can move forward. I see you want to participate when you feel you have an upper hand.

I can believe that politicians are often dishonest without accepting your position based on conjecture. I don't have to accept Powell voted for Obama because he's black, just because politicians lie. I'm taking what he said at face value because there is no acceptable evidence that would cause me to reject his personal stated reasons for voting for a particular candidate. But you're right, this is getting silly.

Explain why he cried. You've ignored that as you cherry pick things to respond to.